> I don't understand the distinction you are making. People with mental illness make choices, are lead into things, etc. > People who are expelled from school

> I don't understand the distinction you are making. People with mental illness make choices, are lead into things, etc. > People who are expelled from school or incarcerated don't want to be in that situation but they are anyway. That seems like mental illness to me - counterproductive behavior that can't be willed to stop. Fair point. I probably shouldn't have made that distinction. > The tragic fact I'm trying to communicate about attempts to help people is that the first step is to get someone who is vulnerable to trust authorities. And then that trust is necessarily betrayed, because the whole point is to try to help people without their consent. Not being able to trust is a primary cause or contributing factor to being unable to function properly in society. In many of the more extreme cases that is true. However it doesn't always work out that way. Realistically this is a far to broad a topic to be generalising the way we have but it's still been a read regardless.