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I wonder why the terminal app section is there at all, since the preinstalled Terminal is totally fine. Since this article seems aimed at brand new developers,

I wonder why the terminal app section is there at all, since the preinstalled Terminal is totally fine. Since this article seems aimed at brand new developers, I'd expect the author would want to eliminate any unnecessary steps.

jamescostian 7y ago
iTerm 2 provides noticeable improvements. Being able to select text and have it immediately copied to your clipboard (much like the PRIMARY clipboard in Linux) is very, very nice. The UI is also much more customizable. And things like imgcat (a program like "cat" but for seeing images in your terminal) or even the ability to Cmd+click a file path on a remote server and have it downloaded over SSH onto your machine are fantastic EDIT: also worth mentioning that if you use VS Code (or another GUI editor) and a separate terminal emulator, you may find VS Code's built-in terminal emulator to be very, very convenient. Although if you're overwhelmed with everything you already have to install, then it might be better to stick to iTerm 2 in the beginning, because it's a drop-in replacement for Terminal.app with awesome improvements
- dijit 7y ago
  Iterm2 is truly awesome and I’m sad there’s no real equivalent on Linux, but it’s mostly useful for power users, you can get by very comfortably with the standard terminal.app with very few setting tweaks. Although I was not aware of “click to download”, I wonder how that works.
  - leetrout 7y ago
    It let's you cmd+click on links (if it's detected the output as a link). The stock terminal is nice for being able to alt+click directly in to the middle of a command input.
  - mixmastamyk 7y ago
    Most linux terminals are much better than terminal.app, though true don't have has many nifty features as iterm.
    - acdha 7y ago
      What makes you say “much better”? Having used them for decades I’d be hard pressed to find a single feature I regularly use which isn’t in Terminal.app by now.
      - mixmastamyk 7y ago
        My last experience with it, didn't support the full color palette, some of the more obscure escape seqs, and window splits. Has it improved in the last six months?
    - dijit 7y ago
      I was comparing iterm2 to anything on linux, (not terminal.app to anything on linux); However terminal.app is decent enough, I would prefer urxvt on linux (or even termite) but not because terminal.app is missing anything major, I just like customisability.
- leetrout 7y ago
  Now add in Z-Shell and Oh My Zsh and you're set. I shrugged it off as pointless hipster dev for FAR too long and now I can't live without it. I only use 1/10th of what it does but the fact that I get that 1/10th with minimal fiddling it's so worth it. My favorite feature is typing part of a command and hitting the up arrow (similar to ctrl+r but easier).
  - drcongo 7y ago
    Often when OhMyZsh gets mentioned on here someone will pop up and say "Why not just use Fish shell? You get all that functionality out the box and it's friendlier and faster.", today I am that person. I only made the switch a couple of weeks ago after many years of zsh and OhMyZsh, but I now _love_ Fish.
- mixmastamyk 7y ago
  That last feature sounds interesting, though I'm on Linux 99% of the time. It also has the full color palette for ansi escapes and other ansi features, though I realize they aren't crucial.
- xrisk 7y ago
  My main gripe with iTerm 2 is that I can't Option-Click to navigate around. It's supposed to work but is extremely buggy compared to Terminal.app
- hartator 7y ago
  What do you mean by copy/pasting texts? These always worked fine with Terminal.
  - jamescostian 7y ago
    Go to Terminal.app and (using your mouse) select some text, such as your prompt. Now paste. Repeat the same experiment with iTerm 2 (although you may need some custom setting for this one). There are different results: iTerm 2 will copy the text that you selected, while Terminal.app will not. The idea is that the only time you select text in the terminal (with your mouse) is to copy it. It's very nice IMO
    - acdha 7y ago
      Terminal will paste it using middle-click (like most xterm derivatives) or Shift-Command-V. Whether it’s good or bad that this doesn’t affect the system clipboard varies depending on the task.
- badfrog 7y ago
  Sure, I'm not claiming Terminal is the best option. But if somebody who's not familiar with command line is starting to do web dev, they've got a ton of things to install/learn right away, and this doesn't need to be one of them. Maybe just move this section to the intermediate tutorial.
  - jamescostian 7y ago
    Installing iTerm 2 takes seconds and running it as equally as easy as running Terminal.app. It's really not any extra mental overhead; if anything, it helps you practice the strange art that is installing things on a mac
- acdha 7y ago
  How often do you use that? I mean, I use the Terminal middle-click / Shift-Command-V paste-without-copy shortcut fairly regularly but I wouldn’t describe it as a huge deal for people getting started. Similarly, it’s not common to need to look at images in the terminal constantly and the standard `open` utility will display anything, only slightly slower for needing to close the window when you’re done. Again, not an unuseful feature but I’d leave it off of a beginners’ guide for web developers.
- gumby 7y ago
  > Being able to select text and have it immediately copied to your clipboard (much like the PRIMARY clipboard in Linux) is very, very nice. It's a Mac; the default usage model is direct manipulation rather than windows-style "object -> verb". So you select the text and drag the selection into where you want it, though as you say cut/paste is available as well. I have personally not seen the point of anything beyond the built in terminal (though it's a taste matter) though I typically use the shell inside Emacs anyway. I think for beginners the least customization is the best. My default mode for decades is to try to change defaults as little as possible, though my .emacs file tries as much as possible to bring Emacs back to the defaults of version 170.

jamescostian 7y ago

iTerm 2 provides noticeable improvements. Being able to select text and have it immediately copied to your clipboard (much like the PRIMARY clipboard in Linux) is very, very nice. The UI is also much more customizable. And things like imgcat (a program like "cat" but for seeing images in your terminal) or even the ability to Cmd+click a file path on a remote server and have it downloaded over SSH onto your machine are fantastic EDIT: also worth mentioning that if you use VS Code (or another GUI editor) and a separate terminal emulator, you may find VS Code's built-in terminal emulator to be very, very convenient. Although if you're overwhelmed with everything you already have to install, then it might be better to stick to iTerm 2 in the beginning, because it's a drop-in replacement for Terminal.app with awesome improvements

dijit 7y ago
Iterm2 is truly awesome and I’m sad there’s no real equivalent on Linux, but it’s mostly useful for power users, you can get by very comfortably with the standard terminal.app with very few setting tweaks. Although I was not aware of “click to download”, I wonder how that works.
- leetrout 7y ago
  It let's you cmd+click on links (if it's detected the output as a link). The stock terminal is nice for being able to alt+click directly in to the middle of a command input.
- mixmastamyk 7y ago
  Most linux terminals are much better than terminal.app, though true don't have has many nifty features as iterm.
  - acdha 7y ago
    What makes you say “much better”? Having used them for decades I’d be hard pressed to find a single feature I regularly use which isn’t in Terminal.app by now.
    - mixmastamyk 7y ago
      My last experience with it, didn't support the full color palette, some of the more obscure escape seqs, and window splits. Has it improved in the last six months?
  - dijit 7y ago
    I was comparing iterm2 to anything on linux, (not terminal.app to anything on linux); However terminal.app is decent enough, I would prefer urxvt on linux (or even termite) but not because terminal.app is missing anything major, I just like customisability.
leetrout 7y ago
Now add in Z-Shell and Oh My Zsh and you're set. I shrugged it off as pointless hipster dev for FAR too long and now I can't live without it. I only use 1/10th of what it does but the fact that I get that 1/10th with minimal fiddling it's so worth it. My favorite feature is typing part of a command and hitting the up arrow (similar to ctrl+r but easier).
- drcongo 7y ago
  Often when OhMyZsh gets mentioned on here someone will pop up and say "Why not just use Fish shell? You get all that functionality out the box and it's friendlier and faster.", today I am that person. I only made the switch a couple of weeks ago after many years of zsh and OhMyZsh, but I now _love_ Fish.
mixmastamyk 7y ago
That last feature sounds interesting, though I'm on Linux 99% of the time. It also has the full color palette for ansi escapes and other ansi features, though I realize they aren't crucial.
xrisk 7y ago
My main gripe with iTerm 2 is that I can't Option-Click to navigate around. It's supposed to work but is extremely buggy compared to Terminal.app
hartator 7y ago
What do you mean by copy/pasting texts? These always worked fine with Terminal.
- jamescostian 7y ago
  Go to Terminal.app and (using your mouse) select some text, such as your prompt. Now paste. Repeat the same experiment with iTerm 2 (although you may need some custom setting for this one). There are different results: iTerm 2 will copy the text that you selected, while Terminal.app will not. The idea is that the only time you select text in the terminal (with your mouse) is to copy it. It's very nice IMO
  - acdha 7y ago
    Terminal will paste it using middle-click (like most xterm derivatives) or Shift-Command-V. Whether it’s good or bad that this doesn’t affect the system clipboard varies depending on the task.
badfrog 7y ago
Sure, I'm not claiming Terminal is the best option. But if somebody who's not familiar with command line is starting to do web dev, they've got a ton of things to install/learn right away, and this doesn't need to be one of them. Maybe just move this section to the intermediate tutorial.
- jamescostian 7y ago
  Installing iTerm 2 takes seconds and running it as equally as easy as running Terminal.app. It's really not any extra mental overhead; if anything, it helps you practice the strange art that is installing things on a mac
acdha 7y ago
How often do you use that? I mean, I use the Terminal middle-click / Shift-Command-V paste-without-copy shortcut fairly regularly but I wouldn’t describe it as a huge deal for people getting started. Similarly, it’s not common to need to look at images in the terminal constantly and the standard `open` utility will display anything, only slightly slower for needing to close the window when you’re done. Again, not an unuseful feature but I’d leave it off of a beginners’ guide for web developers.
gumby 7y ago
> Being able to select text and have it immediately copied to your clipboard (much like the PRIMARY clipboard in Linux) is very, very nice. It's a Mac; the default usage model is direct manipulation rather than windows-style "object -> verb". So you select the text and drag the selection into where you want it, though as you say cut/paste is available as well. I have personally not seen the point of anything beyond the built in terminal (though it's a taste matter) though I typically use the shell inside Emacs anyway. I think for beginners the least customization is the best. My default mode for decades is to try to change defaults as little as possible, though my .emacs file tries as much as possible to bring Emacs back to the defaults of version 170.