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Ridiculous criticism. If Google wanted to bring privacy to the masses for cheap, they could do it. Nobody is stopping them. If Apple makes it part of their s

Ridiculous criticism. If Google wanted to bring privacy to the masses for cheap, they could do it. Nobody is stopping them. If Apple makes it part of their sales pitch, regardless of the price of their devices, I see no problem with that.

devoply 7y ago
Yeah exactly, it's like we're taking privacy a cheap or free good and making it non-existent (Google) but shame on your for offering it at a higher price.
lern_too_spel 7y ago
With Apple, it's pure marketing. Apple devices are far worse for privacy than all competitors. Try to develop apps for your iDevice without giving Apple your banking details or reinstalling weekly. Try not sending location data to Apple for AGPS (opt-in on even Google-flavored Android devices). Of course, marketing works, so people fall for it. I've seen people blame Google for manipulating them with ads. Apple is just as bad — getting people to pay more for worse products. Nobody can offer a concrete reason for why Apple devices are better for privacy (because they aren't), yet they will still parrot that it is — right out of Apple's marketing talking points.
- threeseed 7y ago
  You can develop for the iPhone using an anonymous pre-paid credit card. And Apple absolutely led the way in privacy. Differential privacy, secure enclave, rotating ad identifiers, randomising MAC address, UI prompts before apps can access data, on device ML models. And their implementation of fingerprint and facial recognition was significantly more secure than their competitors.
  - jammygit 7y ago
    I’m not sure an anonymous prepaid credit card is a real solution
- cromulent 7y ago
  > Nobody can offer a concrete reason for why Apple devices are better for privacy "Google servers communicated significantly lower number of times with an iPhone device compared to Android (45% less). However, the number of calls to Google’s advertising domains were similar from both devices - an expected outcome since the usage of 3rd-party webpages and apps was similar on both devices. One notable difference was that the location data sent to Google from an iOS device is practically non-existent. In the absence of Android and Chrome platforms—or the use of any other Google product—Google becomes significantly limited in its ability to track the user location." https://digitalcontentnext.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/DCN-Google-Data-Collection-Paper.pdf https://digitalcontentnext.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/DC...
  - lern_too_spel 7y ago
    > One notable difference was that the location data sent to Google from an iOS device is practically non-existent. Instead, location data goes to Apple, as I mentioned in GP post. Worse, unlike with Android, you can't turn it off. Similarly, consider mapping apps. All map location links are required to open in Apple Maps, sending your data to Apple, and there is no way to change it. On Android, you can set a purely offline mapping application as default. And a similar situation arises with apps. Apple knows every app you've installed, whether you want them to or not. Not so on Android.
    - cromulent 7y ago
      >> All map location links are required to open in Apple Maps "These schemes allow you to launch the Google Maps app for iOS" https://developers.google.com/maps/documentation/urls/ios-urlscheme https://developers.google.com/maps/documentation/urls/ios-ur...
      - lern_too_spel 7y ago
        Unlike on Android, this is not up to the user but the app developer. If you want to use a fully offline maps app, good luck finding other apps that will support its URI scheme.
threatofrain 7y ago
The funny part is that it's precisely Google and friends who are giving Apple this position to make privacy a selling point.
- beaner 7y ago
  How? Google respects privacy more than Apple does.
  - tmalsburg2 7y ago
    Please explain.
  - TwoNineA 7y ago
    > How? Google respects privacy more than Apple does. [citation needed]
    - beaner 7y ago
      Google lets you delete more of the things they record of you doing. Google gives you more control.
- ariwilson 7y ago
  Isn't it because Apple isn't able to make web services that use user data in an effective way? See the failures of Apple Maps, iCloud e-mail, iAd, etc.
skybrian 7y ago
Google is making some moves towards increasing privacy [1], though we haven't seen the results yet. It's part of the same marketing message. It seems like having Apple and Google competing on privacy could end up being a good thing, though where it ends up is anyone's guess. [1] https://www.theverge.com/2019/5/7/18535532/google-chrome-ad-tracking-cookie-blocking-io-2019 https://www.theverge.com/2019/5/7/18535532/google-chrome-ad-...
lovedva 7y ago
P
- lovedva 7y ago
  Oops looks like the hn gods have decided this thread is not to be shown and downvoted it down en masse
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
tinus_hn 7y ago
It’s a bit weird for Google to complain that people who can’t afford Apple devices are forced to use the inferior Google offerings.

devoply 7y ago

Yeah exactly, it's like we're taking privacy a cheap or free good and making it non-existent (Google) but shame on your for offering it at a higher price.

lern_too_spel 7y ago

With Apple, it's pure marketing. Apple devices are far worse for privacy than all competitors. Try to develop apps for your iDevice without giving Apple your banking details or reinstalling weekly. Try not sending location data to Apple for AGPS (opt-in on even Google-flavored Android devices). Of course, marketing works, so people fall for it. I've seen people blame Google for manipulating them with ads. Apple is just as bad — getting people to pay more for worse products. Nobody can offer a concrete reason for why Apple devices are better for privacy (because they aren't), yet they will still parrot that it is — right out of Apple's marketing talking points.

threeseed 7y ago
You can develop for the iPhone using an anonymous pre-paid credit card. And Apple absolutely led the way in privacy. Differential privacy, secure enclave, rotating ad identifiers, randomising MAC address, UI prompts before apps can access data, on device ML models. And their implementation of fingerprint and facial recognition was significantly more secure than their competitors.
- jammygit 7y ago
  I’m not sure an anonymous prepaid credit card is a real solution
cromulent 7y ago
> Nobody can offer a concrete reason for why Apple devices are better for privacy "Google servers communicated significantly lower number of times with an iPhone device compared to Android (45% less). However, the number of calls to Google’s advertising domains were similar from both devices - an expected outcome since the usage of 3rd-party webpages and apps was similar on both devices. One notable difference was that the location data sent to Google from an iOS device is practically non-existent. In the absence of Android and Chrome platforms—or the use of any other Google product—Google becomes significantly limited in its ability to track the user location." https://digitalcontentnext.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/DCN-Google-Data-Collection-Paper.pdf https://digitalcontentnext.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/DC...
- lern_too_spel 7y ago
  > One notable difference was that the location data sent to Google from an iOS device is practically non-existent. Instead, location data goes to Apple, as I mentioned in GP post. Worse, unlike with Android, you can't turn it off. Similarly, consider mapping apps. All map location links are required to open in Apple Maps, sending your data to Apple, and there is no way to change it. On Android, you can set a purely offline mapping application as default. And a similar situation arises with apps. Apple knows every app you've installed, whether you want them to or not. Not so on Android.
  - cromulent 7y ago
    >> All map location links are required to open in Apple Maps "These schemes allow you to launch the Google Maps app for iOS" https://developers.google.com/maps/documentation/urls/ios-urlscheme https://developers.google.com/maps/documentation/urls/ios-ur...
    - lern_too_spel 7y ago
      Unlike on Android, this is not up to the user but the app developer. If you want to use a fully offline maps app, good luck finding other apps that will support its URI scheme.

threatofrain 7y ago

The funny part is that it's precisely Google and friends who are giving Apple this position to make privacy a selling point.

beaner 7y ago
How? Google respects privacy more than Apple does.
- tmalsburg2 7y ago
  Please explain.
- TwoNineA 7y ago
  > How? Google respects privacy more than Apple does. [citation needed]
  - beaner 7y ago
    Google lets you delete more of the things they record of you doing. Google gives you more control.
ariwilson 7y ago
Isn't it because Apple isn't able to make web services that use user data in an effective way? See the failures of Apple Maps, iCloud e-mail, iAd, etc.

skybrian 7y ago

Google is making some moves towards increasing privacy [1], though we haven't seen the results yet. It's part of the same marketing message. It seems like having Apple and Google competing on privacy could end up being a good thing, though where it ends up is anyone's guess. [1] https://www.theverge.com/2019/5/7/18535532/google-chrome-ad-tracking-cookie-blocking-io-2019 https://www.theverge.com/2019/5/7/18535532/google-chrome-ad-...

lovedva 7y ago

lovedva 7y ago
Oops looks like the hn gods have decided this thread is not to be shown and downvoted it down en masse

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

tinus_hn 7y ago

It’s a bit weird for Google to complain that people who can’t afford Apple devices are forced to use the inferior Google offerings.