6 ms·

Kaminsky's Next Hack? Colorblindness

51 points by taylorbuley 16y ago

GrandMasterBirt 16y ago
Wow. Lots of respect here. Too bad it can't help when having to do quick glances. I like this before/after illustration: http://blogs-images.forbes.com/andygreenberg/files/2010/12/beforeafterdankam.png http://blogs-images.forbes.com/andygreenberg/files/2010/12/b... thats pretty cool because while I can see both images and the numbers in them, the second is so much more vivid.
- wccrawford 16y ago
  Seems like an idea that's overdue. I wonder how long until someone invents some glasses that refract just certain wavelengths to be a little higher? Could be very lucrative.
  - icegreentea 16y ago
    Unless I'm hideously misremembering things, air-glass-air refraction will result in the same wavelength and frequency, just a change of direction. It just seems to 'change' colours sometimes because its scattering white light.
    - wccrawford 16y ago
      I'm not claiming I know the science of these things, but I think it's just a matter of time until someone figures out how to do it. Most glasses aren't made of 'glass' now anyhow. This new technique might be ridiculously more expensive at first, but I'm sure it'll catch on. It could literally be a lifesaver for some people.
- Xuzz 16y ago
  I can't see the numbers on the left at all. I need to get this app.
jpablo 16y ago
As a colorblind myself I don't think this app is really useful. Most of the time I hardly notice that I'm missing something because of my colorblindness and when I do notice it 99% of the time it's because someone pointed it to me because they think I said something stupid (like calling a sweeter brown when it's actually green). I just can't see myself trying to view my whole life through an iPhone to see if I'm missing something..
- asimeqi 16y ago
  As a colorblind myself, I can think of at least one situation where this app might be very useful. My young daughter asks me all the time what color the objects she is interacting with are. About half the time I don't know the answer. Maybe with this app and some practice I can save myself the embarrassment. By the way, in the sample tests shown on the article, while the app allows me to easily distinguish the number in the first picture, I can barely make out the number in the second picture even after it is enhanced by the app. So maybe the app could use some improvement or the settings needed for me could be different from the default ones.
  - dakami 16y ago
    Actually, I'm exposing all the internal settings, precisely because color blindness is more of a spectrum disorder than something you either have or don't have. It's fairly rare to find someone who the second image doesn't massively help, so it'd be really cool if you could play with the hard settings. Also, HueWindow is pretty much guaranteed to work if you can see at all.
- sliverstorm 16y ago
  Perhaps this app in itself is limited, but it's a first step. What would you say to a pair of glasses that did this?
  - Vivtek 16y ago
    "Sign me up." Especially since my glasses would then be a phone.
joshu 16y ago
I saw Dan demo this at a conference a while ago. I also watched Don Knuth critique it. Fun stuff.
- taylorbuley 16y ago
  Ha! http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3168/3014911710_e31650fd3d.jpg http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3168/3014911710_e31650fd3d.jp...
  - joshu 16y ago
    same conference, different year. also that's not dan.
DaniFong 16y ago
Neat. I wanted to build this, and now I don't have to :-p
Vivtek 16y ago
That's almost reason to get a smart phone just by itself.... but I'm going to wait for the DNA hack (http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2009/09/colortherapy/ http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2009/09/colortherapy/). I don't want to have to remember to point a phone at something to distinguish colors; I want to upgrade my damn retinas.
- dakami 16y ago
  Gene therapy makes me nervous every since it killed that random kid. Looks like there's some checksumming going on?
  - Vivtek 16y ago
    Well, the kid's liver was already questionable and the immune system can really go haywire with stuff like that. And those guys circumvented the animal studies (monkeys died and they didn't feel like slowing down because they had a financial interest in a good outcome). I just want to see this damn thing you all call purple. If it really exists.
  - ZoFreX 16y ago
    Link?
    - dakami 16y ago
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesse_Gelsinger http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesse_Gelsinger
deleted 16y ago
[deleted]
jackowayed 16y ago
Related: I've jokingly said that I'm going to create a "glasses app" where you tell it your prescription number and it warps the camera's image so that you see it properly. I don't think it would be very practical, especially since I think it would be hard to make it work without dictating the exact distance from phone screen to eye and from camera to object being viewed. But it would be cool.
- dakami 16y ago
  Is this a really bad problem?
- stoney 16y ago
  I'm not sure what you mean here - is it a camera app to bring stuff into focus or is it a warped screen image to bring your phone into focus? If it's the first one then I don't think the distance from camera to object is a problem - cameras can already focus on arbitrary objects, so you can get a clear image of the target on the phone easily enough. The hard part is from phone to eye, which I'm not sure is even possible? Can you create a distorted image that looks right when viewed from a certain point by someone who's short/long sighted? I suspect you can't do it with today's displays - I think you'd need to be able to emit different images at different angles (since the angle between each pixel and my retina will be different and you don't know in advance where my eye will be relative to the screen). If your eyes have different prescriptions it's not going to work, but maybe you could set it up for one eye and just close the other (but then maybe it would be easier to hold the phone closer to/further from your face). I wish I could remember enough about optics to figure this out!
  - jackowayed 16y ago
    I am saying the former. Yeah, I guess you're right that camera-to-object distance wouldn't matter. And you're right that two eyes would be a problem. Even if they have the same prescription, I think the fact that the angle from the left eye to the screen and from the right eye to the screen would be different. It seems like a monocole should be doable, at least if I dictate that they center the phone in front of their eye and the distance from their eye to the screen. But I don't know much about optics either.

51 points by taylorbuley 16y ago

Wow. Lots of respect here. Too bad it can't help when having to do quick glances. I like this before/after illustration: http://blogs-images.forbes.com/andygreenberg/files/2010/12/beforeafterdankam.png http://blogs-images.forbes.com/andygreenberg/files/2010/12/b... thats pretty cool because while I can see both images and the numbers in them, the second is so much more vivid.

wccrawford 16y ago
Seems like an idea that's overdue. I wonder how long until someone invents some glasses that refract just certain wavelengths to be a little higher? Could be very lucrative.
- icegreentea 16y ago
  Unless I'm hideously misremembering things, air-glass-air refraction will result in the same wavelength and frequency, just a change of direction. It just seems to 'change' colours sometimes because its scattering white light.
  - wccrawford 16y ago
    I'm not claiming I know the science of these things, but I think it's just a matter of time until someone figures out how to do it. Most glasses aren't made of 'glass' now anyhow. This new technique might be ridiculously more expensive at first, but I'm sure it'll catch on. It could literally be a lifesaver for some people.
Xuzz 16y ago
I can't see the numbers on the left at all. I need to get this app.

jpablo 16y ago

As a colorblind myself I don't think this app is really useful. Most of the time I hardly notice that I'm missing something because of my colorblindness and when I do notice it 99% of the time it's because someone pointed it to me because they think I said something stupid (like calling a sweeter brown when it's actually green). I just can't see myself trying to view my whole life through an iPhone to see if I'm missing something..

asimeqi 16y ago
As a colorblind myself, I can think of at least one situation where this app might be very useful. My young daughter asks me all the time what color the objects she is interacting with are. About half the time I don't know the answer. Maybe with this app and some practice I can save myself the embarrassment. By the way, in the sample tests shown on the article, while the app allows me to easily distinguish the number in the first picture, I can barely make out the number in the second picture even after it is enhanced by the app. So maybe the app could use some improvement or the settings needed for me could be different from the default ones.
- dakami 16y ago
  Actually, I'm exposing all the internal settings, precisely because color blindness is more of a spectrum disorder than something you either have or don't have. It's fairly rare to find someone who the second image doesn't massively help, so it'd be really cool if you could play with the hard settings. Also, HueWindow is pretty much guaranteed to work if you can see at all.
sliverstorm 16y ago
Perhaps this app in itself is limited, but it's a first step. What would you say to a pair of glasses that did this?
- Vivtek 16y ago
  "Sign me up." Especially since my glasses would then be a phone.

joshu 16y ago

I saw Dan demo this at a conference a while ago. I also watched Don Knuth critique it. Fun stuff.

taylorbuley 16y ago
Ha! http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3168/3014911710_e31650fd3d.jpg http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3168/3014911710_e31650fd3d.jp...
- joshu 16y ago
  same conference, different year. also that's not dan.

DaniFong 16y ago

Neat. I wanted to build this, and now I don't have to :-p

Vivtek 16y ago

That's almost reason to get a smart phone just by itself.... but I'm going to wait for the DNA hack (http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2009/09/colortherapy/ http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2009/09/colortherapy/). I don't want to have to remember to point a phone at something to distinguish colors; I want to upgrade my damn retinas.

dakami 16y ago
Gene therapy makes me nervous every since it killed that random kid. Looks like there's some checksumming going on?
- Vivtek 16y ago
  Well, the kid's liver was already questionable and the immune system can really go haywire with stuff like that. And those guys circumvented the animal studies (monkeys died and they didn't feel like slowing down because they had a financial interest in a good outcome). I just want to see this damn thing you all call purple. If it really exists.
- ZoFreX 16y ago
  Link?
  - dakami 16y ago
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesse_Gelsinger http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesse_Gelsinger

deleted 16y ago

[deleted]

jackowayed 16y ago

Related: I've jokingly said that I'm going to create a "glasses app" where you tell it your prescription number and it warps the camera's image so that you see it properly. I don't think it would be very practical, especially since I think it would be hard to make it work without dictating the exact distance from phone screen to eye and from camera to object being viewed. But it would be cool.

dakami 16y ago
Is this a really bad problem?
stoney 16y ago
I'm not sure what you mean here - is it a camera app to bring stuff into focus or is it a warped screen image to bring your phone into focus? If it's the first one then I don't think the distance from camera to object is a problem - cameras can already focus on arbitrary objects, so you can get a clear image of the target on the phone easily enough. The hard part is from phone to eye, which I'm not sure is even possible? Can you create a distorted image that looks right when viewed from a certain point by someone who's short/long sighted? I suspect you can't do it with today's displays - I think you'd need to be able to emit different images at different angles (since the angle between each pixel and my retina will be different and you don't know in advance where my eye will be relative to the screen). If your eyes have different prescriptions it's not going to work, but maybe you could set it up for one eye and just close the other (but then maybe it would be easier to hold the phone closer to/further from your face). I wish I could remember enough about optics to figure this out!
- jackowayed 16y ago
  I am saying the former. Yeah, I guess you're right that camera-to-object distance wouldn't matter. And you're right that two eyes would be a problem. Even if they have the same prescription, I think the fact that the angle from the left eye to the screen and from the right eye to the screen would be different. It seems like a monocole should be doable, at least if I dictate that they center the phone in front of their eye and the distance from their eye to the screen. But I don't know much about optics either.