5 ms·

The “432 Hz vs. 440 Hz” conspiracy theory

29 points by yinso 7y ago

Arbalest 7y ago
heh yeah, numerology doesn't make much sense when applied to measurement units generally. That hasn't stopped it being applied anyway. For someone already prone to this sort of thinking, they're looking at the number, without thinking about how the measurement base was derived. Thankfully, this article isn't so much about debunking the exact myth, but rather the notion that the standard has any particular historical significance. It is interesting to think that it wasn't until recently we have even been able to reasonably measure and standardise frequency.
dsego 7y ago
Adam Neely has a great take on this: A = 432Hz https://youtu.be/EKTZ151yLnk https://youtu.be/EKTZ151yLnk Another good one is Paul Davids: The Ultimate 432Hz VS 440Hz | CONSPIRACY + Comparison https://youtu.be/Rt3EAPDn-Ug https://youtu.be/Rt3EAPDn-Ug
nkurz 7y ago
> At the urging of singers, the French government made the tuning A = 435 Hz officially standard in France in 1859 Did they know that the time that they had chosen exactly 435 Hz? That is, were they to directly count the number of waves per second using the technology available at that time? My quick searching says that devices such as "Scheibler's Tonometer" did exist at the time. These allowed the user count the much slower "beats" between two tuning forks, letting them extrapolate the frequency of a unknown tuning fork from a known. But what did they use for a known? Or was the French standard only actually defined as a particular tuning fork, only determined to be 435 Hz at some late time, when better technology was available?
tmpfs 7y ago
I found the article hyperbole and a better reference is scientific tuning [1] [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_pitch https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_pitch
dr_dshiv 7y ago
The average human alpha wave, the most dominant brainwave, is 10hz. Coincidental that 10 fit in a second, I guess. http://www.jneurosci.org/content/37/42/10173 http://www.jneurosci.org/content/37/42/10173 Personally, I would prefer that seconds were slightly shorter (~.84 seconds), because then we could have decimal time, where there are 100 seconds in a minute, 100 minutes in an hour and 10 hours in a day. Mm, would be soo satisfying. Useless, but satisfying.
- qubex 7y ago
  Technically time is decimal in the SInsystem because the unit is the second s and the usual decimal power names apply. It’s just that we have standard names for various non decimal multiples. Yes, as with anything that lies beyond the clause “well technically...” this actually kind of vindicates the opposing campus point, so yeah...
anoncake 7y ago
> There are millions of people in the world who believe that Goebbels introduced the tuning to make people feel more anxious. That's absurd. It's more likely Goebbels did that to demonstrate that Germany was no longer bound to Article 282 (22) of the Treaty of Versailles, which forced it to accept the 435hz standard. See: Jerry L. Weinstein, Musical Pitch and International Agreement. The American Journal of International Law Vol. 46, No. 2 (Apr., 1952), pp. 341-343, https://www.jstor.org/stable/2194075 https://www.jstor.org/stable/2194075
karmakaze 7y ago
It was funny how the numerology is bunk but then we use 440 rather than 439 because it's prime. It all makes sense of course unless you're in the believer camp then it could seem arbitrary.

29 points by yinso 7y ago

heh yeah, numerology doesn't make much sense when applied to measurement units generally. That hasn't stopped it being applied anyway. For someone already prone to this sort of thinking, they're looking at the number, without thinking about how the measurement base was derived. Thankfully, this article isn't so much about debunking the exact myth, but rather the notion that the standard has any particular historical significance. It is interesting to think that it wasn't until recently we have even been able to reasonably measure and standardise frequency.

dsego 7y ago

Adam Neely has a great take on this: A = 432Hz https://youtu.be/EKTZ151yLnk https://youtu.be/EKTZ151yLnk Another good one is Paul Davids: The Ultimate 432Hz VS 440Hz | CONSPIRACY + Comparison https://youtu.be/Rt3EAPDn-Ug https://youtu.be/Rt3EAPDn-Ug

nkurz 7y ago

> At the urging of singers, the French government made the tuning A = 435 Hz officially standard in France in 1859 Did they know that the time that they had chosen exactly 435 Hz? That is, were they to directly count the number of waves per second using the technology available at that time? My quick searching says that devices such as "Scheibler's Tonometer" did exist at the time. These allowed the user count the much slower "beats" between two tuning forks, letting them extrapolate the frequency of a unknown tuning fork from a known. But what did they use for a known? Or was the French standard only actually defined as a particular tuning fork, only determined to be 435 Hz at some late time, when better technology was available?

tmpfs 7y ago

I found the article hyperbole and a better reference is scientific tuning [1] [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_pitch https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_pitch

dr_dshiv 7y ago

The average human alpha wave, the most dominant brainwave, is 10hz. Coincidental that 10 fit in a second, I guess. http://www.jneurosci.org/content/37/42/10173 http://www.jneurosci.org/content/37/42/10173 Personally, I would prefer that seconds were slightly shorter (~.84 seconds), because then we could have decimal time, where there are 100 seconds in a minute, 100 minutes in an hour and 10 hours in a day. Mm, would be soo satisfying. Useless, but satisfying.

qubex 7y ago
Technically time is decimal in the SInsystem because the unit is the second s and the usual decimal power names apply. It’s just that we have standard names for various non decimal multiples. Yes, as with anything that lies beyond the clause “well technically...” this actually kind of vindicates the opposing campus point, so yeah...

anoncake 7y ago

> There are millions of people in the world who believe that Goebbels introduced the tuning to make people feel more anxious. That's absurd. It's more likely Goebbels did that to demonstrate that Germany was no longer bound to Article 282 (22) of the Treaty of Versailles, which forced it to accept the 435hz standard. See: Jerry L. Weinstein, Musical Pitch and International Agreement. The American Journal of International Law Vol. 46, No. 2 (Apr., 1952), pp. 341-343, https://www.jstor.org/stable/2194075 https://www.jstor.org/stable/2194075

karmakaze 7y ago

It was funny how the numerology is bunk but then we use 440 rather than 439 because it's prime. It all makes sense of course unless you're in the believer camp then it could seem arbitrary.