5 ms·

I appreciate the sentiment, but "it'll all work out in the end" seems like a warning sign of wishful (poor) thinking.

by snth 16y ago

edw519 16y ago
Who am I going to listen to, the man who taught me more than I ever could ever imagine (and is now retired and giving away his millions) or some stranger who thinks he knows better? I often share thoughts like this in the OP's spirit of "pass it on" so that it may benefit someone else. Take it or leave it. But doubting it, commenting on what it "seems", or downvoting it only makes you look like a fool. [Sorry for the negative tone, but this is a perfect example of the one thing about hn that really bugs me: people talking when they should be listening.]
- snth 16y ago
  Of course you're free to listen to whomever you like; I wish you would take my comment more as an alternative viewpoint than as an insult. I do appreciate the sentiment of your story, that people should help others, but personally I think the attitude "it'll all work out in the end" ruins more lives than it saves.
  - jlcgull 16y ago
    I think the attitude "it'll all work out in the end" ruins more lives than it saves. I think that is cynicism speaking, more than anything else. Most importantly, how "end" is defined will determine if "it worked out" or not.
  - zzzeek 16y ago
    "it'll all work out" is an effective tool to deal with irrational or counterproductive anxiety (irrational== fear of flying, fear of social settings, etc., counterproductive==survival situations, situations with no other reasonable extrication than through, i.e. you need to swim to safety, you're stuck in a cave, you have a huge presentation to do tomorrow). It's entirely a bad idea to use in lieu of rational decisionmaking (i.e. "Ill enter into this horrible business deal, itll all work out!"). If you have generally negligible amounts of anxiety in life, the attitude is probably useless. For those of us that have tons, the judicious usage of this attitude is definitely a lifesaver.
  - jlcgull 16y ago
    Again, like most discussions on HN these days, the arguments seem to be turning towards mistaking general, rule-of-thumb kinda anecdotal advice as gospel truth and then trying to beat it into a provably correct or provably incorrect corner. Why not take it with a grain, or thimbleful (per taste), of salt and then giving it a shot in real life (IRL?)? If you really disagree so strongly then why not write the underlying reason(s) for your view(s)? Perhaps that would make for more interesting reading! Now before you take it as a rebuttal, let me start by saying the reason why I agree with edw519's response to the OP is borne of a basic human instinct that people a generally good. I like to believe that and would like to continue doing so. However, I have run into a fair share of douches and vampires who have made me want to reverse my viewpoint. Yet again, there have been many selfless acts from strangers, both big and small, to continue warrant giving humanity in general the benefit of doubt. In the end, I keep paraphrasing Lester Burnham's thoughts: You cannot stay mad at life for too long. Every something happens that makes you hate it, the next moment it will do something that makes you love with it all over again. Damn! I guess I am just another die-hard optimist. :-)
- csomar 16y ago
  Who am I going to listen to, the man who taught me more than I ever could ever imagine (and is now retired and giving away his millions) or some stranger who thinks he knows better? If he is stranger and you don't know him, how did you know that your mentor is wiser then? See, you have already made two mistakes: The first, by not accepting an alternative opinion; and second, by thinking that what you know (or you got from your mentor) is doomed to be the best.
  - ekanes 16y ago
    We can't explore all possibilities because of our limited time, so people use simple heuristics to get by. Prior experience/information always trumps no experience/information.
    - snth 16y ago
      Prior experience/information always trumps no experience/information. In fact, it does not. Your sample of experience may not be representative. This is complicated by various cognitive biases, including confirmation bias as mentioned downthread. UPDATE: Let me give an example relating to the original post. Two people, persons A and B, see a hitchhiker on the side of the road. Person A knows nothing about hitchhikers. Person B has seen several sensational news stories about rapist|murderer hitchhikers. In this case, person A will have to rely on their more general knowledge/opinion of people, and will, in my opinion, be more likely to give the hitchhiker a fair chance.
sanj 16y ago
Not in my mind. Doing the right thing is a solid way to run your life. It lets you sleep better at night and build solid relationships when you're awake. And, strangely, it does work out in the end. It has for me, every time.
- sudont 16y ago
  That's confirmation bias, you never hear from the people who try and fail. They go away to the gutter, a shitty sales job; silence. I'm glad it worked out for you, but it's rarely ever "just worked out" for me. So, be happy, because you're very lucky!
  - sanj 16y ago
    It is possibly confirmation bias. But it is one I embrace: it lets me continue to dream, take risks and help people out. A little self-delusion is a small price to pay for all that. And, yes, I am aware that I am very lucky.
    - olalonde 16y ago
      > I am the founder of LuckyCal. That made me smile :) That being said, I agree with your sentiment. And in the end, even if it doesn't work out, you never waste time by doing the right thing. I'd rather end up broke and do "the right thing" than to make money with a business I don't believe is making the world a better place. Moreover it seems doing the right thing is more likely to make you money which is kind of nice :)
deleted 16y ago
[deleted]
sid0 16y ago
Ah, the just-world phenomenon. Some people call it a fallacy -- I for one am not so pessimistic.
- andreyf 16y ago
  Think of it as a self-organizing social p2p protocol. Do the right thing. If you feel it's ruining your life, you should probably go hang out with a different crowd.
zacharycohn 16y ago
It's not so much "it'll all work out in the end" as it is "work really hard until it works out in the end."
neuralzen 16y ago
Seth Godin prescribes this behavior as well, and acts on it if his eBook distributions are any evidence. Giving things away for free in a genuine way is a great way to make money if you are clever about it. There is nothing wrong with mutually-assured improvement.

I appreciate the sentiment, but "it'll all work out in the end" seems like a warning sign of wishful (poor) thinking.

by snth 16y ago

I appreciate the sentiment, but "it'll all work out in the end" seems like a warning sign of wishful (poor) thinking.

Who am I going to listen to, the man who taught me more than I ever could ever imagine (and is now retired and giving away his millions) or some stranger who thinks he knows better? I often share thoughts like this in the OP's spirit of "pass it on" so that it may benefit someone else. Take it or leave it. But doubting it, commenting on what it "seems", or downvoting it only makes you look like a fool. [Sorry for the negative tone, but this is a perfect example of the one thing about hn that really bugs me: people talking when they should be listening.]

snth 16y ago
Of course you're free to listen to whomever you like; I wish you would take my comment more as an alternative viewpoint than as an insult. I do appreciate the sentiment of your story, that people should help others, but personally I think the attitude "it'll all work out in the end" ruins more lives than it saves.
- jlcgull 16y ago
  I think the attitude "it'll all work out in the end" ruins more lives than it saves. I think that is cynicism speaking, more than anything else. Most importantly, how "end" is defined will determine if "it worked out" or not.
- zzzeek 16y ago
  "it'll all work out" is an effective tool to deal with irrational or counterproductive anxiety (irrational== fear of flying, fear of social settings, etc., counterproductive==survival situations, situations with no other reasonable extrication than through, i.e. you need to swim to safety, you're stuck in a cave, you have a huge presentation to do tomorrow). It's entirely a bad idea to use in lieu of rational decisionmaking (i.e. "Ill enter into this horrible business deal, itll all work out!"). If you have generally negligible amounts of anxiety in life, the attitude is probably useless. For those of us that have tons, the judicious usage of this attitude is definitely a lifesaver.
- jlcgull 16y ago
  Again, like most discussions on HN these days, the arguments seem to be turning towards mistaking general, rule-of-thumb kinda anecdotal advice as gospel truth and then trying to beat it into a provably correct or provably incorrect corner. Why not take it with a grain, or thimbleful (per taste), of salt and then giving it a shot in real life (IRL?)? If you really disagree so strongly then why not write the underlying reason(s) for your view(s)? Perhaps that would make for more interesting reading! Now before you take it as a rebuttal, let me start by saying the reason why I agree with edw519's response to the OP is borne of a basic human instinct that people a generally good. I like to believe that and would like to continue doing so. However, I have run into a fair share of douches and vampires who have made me want to reverse my viewpoint. Yet again, there have been many selfless acts from strangers, both big and small, to continue warrant giving humanity in general the benefit of doubt. In the end, I keep paraphrasing Lester Burnham's thoughts: You cannot stay mad at life for too long. Every something happens that makes you hate it, the next moment it will do something that makes you love with it all over again. Damn! I guess I am just another die-hard optimist. :-)
csomar 16y ago
Who am I going to listen to, the man who taught me more than I ever could ever imagine (and is now retired and giving away his millions) or some stranger who thinks he knows better? If he is stranger and you don't know him, how did you know that your mentor is wiser then? See, you have already made two mistakes: The first, by not accepting an alternative opinion; and second, by thinking that what you know (or you got from your mentor) is doomed to be the best.
- ekanes 16y ago
  We can't explore all possibilities because of our limited time, so people use simple heuristics to get by. Prior experience/information always trumps no experience/information.
  - snth 16y ago
    Prior experience/information always trumps no experience/information. In fact, it does not. Your sample of experience may not be representative. This is complicated by various cognitive biases, including confirmation bias as mentioned downthread. UPDATE: Let me give an example relating to the original post. Two people, persons A and B, see a hitchhiker on the side of the road. Person A knows nothing about hitchhikers. Person B has seen several sensational news stories about rapist|murderer hitchhikers. In this case, person A will have to rely on their more general knowledge/opinion of people, and will, in my opinion, be more likely to give the hitchhiker a fair chance.

sanj 16y ago

Not in my mind. Doing the right thing is a solid way to run your life. It lets you sleep better at night and build solid relationships when you're awake. And, strangely, it does work out in the end. It has for me, every time.

sudont 16y ago
That's confirmation bias, you never hear from the people who try and fail. They go away to the gutter, a shitty sales job; silence. I'm glad it worked out for you, but it's rarely ever "just worked out" for me. So, be happy, because you're very lucky!
- sanj 16y ago
  It is possibly confirmation bias. But it is one I embrace: it lets me continue to dream, take risks and help people out. A little self-delusion is a small price to pay for all that. And, yes, I am aware that I am very lucky.
  - olalonde 16y ago
    > I am the founder of LuckyCal. That made me smile :) That being said, I agree with your sentiment. And in the end, even if it doesn't work out, you never waste time by doing the right thing. I'd rather end up broke and do "the right thing" than to make money with a business I don't believe is making the world a better place. Moreover it seems doing the right thing is more likely to make you money which is kind of nice :)

deleted 16y ago

[deleted]

sid0 16y ago

Ah, the just-world phenomenon. Some people call it a fallacy -- I for one am not so pessimistic.

andreyf 16y ago
Think of it as a self-organizing social p2p protocol. Do the right thing. If you feel it's ruining your life, you should probably go hang out with a different crowd.

zacharycohn 16y ago

It's not so much "it'll all work out in the end" as it is "work really hard until it works out in the end."

neuralzen 16y ago

Seth Godin prescribes this behavior as well, and acts on it if his eBook distributions are any evidence. Giving things away for free in a genuine way is a great way to make money if you are clever about it. There is nothing wrong with mutually-assured improvement.