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I fail to understand why we should trust apple. By default, we don't really own the device; we rent it from them at purchase prices. I cannot run my own progr

I fail to understand why we should trust apple. By default, we don't really own the device; we rent it from them at purchase prices. I cannot run my own programs. I cannot add my own app store. I cannot do anything unless Apple has explicitly allowed it. And combined with https://variety.com/2019/digital/news/apple-itunes-privacy-lawsuit-1203226708/ https://variety.com/2019/digital/news/apple-itunes-privacy-l... Shows they are willing and able to get in the pool with Google, Amazon, and Facebook. Trust is when I have power, and grant you some of the power because you are a good steward. In this case, Apple has all the power. And they don't trust you with any.

bilbo0s 7y ago
Yeah, but that lawsuit is bogus. Apple gives developers access to my data only if I click to allow that developer access to my data. Which I, personally, almost never do. But if you do that, then yeah, that developer can take your data and do whatever he wants with it. Which is why you shouldn't do that. You're right about one thing though, and that is Apple not trusting me with most powers. They don't trust me, or anyone else with power. I like that stance. I think that should be the default stance of every company that deals with user data. No one gets access to it without the expressed consent of the user. If you're saying that Apple is giving out your data willy nilly the way FB or Google does, you're just wrong. Now of course, that's a completely different issue than trusting Apple. You should trust no one. And neither should Apple. (To be completely frank, Apple shouldn't even trust you.) What people like about Apple is that they hold up their end of the bargain. They trust no one.
- justinjlynn 7y ago
  Apple will trust whomever offers them more economic advantage in the long term if they need to be open about the relationship - and short term if they don't and don't think it's too much of a reputational risk. However, never think that you'll always be the one providing them the economic advantage forever - just note that, they'll most likely keep your data forever. Choose wisely.
asdkhadsj 7y ago
> I fail to understand why we should trust apple. I don't think anyone says we should. Do I trust apple? No. Do I trust apple more than google or facebook? Yes. It's all a balance of QoL features we personally want. I heavily enjoy the features and hardware of Apple. Yes, there are downsides. I left my vast Google ecosystem for Apple, not because Apple is perfect, but because they appeared better. Sure, I could throw away my watch, change to linux, get a flip phone (because I don't want to use hand-downs from Google's OS), but Apple is where I chose to draw my line between privacy and convenience.
- monksy 7y ago
  > Do I trust apple more than google or facebook? Yes. Why? They also have cloud services.
  - asdkhadsj 7y ago
    Sure, but if you wanted the features and had to pick a provider, which would you choose? You wouldn't choose Facebook over Apple, would you?
1e-9 7y ago
A business model based on receiving user payment, a stated mission of protecting privacy, and a history of resisting government attempts to compromise privacy, all provide some reason to trust Apple more than most other companies. A business model based on profiting from private personal information (often obtained in sneaky ways) leaves almost no room to trust Google. For those reasons, Trust(Apple) >> Trust(Google). With that said, I don't trust Apple any more than I have to for the conveniences that are useful to me.
kelnos 7y ago
> I fail to understand why we should trust apple. If you have an iPhone, you already trust Apple enough to have a HomePod in your home. Ditto for Google/Android phone/Google Home. I really don't get how people are fine having an always-connected mic/camera/GPS in their pocket but balk at the idea of always-connected mic in their home, made by the same company. (If you specifically don't trust Amazon, then that's of course a different story. And regardless of which company builds the device, if it's under the control of the landlord... well, hell no.)
- 7402 7y ago
  > If you have an iPhone, you already trust Apple enough to have a HomePod in your home. Ditto for Google/Android phone/Google Home. Well, no. I have an iPhone, but I don't trust Siri, so I leave voice recognition off. I do trust Apple enough that when I turn off mic access for an app, the app doesn't get mic access.

bilbo0s 7y ago

Yeah, but that lawsuit is bogus. Apple gives developers access to my data only if I click to allow that developer access to my data. Which I, personally, almost never do. But if you do that, then yeah, that developer can take your data and do whatever he wants with it. Which is why you shouldn't do that. You're right about one thing though, and that is Apple not trusting me with most powers. They don't trust me, or anyone else with power. I like that stance. I think that should be the default stance of every company that deals with user data. No one gets access to it without the expressed consent of the user. If you're saying that Apple is giving out your data willy nilly the way FB or Google does, you're just wrong. Now of course, that's a completely different issue than trusting Apple. You should trust no one. And neither should Apple. (To be completely frank, Apple shouldn't even trust you.) What people like about Apple is that they hold up their end of the bargain. They trust no one.

justinjlynn 7y ago
Apple will trust whomever offers them more economic advantage in the long term if they need to be open about the relationship - and short term if they don't and don't think it's too much of a reputational risk. However, never think that you'll always be the one providing them the economic advantage forever - just note that, they'll most likely keep your data forever. Choose wisely.

asdkhadsj 7y ago

> I fail to understand why we should trust apple. I don't think anyone says we should. Do I trust apple? No. Do I trust apple more than google or facebook? Yes. It's all a balance of QoL features we personally want. I heavily enjoy the features and hardware of Apple. Yes, there are downsides. I left my vast Google ecosystem for Apple, not because Apple is perfect, but because they appeared better. Sure, I could throw away my watch, change to linux, get a flip phone (because I don't want to use hand-downs from Google's OS), but Apple is where I chose to draw my line between privacy and convenience.

monksy 7y ago
> Do I trust apple more than google or facebook? Yes. Why? They also have cloud services.
- asdkhadsj 7y ago
  Sure, but if you wanted the features and had to pick a provider, which would you choose? You wouldn't choose Facebook over Apple, would you?

1e-9 7y ago

A business model based on receiving user payment, a stated mission of protecting privacy, and a history of resisting government attempts to compromise privacy, all provide some reason to trust Apple more than most other companies. A business model based on profiting from private personal information (often obtained in sneaky ways) leaves almost no room to trust Google. For those reasons, Trust(Apple) >> Trust(Google). With that said, I don't trust Apple any more than I have to for the conveniences that are useful to me.

kelnos 7y ago

> I fail to understand why we should trust apple. If you have an iPhone, you already trust Apple enough to have a HomePod in your home. Ditto for Google/Android phone/Google Home. I really don't get how people are fine having an always-connected mic/camera/GPS in their pocket but balk at the idea of always-connected mic in their home, made by the same company. (If you specifically don't trust Amazon, then that's of course a different story. And regardless of which company builds the device, if it's under the control of the landlord... well, hell no.)

7402 7y ago
> If you have an iPhone, you already trust Apple enough to have a HomePod in your home. Ditto for Google/Android phone/Google Home. Well, no. I have an iPhone, but I don't trust Siri, so I leave voice recognition off. I do trust Apple enough that when I turn off mic access for an app, the app doesn't get mic access.