4 ms·

What exactly makes people feel better when they know the source of a deficit, even though there is no improvment of handling it? Diagnosing someting would only

by oeuviz 7y ago

What exactly makes people feel better when they know the source of a deficit, even though there is no improvment of handling it? Diagnosing someting would only make me feel better if I could treat for it.

DanBC 7y ago
You can ask for reasonable adjustments in the workplace. You now have a reason that explains the difficulties you've had in your life. You can understand why situations are difficult or overwhelming for you, and what you need to do to cope with those situations.
- oeuviz 7y ago
  Thanks, I guess I've been too ignorant to see this myself. Would be interesting though to learn how knowledge of the syndrome will help tidying up the bedroom.
barry-cotter 7y ago
1) “It’s not my fault, I have a disease.” 2) You can see how other people with similar problems deal with them. 3) You can talk to other people and they get it, they understand. For some people it’s like they suddenly find their people, like when someone who’s been reading HN for years goes to Silicon Valley and realises this is what it’s like to be surrounded by people who care about your interests or when you go from being the guy at your gym who’s trying to lift heavy to joining a powerlifting gym. Suddenly people understand.
- oeuviz 7y ago
  Thank you, sounds reasonable!
TeMPOraL 7y ago
One extra underappreciated benefit: you can tell the people saying you have a moral deficiency to shut up. (Sometimes not directly in this antagonistic way; just telling you have a particular diagnosed condition can make the annoying people in your life suddenly very compassionate.)
- oeuviz 7y ago
  I like to use that when discussing politics. Foreigners and refugees are a very frequent topic in Europe and after a while of listening to people's arguments for this and that I'd often say that I am both, a foreigner and ex refugee. This usualy leaves them stuttering.
- Grustaf 7y ago
  It is true that people become more compassionate, but that seems like a bit of a fallacy. -That guy is so abrupt and rude to people, I can’t stand him -Oh but he has ADHD -I see, then it’s ok I don’t really see why flaws should become more acceptable if you give them a scientific sounding name. In the end life is not easy for anyone, we all need to struggle to remember everything, not lose our temper, stay positive etc. Sure it is especially hard for some people but Up to a point that is just a fact of life, it just means they need to work a bit harder. Perhaps beyond a certain point you need to give people some slack, if they have amnesia or something, but I’m not sure it makes sense to accept that people “with ADHD” behave badly for example.
  - TeMPOraL 7y ago
    I think you may looking at the wrong disorder. ADHD in adults doesn't mean someone is rude (no more than a normie). But at least some forms of ADHD will make the person look like inherently lazy. > I don’t really see why flaws should become more acceptable if you give them a scientific sounding name. It's not that they should be, they just in practice are to most people, and this can be a lifeline, especially if depression is involved. Personally, I believe some "flaws" (aspects that make it problematic for one to function) absolutely should be cut a lot of slack and approached from another angle. Social pressure - the kind of telling you to stop having a problem and get your shit together - works only for some things, and can make the issue worse in others (e.g. in depression, it not only won't help, it can drive patients to suicide). > I’m not sure it makes sense to accept that people “with ADHD” behave badly for example Beyond the point that most don't "behave badly" but rather "behave inconsistently if at all", it's a matter of what you mean by "accept". If "accept to your social circle"? You can do whatever. But if you want to help that person, you'll accept that these aspects are not effectively corrected by social pressure because they're beyond the person's control. See also, Scott Alexander's old post: https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/895quRDaK6gR2rM82/diseased-thinking-dissolving-questions-about-disease https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/895quRDaK6gR2rM82/diseased-t... Quoting the Summary section: "People commonly debate whether social and mental conditions are real diseases. This masquerades as a medical question, but its implications are mainly social and ethical. We use the concept of disease to decide who gets sympathy, who gets blame, and who gets treatment. Instead of continuing the fruitless "disease" argument, we should address these questions directly. Taking a determinist consequentialist position allows us to do so more effectively. We should blame and stigmatize people for conditions where blame and stigma are the most useful methods for curing or preventing the condition, and we should allow patients to seek treatment whenever it is available and effective."

by oeuviz 7y ago

DanBC 7y ago

You can ask for reasonable adjustments in the workplace. You now have a reason that explains the difficulties you've had in your life. You can understand why situations are difficult or overwhelming for you, and what you need to do to cope with those situations.

oeuviz 7y ago
Thanks, I guess I've been too ignorant to see this myself. Would be interesting though to learn how knowledge of the syndrome will help tidying up the bedroom.

barry-cotter 7y ago

1) “It’s not my fault, I have a disease.” 2) You can see how other people with similar problems deal with them. 3) You can talk to other people and they get it, they understand. For some people it’s like they suddenly find their people, like when someone who’s been reading HN for years goes to Silicon Valley and realises this is what it’s like to be surrounded by people who care about your interests or when you go from being the guy at your gym who’s trying to lift heavy to joining a powerlifting gym. Suddenly people understand.

oeuviz 7y ago
Thank you, sounds reasonable!

TeMPOraL 7y ago

One extra underappreciated benefit: you can tell the people saying you have a moral deficiency to shut up. (Sometimes not directly in this antagonistic way; just telling you have a particular diagnosed condition can make the annoying people in your life suddenly very compassionate.)

oeuviz 7y ago
I like to use that when discussing politics. Foreigners and refugees are a very frequent topic in Europe and after a while of listening to people's arguments for this and that I'd often say that I am both, a foreigner and ex refugee. This usualy leaves them stuttering.
Grustaf 7y ago
It is true that people become more compassionate, but that seems like a bit of a fallacy. -That guy is so abrupt and rude to people, I can’t stand him -Oh but he has ADHD -I see, then it’s ok I don’t really see why flaws should become more acceptable if you give them a scientific sounding name. In the end life is not easy for anyone, we all need to struggle to remember everything, not lose our temper, stay positive etc. Sure it is especially hard for some people but Up to a point that is just a fact of life, it just means they need to work a bit harder. Perhaps beyond a certain point you need to give people some slack, if they have amnesia or something, but I’m not sure it makes sense to accept that people “with ADHD” behave badly for example.
- TeMPOraL 7y ago
  I think you may looking at the wrong disorder. ADHD in adults doesn't mean someone is rude (no more than a normie). But at least some forms of ADHD will make the person look like inherently lazy. > I don’t really see why flaws should become more acceptable if you give them a scientific sounding name. It's not that they should be, they just in practice are to most people, and this can be a lifeline, especially if depression is involved. Personally, I believe some "flaws" (aspects that make it problematic for one to function) absolutely should be cut a lot of slack and approached from another angle. Social pressure - the kind of telling you to stop having a problem and get your shit together - works only for some things, and can make the issue worse in others (e.g. in depression, it not only won't help, it can drive patients to suicide). > I’m not sure it makes sense to accept that people “with ADHD” behave badly for example Beyond the point that most don't "behave badly" but rather "behave inconsistently if at all", it's a matter of what you mean by "accept". If "accept to your social circle"? You can do whatever. But if you want to help that person, you'll accept that these aspects are not effectively corrected by social pressure because they're beyond the person's control. See also, Scott Alexander's old post: https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/895quRDaK6gR2rM82/diseased-thinking-dissolving-questions-about-disease https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/895quRDaK6gR2rM82/diseased-t... Quoting the Summary section: "People commonly debate whether social and mental conditions are real diseases. This masquerades as a medical question, but its implications are mainly social and ethical. We use the concept of disease to decide who gets sympathy, who gets blame, and who gets treatment. Instead of continuing the fruitless "disease" argument, we should address these questions directly. Taking a determinist consequentialist position allows us to do so more effectively. We should blame and stigmatize people for conditions where blame and stigma are the most useful methods for curing or preventing the condition, and we should allow patients to seek treatment whenever it is available and effective."