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There is a way to make money from writing beyond publishing and hoping that readers will pay for your work after the fact. Most sustainable writing has never wo

by Veen 7y ago

There is a way to make money from writing beyond publishing and hoping that readers will pay for your work after the fact. Most sustainable writing has never worked on that model. Traditionally, writers were paid by publishers and it was the publishers job to extract payment from readers. Today, writers try to be both writers and publishers, and they find it extremely difficult. That's no surprise; professional publishers also find it extremely difficult to monetize their content. Writers applauded the web for disintermediating the relationship between them and their readers, but publishers had an important role to play; they promoted content and made sure that people paid for it. Blogging and expecting to be paid for it is like a developer releasing their code for free on GitHub and then expecting people to pay to use it. Some developers can build a "community" who will pay, but most will fail. However, developers do make money from people who want particular software, and writers can work on a similar model. I make a decent living ghost writing for executives and writing marketing content for tech companies. I don't write what I want or what I think is most important, but I make a living doing something I enjoy.

incompatible 7y ago
There is an alternative model for paying for things that can't be provided through market forces. Readers of Hacker News don't particularly like it, and you tend to get down-voted for suggesting it, but whatever. Things like scientific research, roads, health care (in many developed countries outside the US), education, the BBC in the UK and ABC in Australia. Yes, the government funds it. We can tie this in with a desire to do something about underemployment, by job-guarantee type government programs. On the minimum wage perhaps, but that's better than some people get now.
DoreenMichele 7y ago
I also do freelance writing for pay. That is currently the majority of my earned income. And the internet would like me know I'm immoral and ruining the internet for doing that kind of work. See this recent comment by me in reply to those accusations: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20035958 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20035958 Twenty years ago when I was homeschooling, I could find all kinds of high quality free goodies online to support that. It wasn't long before all the good stuff began disappearing. One woman who provided Italic resources removed all her free stuff from the web and became a consultant. These days, a lot of what's online is low quality and cannot be trusted because it exists to sell you something. Blogging done to draw traffic to a business site and explain to you why their product or service is superior is inherently not unbiased. Journalist us supposed to be objective and serve the good of the people. I know a lot about topics like homelessness, raising twice exceptional children and managing serious health issues with diet and lifestyle. Homeless people, parents with 2e kids and people with serious medical conditions cannot afford to pay me for my knowledge. We currently have serious social issues. I'm quite confident I know things that would provide a path forward. But I need to eat. I can't do it all for free. Me writing product descriptions so I can eat does not put any if that information out there. These are all inherently hard problems to solve in their own right. Monetization of these spaces is also inherently hard. And it's information that is on track to die with me while our social problems deepen because it isn't monetizable. The hell of it is, I don't need that much to live on. I appear to be the only woman to have ever spent time on the leader board of HN. Men here routinely tell each other "You have a lot of karma on HN. You must be very competent." No one says that about me. When I point out the discrepancy, I get attacked and dismissed as some twit obsessed with pointless, meaningless internet points. When I talk about my frustration with HN failing to be a networking opportunity for me because of my gender, I get mocked and told it doesn't work that way, never mind the overwhelming evidence that it absolutely does work that way for men who desire to use it that way. I'm not stupid. I do freelance writing. Looking to make sure I eat by doing the kind of writing people here decry as ruining the internet, and to hell with producing the kind of writing that makes it to the front page of HN doesn't begin to solve the larger issue that this article brings up: journalism itself is in crisis, which is how this misinformation spread so widely to begin with. This is a serious problem. Encouraging me to cave and just do more freelance writing only serves to keep it alive. It's a problem that has world changing consequences, and not in a good way. I'm sure you mean well and you imagine that this is just about feeding one pathetic loser. You couldn't possibly be more wrong. I'm a woman. If I get adequately fed up and decide to throw in the towel and cave to the status quo, I can marry well to escape poverty. I'm reasonably certain I would rather die for reasons that aren't especially pertinent to this discussion and that I doubt anyone here would actually understand, believe or care about. I talk about my situation as testimony to the problem space. Please don't miss the big picture here. If my problem can be addressed in a manner that moves the needle on the larger issue, that's worth something. But your advice amounts to throwing the baby out with the bathwater. I've been basically crawling naked across broken glass for about a decade. I'm flabbergasted that none of this ever really sinks in with anyone. There's always some new BS excuse to push aside the real issue and act like I'm just dumb and not trying hard enough. Which makes me feel like the world might actually be doomed. Not because it has to be, but because, wow, there is no getting through the amazingly thick skulls of a large gathering of generally intelligent and competent people. This is not "one dumb woman can't figure out money." That's not what this is about.
- Veen 7y ago
  If you regularly write comments like this, I can understand why you don't find Hacker News a useful networking opportunity. It's not Tumblr.
  - shearskill 7y ago
    And HN is not Reddit. Would you make a similarly dismissive reply to a vet who suffers from PTSD on a thread about suicide? Might want to step away from the cynicism cycle you’re in... there’s always the option to just not reply at all.
  - DoreenMichele 7y ago
    I appear to be the only woman to have ever spent time on the leader board. It's only 100 names long, but HN has been around more than a decade, so a lot more than 100 people have spent time on it. That means that less than one percent of the top ranks is openly female. This is consistent with the gender ratio suggested by this old poll: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=591309 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=591309 For comparison, 17 percent of the CEOs in the US are female. HN cannot even begin to compete with that lousy statistic. So the evidence suggests I'm some kind of amazing Wunderkind, breaking the glass ceiling and doing what no other woman can do. I'm still dirt poor. Meanwhile, some male members of the leader board are self made millionaires, in part due to their participation here. I repeat: There is always some new BS reason to dismiss me. And it is exactly that: BS. Sexism is very much alive and well on HN.

by Veen 7y ago

incompatible 7y ago

There is an alternative model for paying for things that can't be provided through market forces. Readers of Hacker News don't particularly like it, and you tend to get down-voted for suggesting it, but whatever. Things like scientific research, roads, health care (in many developed countries outside the US), education, the BBC in the UK and ABC in Australia. Yes, the government funds it. We can tie this in with a desire to do something about underemployment, by job-guarantee type government programs. On the minimum wage perhaps, but that's better than some people get now.

DoreenMichele 7y ago

I also do freelance writing for pay. That is currently the majority of my earned income. And the internet would like me know I'm immoral and ruining the internet for doing that kind of work. See this recent comment by me in reply to those accusations: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20035958 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20035958 Twenty years ago when I was homeschooling, I could find all kinds of high quality free goodies online to support that. It wasn't long before all the good stuff began disappearing. One woman who provided Italic resources removed all her free stuff from the web and became a consultant. These days, a lot of what's online is low quality and cannot be trusted because it exists to sell you something. Blogging done to draw traffic to a business site and explain to you why their product or service is superior is inherently not unbiased. Journalist us supposed to be objective and serve the good of the people. I know a lot about topics like homelessness, raising twice exceptional children and managing serious health issues with diet and lifestyle. Homeless people, parents with 2e kids and people with serious medical conditions cannot afford to pay me for my knowledge. We currently have serious social issues. I'm quite confident I know things that would provide a path forward. But I need to eat. I can't do it all for free. Me writing product descriptions so I can eat does not put any if that information out there. These are all inherently hard problems to solve in their own right. Monetization of these spaces is also inherently hard. And it's information that is on track to die with me while our social problems deepen because it isn't monetizable. The hell of it is, I don't need that much to live on. I appear to be the only woman to have ever spent time on the leader board of HN. Men here routinely tell each other "You have a lot of karma on HN. You must be very competent." No one says that about me. When I point out the discrepancy, I get attacked and dismissed as some twit obsessed with pointless, meaningless internet points. When I talk about my frustration with HN failing to be a networking opportunity for me because of my gender, I get mocked and told it doesn't work that way, never mind the overwhelming evidence that it absolutely does work that way for men who desire to use it that way. I'm not stupid. I do freelance writing. Looking to make sure I eat by doing the kind of writing people here decry as ruining the internet, and to hell with producing the kind of writing that makes it to the front page of HN doesn't begin to solve the larger issue that this article brings up: journalism itself is in crisis, which is how this misinformation spread so widely to begin with. This is a serious problem. Encouraging me to cave and just do more freelance writing only serves to keep it alive. It's a problem that has world changing consequences, and not in a good way. I'm sure you mean well and you imagine that this is just about feeding one pathetic loser. You couldn't possibly be more wrong. I'm a woman. If I get adequately fed up and decide to throw in the towel and cave to the status quo, I can marry well to escape poverty. I'm reasonably certain I would rather die for reasons that aren't especially pertinent to this discussion and that I doubt anyone here would actually understand, believe or care about. I talk about my situation as testimony to the problem space. Please don't miss the big picture here. If my problem can be addressed in a manner that moves the needle on the larger issue, that's worth something. But your advice amounts to throwing the baby out with the bathwater. I've been basically crawling naked across broken glass for about a decade. I'm flabbergasted that none of this ever really sinks in with anyone. There's always some new BS excuse to push aside the real issue and act like I'm just dumb and not trying hard enough. Which makes me feel like the world might actually be doomed. Not because it has to be, but because, wow, there is no getting through the amazingly thick skulls of a large gathering of generally intelligent and competent people. This is not "one dumb woman can't figure out money." That's not what this is about.

Veen 7y ago
If you regularly write comments like this, I can understand why you don't find Hacker News a useful networking opportunity. It's not Tumblr.
- shearskill 7y ago
  And HN is not Reddit. Would you make a similarly dismissive reply to a vet who suffers from PTSD on a thread about suicide? Might want to step away from the cynicism cycle you’re in... there’s always the option to just not reply at all.
- DoreenMichele 7y ago
  I appear to be the only woman to have ever spent time on the leader board. It's only 100 names long, but HN has been around more than a decade, so a lot more than 100 people have spent time on it. That means that less than one percent of the top ranks is openly female. This is consistent with the gender ratio suggested by this old poll: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=591309 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=591309 For comparison, 17 percent of the CEOs in the US are female. HN cannot even begin to compete with that lousy statistic. So the evidence suggests I'm some kind of amazing Wunderkind, breaking the glass ceiling and doing what no other woman can do. I'm still dirt poor. Meanwhile, some male members of the leader board are self made millionaires, in part due to their participation here. I repeat: There is always some new BS reason to dismiss me. And it is exactly that: BS. Sexism is very much alive and well on HN.