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The Chinese government can order Huawei to do basically whatever it wants, and the former has so far shown no qualms about doing as much espionage, corporate or

by _bxg1 7y ago

The Chinese government can order Huawei to do basically whatever it wants, and the former has so far shown no qualms about doing as much espionage, corporate or otherwise, as it can get away with. Infrastructure is one threat, smartphones are another.

DocTomoe 7y ago
In all fairness, I have still to see any tangible evidence of this actually having happened. NSA-Backdoored Cisco Routers, on the other hand, are well-documented.
- _bxg1 7y ago
  There's plenty of evidence of hacking and corporate espionage; that was what prompted the trade war in the first place. I don't know what public evidence there is about Huawei specifically, but I think it's naive to assume they're an exception.
  - fabianhjr 7y ago
    The trade war started as a mercantilist-spat[1] and the targeted attack on Huawei for perceived "economic loss" as the biggest global south smartphone manufacturer that was due to surpass Apple is clear as day. Additionally any critical US infrastructure was already barred from acquiring ZTE/Huawei cell towers/5G access points. [1]: https://reason.com/2019/05/15/trumps-malignant-mercantilism/ https://reason.com/2019/05/15/trumps-malignant-mercantilism/
em500 7y ago
It appears now that the US government can order Google, Qualcomm, Intel, and even non-US companies like ARM to do basically whatever it wants, and has shown no qualms in the past about spying on their European allies. From the a non-American POV the US does not have a clear moral high ground.
- zanny 7y ago
  No villain wants to be the victim of another villain.
- noelsusman 7y ago
  Every government can order any company in their country to do whatever it wants. That's fundamentally how government works.
- freehunter 7y ago
  You're assuming the US government cares if a non-American thinks it has the moral high ground. I would be shocked if any decision maker ever considered that before making a decision.
  - jessaustin 7y ago
    ...non-American... You don't need this qualifier. Our leaders don't care about the opinions of us, their subjects, either.
- tekkk 7y ago
  So which one you'd rather have spying you, China or US? While it's easy to mock US for doing bad things, at least as European they share a common cultural heritage. And yes, while they spy on their allies they are still allies with many European nations and their military support serves as a core pillar for many European nations' foreign policies. China on the other hand, isn't allied with any European nations and seems to actively undermine freedom of speech and to suppress its citizens. Social credit score sounds good to you? So in the context of all things, yes US does still have a moral high ground. But I admit they surely could do a better job.
  - _s 7y ago
    Well ... depending on where you are in the US, certain officials and municipalities are already doing exactly what you describe, while many would openly like to do so except that some pesky laws and constitutional rights seem to be in the way. Let's not even get into the US's treatment of foreign nations and governments. One man's freedom fighter, another man's terrorist. There is no "moral high ground" between the two; you're just choosing which evil you are more comfortable with.
hahan_may 7y ago
So can U.S. government to U.S. companies. In the end, it boils down to the question in whom you have less distrust. Most people(in the world) will still side with U.S. no matter how they appear to be anti-american.

by _bxg1 7y ago

DocTomoe 7y ago

In all fairness, I have still to see any tangible evidence of this actually having happened. NSA-Backdoored Cisco Routers, on the other hand, are well-documented.

_bxg1 7y ago
There's plenty of evidence of hacking and corporate espionage; that was what prompted the trade war in the first place. I don't know what public evidence there is about Huawei specifically, but I think it's naive to assume they're an exception.
- fabianhjr 7y ago
  The trade war started as a mercantilist-spat[1] and the targeted attack on Huawei for perceived "economic loss" as the biggest global south smartphone manufacturer that was due to surpass Apple is clear as day. Additionally any critical US infrastructure was already barred from acquiring ZTE/Huawei cell towers/5G access points. [1]: https://reason.com/2019/05/15/trumps-malignant-mercantilism/ https://reason.com/2019/05/15/trumps-malignant-mercantilism/

em500 7y ago

It appears now that the US government can order Google, Qualcomm, Intel, and even non-US companies like ARM to do basically whatever it wants, and has shown no qualms in the past about spying on their European allies. From the a non-American POV the US does not have a clear moral high ground.

zanny 7y ago
No villain wants to be the victim of another villain.
noelsusman 7y ago
Every government can order any company in their country to do whatever it wants. That's fundamentally how government works.
freehunter 7y ago
You're assuming the US government cares if a non-American thinks it has the moral high ground. I would be shocked if any decision maker ever considered that before making a decision.
- jessaustin 7y ago
  ...non-American... You don't need this qualifier. Our leaders don't care about the opinions of us, their subjects, either.
tekkk 7y ago
So which one you'd rather have spying you, China or US? While it's easy to mock US for doing bad things, at least as European they share a common cultural heritage. And yes, while they spy on their allies they are still allies with many European nations and their military support serves as a core pillar for many European nations' foreign policies. China on the other hand, isn't allied with any European nations and seems to actively undermine freedom of speech and to suppress its citizens. Social credit score sounds good to you? So in the context of all things, yes US does still have a moral high ground. But I admit they surely could do a better job.
- _s 7y ago
  Well ... depending on where you are in the US, certain officials and municipalities are already doing exactly what you describe, while many would openly like to do so except that some pesky laws and constitutional rights seem to be in the way. Let's not even get into the US's treatment of foreign nations and governments. One man's freedom fighter, another man's terrorist. There is no "moral high ground" between the two; you're just choosing which evil you are more comfortable with.

hahan_may 7y ago

So can U.S. government to U.S. companies. In the end, it boils down to the question in whom you have less distrust. Most people(in the world) will still side with U.S. no matter how they appear to be anti-american.