5 ms·

US State Department begins social media screening for nearly all visa applicants

54 points by DVassallo 7y ago

axaxs 7y ago
My wife mentioned this to me yesterday, and I laughed and said I guess it wouldn't have affected me anyways as I don't really do much social media (unless you count this as social media). Now I'm beginning to wonder if they'll assume you're lying if you said that, or somehow more suspicious...
- sambull 7y ago
  Sounds like currently more of a black box to deny anyone a VISA that can't remember every website they signed up for in the last 5 years.
  - mdanger007 7y ago
    If you put "RT ≠ Endorsement" on your profile, you should be safe.
  - astronautjones 7y ago
    like so many other laws, it will be selectively used mostly on certain ethnicities/groups
- PeterStuer 7y ago
  It is worse. You can laugh until you realize that absence from social media is perceived as highly suspicious.
  - sys_64738 7y ago
    Would you immediately be rejected for the visa if you don't have a Facebook page?
- ganeshkrishnan 7y ago
  Yes, your application will be flagged. I just commented above on how my toddler's application was flagged due to lack of social media profiles. The only saving grace is that they don't/can't verify that you really own the social media profile. You can just put in Mark Zuckerberg's profile and apply
Swizec 7y ago
I used my social media as a supporting argument for an O1 ama. That said, requiring it for everyone seems heavy handed and feels wrong. I can’t quite put into words why, however. And I bet most people who have not dealt with visas will just say “Well if you have nothing to hide ...”
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
GarMan 7y ago
I can’t tell if coming through with a B1 or B2 with globs entry is included in this.
_iyig 7y ago
I think there’s likely a reasonable expectation of privacy somewhere, such as for private posts or protected tweets (which the measures FTA would not necessarily examine). At the same time, if someone’s sharing their support for ISIS on Facebook, I sure hope authorities would take notice and act accordingly.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
curiousgal 7y ago
This is what happens when you believe you're the greatest country in the world and that anyone trying to visit is up to no good and just wants to overstay their visa and take advantage of your amazing system. The reality couldn't be any further from that!
- ccrush 7y ago
  If the reality couldn't be further from that, how do you explain that nearly everyone in the world thst wants a better life comes to the United States?
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
  - graeme 7y ago
    Do you have any numbers to support your statement? I just looked up migration stats from the UN, and found: 1. The vast bulk of migrants do not go to the US 2. International share of migrants has grown much faster than the US share The US has a large overall number of immigrants as it is a large country, but per capita many countries are taking in more. Canada takes in about 3x per capita for example.
    - jeena 7y ago
      Here is a nice info-graphic about it: https://www.forbes.com/sites/niallmccarthy/2017/04/03/lebanon-still-has-hosts-the-most-refugees-per-capita-by-far-infographic/#62c26eee3970 https://www.forbes.com/sites/niallmccarthy/2017/04/03/lebano...
  - PeterStuer 7y ago
    'Everyone in the world' does not. That you think that shows your incredible myopic bias.
  - jeena 7y ago
    That is what basically every country says about themselves: - https://www.welt.de/politik/ausland/article177733806/Neue-EU-Migrationsstatistik-Die-meisten-Asylsuchenden-kommen-nach-Deutschland.html https://www.welt.de/politik/ausland/article177733806/Neue-EU... - https://www.metro.se/artikel/nej-eu-planerar-inte-att-placera-440-miljoner-flyktingar-i-sverige https://www.metro.se/artikel/nej-eu-planerar-inte-att-placer...
mavelikara 7y ago
> Yesterday the U.S. State Department began implementing its requirement that nearly all U.S. visa applicants submit their social media usernames, previous email addresses and phone numbers as part of the application process. > These new obstacles to immigration come at a time ... If I understand this correctly, these are not obstacles to just immigrate to USA; these are obstacles for visiting USA.
- ganeshkrishnan 7y ago
  these are not obstacles for visiting USA; these are obstacles even if you are just transiting through USA.
DVassallo 7y ago
"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated..." — The United States Bill of Rights "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all [people] are created equal..." — The United States Declaration of Independence
- JetSpiegel 7y ago
  The people applying are not citizens, so ʾthe people' doesn't mean those particular people.
pmoriarty 7y ago
Expect tit-for-tat responses from other countries for Americans trying to visit them.
dang 7y ago
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20065142 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20065142
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
burtonator 7y ago
"Sure.. check out my blog. lemonparty.org" ... actually. We should/could setup a group collaboration site on a different shock URL that's close to this which would have plausible deniability if you gave them the shock URL. "OMG! I mean lemonparties.org.. not lemonparty.org... WTF"
microcolonel 7y ago
I wonder if not having any social media presence would be a problem; I think that would be the more insidiuous thing. Social media posts are, effectively, publications; whether they tell you it's policy or not, it's likely that they would (and perhaps should) look. My main concern is that they would be suspicious of people who don't publish their every thought on the internet.
ganeshkrishnan 7y ago
An interesting anecdote: Even if you are transiting through US you need a transit visa. So we were flying from Australia to Canada with a change of planes in US and we had to get an ESTA visa. The visa application requires you to enter social media profiles for major platforms including facebook, twitter etc but there is no way for them to verify it's really yours. We did fill up ours but for my two year old toddler I just marked as no social media profile. The lack of social media profile on one of the application meant the whole application was flagged delaying our ESTA. I would have assumed that the system would have a check to allow no social media for people younger than 13 (or 16)
- vinni2 7y ago
  I had no problem getting ESTA approved without mentioning any social media accounts within an hour!
PeterStuer 7y ago
They already have access to 100% of social media. This is just to have a plausibly official second source.
voidwtf 7y ago
IMO this is how social media ends itself. As real world consequences become less distant and people have to be more ‘politically correct’ where being ‘politically correct’ is a function of which political party is currently in charge, people will use social media less and less. Social media will just become another outlet for ‘mainstream media’ and sycophants. It’s been difficult to see anything positive in the social media sphere lately. I closed my Facebook account nearly 5 years ago because it just felt like a toxic influence. My reddit account nearly 6 years ago met the same fate. These days I can only stand using Discord and WhatsApp for conversations with people I know IRL. I can’t imagine my kids ever being interested in most social media sites as they’ve already skipped most social media services to talk to their friends directly in video games like Minecraft and Roblox and using iMessage in group conversations.
- oliwarner 7y ago
  Or, this is how Facebook replaces US Customs and Border Protection. I reckon Facebook could do a pretty good job at that. Deep network checks, location history, call logs, content history (if they're active on the sites you browse). Terrifying but through. Makes the NSA look like a nosey neighbour peeping over the fence.

54 points by DVassallo 7y ago

My wife mentioned this to me yesterday, and I laughed and said I guess it wouldn't have affected me anyways as I don't really do much social media (unless you count this as social media). Now I'm beginning to wonder if they'll assume you're lying if you said that, or somehow more suspicious...

sambull 7y ago
Sounds like currently more of a black box to deny anyone a VISA that can't remember every website they signed up for in the last 5 years.
- mdanger007 7y ago
  If you put "RT ≠ Endorsement" on your profile, you should be safe.
- astronautjones 7y ago
  like so many other laws, it will be selectively used mostly on certain ethnicities/groups
PeterStuer 7y ago
It is worse. You can laugh until you realize that absence from social media is perceived as highly suspicious.
- sys_64738 7y ago
  Would you immediately be rejected for the visa if you don't have a Facebook page?
ganeshkrishnan 7y ago
Yes, your application will be flagged. I just commented above on how my toddler's application was flagged due to lack of social media profiles. The only saving grace is that they don't/can't verify that you really own the social media profile. You can just put in Mark Zuckerberg's profile and apply

Swizec 7y ago

I used my social media as a supporting argument for an O1 ama. That said, requiring it for everyone seems heavy handed and feels wrong. I can’t quite put into words why, however. And I bet most people who have not dealt with visas will just say “Well if you have nothing to hide ...”

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]

GarMan 7y ago

I can’t tell if coming through with a B1 or B2 with globs entry is included in this.

_iyig 7y ago

I think there’s likely a reasonable expectation of privacy somewhere, such as for private posts or protected tweets (which the measures FTA would not necessarily examine). At the same time, if someone’s sharing their support for ISIS on Facebook, I sure hope authorities would take notice and act accordingly.

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]

curiousgal 7y ago

This is what happens when you believe you're the greatest country in the world and that anyone trying to visit is up to no good and just wants to overstay their visa and take advantage of your amazing system. The reality couldn't be any further from that!

ccrush 7y ago
If the reality couldn't be further from that, how do you explain that nearly everyone in the world thst wants a better life comes to the United States?
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- graeme 7y ago
  Do you have any numbers to support your statement? I just looked up migration stats from the UN, and found: 1. The vast bulk of migrants do not go to the US 2. International share of migrants has grown much faster than the US share The US has a large overall number of immigrants as it is a large country, but per capita many countries are taking in more. Canada takes in about 3x per capita for example.
  - jeena 7y ago
    Here is a nice info-graphic about it: https://www.forbes.com/sites/niallmccarthy/2017/04/03/lebanon-still-has-hosts-the-most-refugees-per-capita-by-far-infographic/#62c26eee3970 https://www.forbes.com/sites/niallmccarthy/2017/04/03/lebano...
- PeterStuer 7y ago
  'Everyone in the world' does not. That you think that shows your incredible myopic bias.
- jeena 7y ago
  That is what basically every country says about themselves: - https://www.welt.de/politik/ausland/article177733806/Neue-EU-Migrationsstatistik-Die-meisten-Asylsuchenden-kommen-nach-Deutschland.html https://www.welt.de/politik/ausland/article177733806/Neue-EU... - https://www.metro.se/artikel/nej-eu-planerar-inte-att-placera-440-miljoner-flyktingar-i-sverige https://www.metro.se/artikel/nej-eu-planerar-inte-att-placer...

mavelikara 7y ago

> Yesterday the U.S. State Department began implementing its requirement that nearly all U.S. visa applicants submit their social media usernames, previous email addresses and phone numbers as part of the application process. > These new obstacles to immigration come at a time ... If I understand this correctly, these are not obstacles to just immigrate to USA; these are obstacles for visiting USA.

ganeshkrishnan 7y ago
these are not obstacles for visiting USA; these are obstacles even if you are just transiting through USA.

DVassallo 7y ago

"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated..." — The United States Bill of Rights "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all [people] are created equal..." — The United States Declaration of Independence

JetSpiegel 7y ago
The people applying are not citizens, so ʾthe people' doesn't mean those particular people.

pmoriarty 7y ago

Expect tit-for-tat responses from other countries for Americans trying to visit them.

dang 7y ago

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20065142 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20065142

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]

burtonator 7y ago

"Sure.. check out my blog. lemonparty.org" ... actually. We should/could setup a group collaboration site on a different shock URL that's close to this which would have plausible deniability if you gave them the shock URL. "OMG! I mean lemonparties.org.. not lemonparty.org... WTF"

microcolonel 7y ago

I wonder if not having any social media presence would be a problem; I think that would be the more insidiuous thing. Social media posts are, effectively, publications; whether they tell you it's policy or not, it's likely that they would (and perhaps should) look. My main concern is that they would be suspicious of people who don't publish their every thought on the internet.

ganeshkrishnan 7y ago

An interesting anecdote: Even if you are transiting through US you need a transit visa. So we were flying from Australia to Canada with a change of planes in US and we had to get an ESTA visa. The visa application requires you to enter social media profiles for major platforms including facebook, twitter etc but there is no way for them to verify it's really yours. We did fill up ours but for my two year old toddler I just marked as no social media profile. The lack of social media profile on one of the application meant the whole application was flagged delaying our ESTA. I would have assumed that the system would have a check to allow no social media for people younger than 13 (or 16)

vinni2 7y ago
I had no problem getting ESTA approved without mentioning any social media accounts within an hour!

PeterStuer 7y ago

They already have access to 100% of social media. This is just to have a plausibly official second source.

voidwtf 7y ago

IMO this is how social media ends itself. As real world consequences become less distant and people have to be more ‘politically correct’ where being ‘politically correct’ is a function of which political party is currently in charge, people will use social media less and less. Social media will just become another outlet for ‘mainstream media’ and sycophants. It’s been difficult to see anything positive in the social media sphere lately. I closed my Facebook account nearly 5 years ago because it just felt like a toxic influence. My reddit account nearly 6 years ago met the same fate. These days I can only stand using Discord and WhatsApp for conversations with people I know IRL. I can’t imagine my kids ever being interested in most social media sites as they’ve already skipped most social media services to talk to their friends directly in video games like Minecraft and Roblox and using iMessage in group conversations.

oliwarner 7y ago
Or, this is how Facebook replaces US Customs and Border Protection. I reckon Facebook could do a pretty good job at that. Deep network checks, location history, call logs, content history (if they're active on the sites you browse). Terrifying but through. Makes the NSA look like a nosey neighbour peeping over the fence.