3 ms·

> What does this mean for engineers who are independent contractors in California? The state’s Chamber of Commerce and dozens of industry groups have been lobb

> What does this mean for engineers who are independent contractors in California? The state’s Chamber of Commerce and dozens of industry groups have been lobbying for exemptions, and a long list of professions were excluded from the bill: doctors, dentists, lawyers, architects, insurance agents, accountants, engineers, financial advisers, real estate agents, and hairstylists who rent booths at salons.

ravenstine 7y ago
I'd be interested in knowing whether any of us would be considered "engineers" under the law, given that many of us don't have engineering degrees or certifications of any kind. My job title at my current employer is "software engineer", but I don't have a formal education in engineering, and who knows if the California legislature sees that as engineering or a glorification of "what my nephew does on his computer with a thing called Word Press." Perhaps I'm too cynical.
- ghaff 7y ago
  The actual text would seem to be: "Require an active license from the State of California and involve the practice of one of the following recognized professions: law, dentistry, architecture, engineering, or accounting." http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billTextClient.xhtml?bill_id=201920200AB5 http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billTextClient.xhtml... So, presumably no. Only engineers with a P.E. license (which has been pretty much phased out for software engineering).
  - bsimpson 7y ago
    Colloquially, we use profession to mean "I get paid for this thing." Traditionally, there are requirements for something to be a profession. A central licensing body must assert a professional has gained the requisite knowledge to practice. (The Bar serves this purpose for lawyers.) The examples given imply this classical meaning of "profession". As you've pointed out, engineering in this context means jobs you'd need a license for, like civil engineering.
pishpash 7y ago
That's "law smell" if I ever saw one, already so many carveouts. It means the law/the ABC test is shitty as written, makes no sense, and should be scrapped.

ravenstine 7y ago

I'd be interested in knowing whether any of us would be considered "engineers" under the law, given that many of us don't have engineering degrees or certifications of any kind. My job title at my current employer is "software engineer", but I don't have a formal education in engineering, and who knows if the California legislature sees that as engineering or a glorification of "what my nephew does on his computer with a thing called Word Press." Perhaps I'm too cynical.

ghaff 7y ago
The actual text would seem to be: "Require an active license from the State of California and involve the practice of one of the following recognized professions: law, dentistry, architecture, engineering, or accounting." http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billTextClient.xhtml?bill_id=201920200AB5 http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billTextClient.xhtml... So, presumably no. Only engineers with a P.E. license (which has been pretty much phased out for software engineering).
- bsimpson 7y ago
  Colloquially, we use profession to mean "I get paid for this thing." Traditionally, there are requirements for something to be a profession. A central licensing body must assert a professional has gained the requisite knowledge to practice. (The Bar serves this purpose for lawyers.) The examples given imply this classical meaning of "profession". As you've pointed out, engineering in this context means jobs you'd need a license for, like civil engineering.

pishpash 7y ago

That's "law smell" if I ever saw one, already so many carveouts. It means the law/the ABC test is shitty as written, makes no sense, and should be scrapped.