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We are unhappy with our wants, because we are being overpromised on how much happiness those wants will deliver. Advertising and politicians are probably the wo

We are unhappy with our wants, because we are being overpromised on how much happiness those wants will deliver. Advertising and politicians are probably the worst offenders here. We desire and pursue certain wants (big house, luxurious car, tropical vacation) only to later get disappointed with their quality and utility once we have them. Then we report in the form that we are unhappy because we don’t use the two extra bedrooms that cost extra to heat, that luxurious car costs fortune in insurance and fuel, and the tropical vacation turned out to be a nightmare with roaches, bedbugs and salmonella outbreak.

behnamoh 7y ago
I've always wondered whether we should pursue what we want or what we need. For a long time I had no definite answer, but then I realized pursuing what we need is more important. In fact, this comes in part from this understanding that there's no good or bad, rather there are things that make us happy and things that make us sad. These are not always consistent though. For example, we might get sad at something which later we find out was - based on rational and logical considerations - actually a good thing, or become happy at something which is in fact a bad thing. Our "wants" promise us "happiness", but the joy we get from that is most likely short-term. On the other hand, pursuing our "needs" brings about "good" things in our lives, the joy of which is more long-term. And while getting what we need doesn't necessarily makes us happy, not getting it does in fact make us sad. Two problems exist though: (1) while we think we know what we want, we might in fact have no clue as to what we really want, thus always follow wrong leads; (2) we can only know what we need after we have achieved it. It takes a lot of self-knowledge to really figure out "where we are supposed to be", "what we are supposed to do", and "when". The answers to these questions tell us what we actually "need". Example: a person with talents in music but interested in math (in which he/she is only mediocre) is better off pursuing music as that is what he/she needs to do. What he/she wants to do is however, math. You tell me: wouldn't pursuing a dead-end job in math bring about an interminable series of sadness where the person realizes he/she can never be among the top math geniuses?
- cgriswald 7y ago
  You kind of touched on points of this video, although from a different direction. Daniel Khaneman talks about the experiencing self versus the remembering self, which is in charge, and how that relates to happiness. https://youtu.be/XgRlrBl-7Yg https://youtu.be/XgRlrBl-7Yg
mmsimanga 7y ago
On the career front I know many people who want to be in management but I doubt they know that management is not just a bigger salary and bossing people around. You often find yourself caught between executives and your team. Some then cry fowl because they feel they not getting respect they deserve and happiness is elusive.
- sharkweek 7y ago
  Ex manager here who now independently consults with no employees (although sometimes I manage a small pool of contractors when work gets a little hectic). I thought I wanted to move up the chain, until I found myself with a team of ~10 people, some of them managing people below them. Completely miserable. I didn’t have much control over salary policies or promotions so I basically played middle person. What I learned is that it was my job to extract as much possible work out of my team at their current salaries without them quitting. Twice being told, “they’ll get raises soon, don’t worry!” Those raises never came, the company restructured, a bunch of us lost our jobs, and I never took on a direct manager role again.
  - yelloweyes 7y ago
    Learned this shit when my parents and teachers always pushing me to be whatever a "leader" is when you're 8 years old. Fucking horrible shit. I'll never be a leader/manager again in my life. Having to deal with a million different opinions and when something goes wrong it's all your fault.
    - hurrdurr2 7y ago
      Yeah, in middle management here... it's pretty much playing Malcolm in the middle. Also totally true on the "shit goes wrong it's all your fault" point.
theturtletalks 7y ago
I think it boils down to the rate of diminishing returns. A new house, car, and even a great vacation make you feel good, but it fades after a while. What really brings people happiness is novelty and as that fades, so does the happiness. True happiness comes with contentment, but that’s easier said than done.
- toomuchtodo 7y ago
  Find joy in what you have, but also in the experience of striving for more with the understanding that failure is always an option. Compare yourself only to who you were yesterday, no one else.
- mmsimanga 7y ago
  I once read a great comment on HN when a similar topic came up (I cannot find the comment). In short, a guy in Australia struck it rich. Turned his ranch into a tropical island like set up. After some time got fed up and went to live on a real tropical island. A couple of years later he was back in Australia tired of the island lifestyle. The point of the post was that variety is probably what keeps us happy. Too much of one thing and most of us get bored.
- vagab0nd 7y ago
  This makes me think: is sustained happiness even possible? I certainly haven't experienced it myself. Given limited resource and time, I find it really hard to meet that goal.
alexashka 7y ago
Humans are not made to be happy. That's the one and only 'disappointment' to tattoo onto your brain, so that you don't spend your life thinking a utopia aka engineering happiness is possible or a good idea. People are 'unhappy' because they're not at the top of the social hierarchy. The people at the top are not happy because everyone wants a piece of them and they get no peace. It's all bullshit. Just live your life. Only my opinion of course :)
- sbayeta 7y ago
  I think your opinion is mostly right
- magpi3 7y ago
  I had a friend with a wonderful yearbook quote: "The secret to happiness is contentment." Pretty wise for an 18 year old.
- fopen64 7y ago
  Humans need purpose not happiness
- didericis 7y ago
  I think the social hierarchy thing is less about being on top and more about being a fundamentally important character in a larger story. I don't think it's unreasonable to think that theoretically there's some arrangement in which everyone could feel as though they're exactly where they should be, and are playing exactly the role they should within that story. Not a supporting role, or a subservient role, but a role which was really THEM. People don't want to be a pawn in somebody else's game in order to be respected. How exactly you get there is totally beyond me, and I'm not entirely sure how to articulate what I mean by "story". But I think you lose something when you give up on trying to engineer stories with happy endings. I don't think you can really live your life fully unless you have some sort of hope for the future.
- ImprovedSilence 7y ago
  I have a different out take. I try to always be happy, choose it, it’s an attitude. Let the little things make you happy. A joke amount friends, a smile, A tasty ice cream cone, whatever, “live in the moment” But never be satisfied, always strive for a little more. That’s human nature. The trick is to strive for growth, and it doesn’t have to be for material things. Strive to lean more, to grow your career, to save up or budget for that thing you want, or to travel to that place. Never stop exploring. That’s the key. You gotta channel that strive for something that won’t leave u empty when u get there, and realize that voice is always gonna be in the back of your head saying, “well now what do I want”
megaremote 7y ago
> because we are being overpromised on how much happiness those wants will deliver. How can we be over promised when it is only us who can determine how much happiness we get out of stuff we buy?
- ionised 7y ago
  Advertising likes to determine that for us, and people are easily manipulated by it.
seem_2211 7y ago
I don't think happiness is caused by (or diminished upon) on material goods. I also don't think material goods are objectively good or bad (although I have certainly bought things that actively make me happier). Happiness is an eternal conflict between what we have, what we think we should have and what we see others having. Even if you're at the top of the totem pole, happiness isn't guaranteed - where's the joy of having everything, only to see others struggling?
agumonkey 7y ago
advertising is also ultra efficient at pulling all possible string to make you think "YOU" want something, even though it's barely pavlovian reflex and emotional traps to make you open your wallet.
keypusher 7y ago
This is nothing new and it is not unique to modern advertising or politics. Important philosophical and theological texts going back to ancient times are very clear on how unfulfilling material desires ultimately are. To make it even worse, our own desires are terrible predictors of what will make us happy. Lessons from psychology abound. Winning the lottery often ruins peoples lives. Couples in arranged marriages report similar satisfaction to those with chosen partners. When presented with more choices, we are less happy with our final decision. The deeper you dig, the “worse” it gets. > To understand the limitation of things, desire them. - Lao Tzu, Tao Te Ching

behnamoh 7y ago

I've always wondered whether we should pursue what we want or what we need. For a long time I had no definite answer, but then I realized pursuing what we need is more important. In fact, this comes in part from this understanding that there's no good or bad, rather there are things that make us happy and things that make us sad. These are not always consistent though. For example, we might get sad at something which later we find out was - based on rational and logical considerations - actually a good thing, or become happy at something which is in fact a bad thing. Our "wants" promise us "happiness", but the joy we get from that is most likely short-term. On the other hand, pursuing our "needs" brings about "good" things in our lives, the joy of which is more long-term. And while getting what we need doesn't necessarily makes us happy, not getting it does in fact make us sad. Two problems exist though: (1) while we think we know what we want, we might in fact have no clue as to what we really want, thus always follow wrong leads; (2) we can only know what we need after we have achieved it. It takes a lot of self-knowledge to really figure out "where we are supposed to be", "what we are supposed to do", and "when". The answers to these questions tell us what we actually "need". Example: a person with talents in music but interested in math (in which he/she is only mediocre) is better off pursuing music as that is what he/she needs to do. What he/she wants to do is however, math. You tell me: wouldn't pursuing a dead-end job in math bring about an interminable series of sadness where the person realizes he/she can never be among the top math geniuses?

cgriswald 7y ago
You kind of touched on points of this video, although from a different direction. Daniel Khaneman talks about the experiencing self versus the remembering self, which is in charge, and how that relates to happiness. https://youtu.be/XgRlrBl-7Yg https://youtu.be/XgRlrBl-7Yg

mmsimanga 7y ago

On the career front I know many people who want to be in management but I doubt they know that management is not just a bigger salary and bossing people around. You often find yourself caught between executives and your team. Some then cry fowl because they feel they not getting respect they deserve and happiness is elusive.

sharkweek 7y ago
Ex manager here who now independently consults with no employees (although sometimes I manage a small pool of contractors when work gets a little hectic). I thought I wanted to move up the chain, until I found myself with a team of ~10 people, some of them managing people below them. Completely miserable. I didn’t have much control over salary policies or promotions so I basically played middle person. What I learned is that it was my job to extract as much possible work out of my team at their current salaries without them quitting. Twice being told, “they’ll get raises soon, don’t worry!” Those raises never came, the company restructured, a bunch of us lost our jobs, and I never took on a direct manager role again.
- yelloweyes 7y ago
  Learned this shit when my parents and teachers always pushing me to be whatever a "leader" is when you're 8 years old. Fucking horrible shit. I'll never be a leader/manager again in my life. Having to deal with a million different opinions and when something goes wrong it's all your fault.
  - hurrdurr2 7y ago
    Yeah, in middle management here... it's pretty much playing Malcolm in the middle. Also totally true on the "shit goes wrong it's all your fault" point.

theturtletalks 7y ago

I think it boils down to the rate of diminishing returns. A new house, car, and even a great vacation make you feel good, but it fades after a while. What really brings people happiness is novelty and as that fades, so does the happiness. True happiness comes with contentment, but that’s easier said than done.

toomuchtodo 7y ago
Find joy in what you have, but also in the experience of striving for more with the understanding that failure is always an option. Compare yourself only to who you were yesterday, no one else.
mmsimanga 7y ago
I once read a great comment on HN when a similar topic came up (I cannot find the comment). In short, a guy in Australia struck it rich. Turned his ranch into a tropical island like set up. After some time got fed up and went to live on a real tropical island. A couple of years later he was back in Australia tired of the island lifestyle. The point of the post was that variety is probably what keeps us happy. Too much of one thing and most of us get bored.
vagab0nd 7y ago
This makes me think: is sustained happiness even possible? I certainly haven't experienced it myself. Given limited resource and time, I find it really hard to meet that goal.

alexashka 7y ago

Humans are not made to be happy. That's the one and only 'disappointment' to tattoo onto your brain, so that you don't spend your life thinking a utopia aka engineering happiness is possible or a good idea. People are 'unhappy' because they're not at the top of the social hierarchy. The people at the top are not happy because everyone wants a piece of them and they get no peace. It's all bullshit. Just live your life. Only my opinion of course :)

sbayeta 7y ago
I think your opinion is mostly right
magpi3 7y ago
I had a friend with a wonderful yearbook quote: "The secret to happiness is contentment." Pretty wise for an 18 year old.
fopen64 7y ago
Humans need purpose not happiness
didericis 7y ago
I think the social hierarchy thing is less about being on top and more about being a fundamentally important character in a larger story. I don't think it's unreasonable to think that theoretically there's some arrangement in which everyone could feel as though they're exactly where they should be, and are playing exactly the role they should within that story. Not a supporting role, or a subservient role, but a role which was really THEM. People don't want to be a pawn in somebody else's game in order to be respected. How exactly you get there is totally beyond me, and I'm not entirely sure how to articulate what I mean by "story". But I think you lose something when you give up on trying to engineer stories with happy endings. I don't think you can really live your life fully unless you have some sort of hope for the future.
ImprovedSilence 7y ago
I have a different out take. I try to always be happy, choose it, it’s an attitude. Let the little things make you happy. A joke amount friends, a smile, A tasty ice cream cone, whatever, “live in the moment” But never be satisfied, always strive for a little more. That’s human nature. The trick is to strive for growth, and it doesn’t have to be for material things. Strive to lean more, to grow your career, to save up or budget for that thing you want, or to travel to that place. Never stop exploring. That’s the key. You gotta channel that strive for something that won’t leave u empty when u get there, and realize that voice is always gonna be in the back of your head saying, “well now what do I want”

megaremote 7y ago

> because we are being overpromised on how much happiness those wants will deliver. How can we be over promised when it is only us who can determine how much happiness we get out of stuff we buy?

ionised 7y ago
Advertising likes to determine that for us, and people are easily manipulated by it.

seem_2211 7y ago

I don't think happiness is caused by (or diminished upon) on material goods. I also don't think material goods are objectively good or bad (although I have certainly bought things that actively make me happier). Happiness is an eternal conflict between what we have, what we think we should have and what we see others having. Even if you're at the top of the totem pole, happiness isn't guaranteed - where's the joy of having everything, only to see others struggling?

agumonkey 7y ago

advertising is also ultra efficient at pulling all possible string to make you think "YOU" want something, even though it's barely pavlovian reflex and emotional traps to make you open your wallet.

keypusher 7y ago

This is nothing new and it is not unique to modern advertising or politics. Important philosophical and theological texts going back to ancient times are very clear on how unfulfilling material desires ultimately are. To make it even worse, our own desires are terrible predictors of what will make us happy. Lessons from psychology abound. Winning the lottery often ruins peoples lives. Couples in arranged marriages report similar satisfaction to those with chosen partners. When presented with more choices, we are less happy with our final decision. The deeper you dig, the “worse” it gets. > To understand the limitation of things, desire them. - Lao Tzu, Tao Te Ching