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Every time I visit London, I'm puzzled by the seeming paradox. That system was dug in the 1800s, when light-bulbs and bicycles were still in beta. Over 150 yea

by netcan 7y ago

Every time I visit London, I'm puzzled by the seeming paradox. That system was dug in the 1800s, when light-bulbs and bicycles were still in beta. Over 150 years later, a project like that is out of reach for nearly all western cities. It's like the "we can't go to the moon anymore." It just offends my/our intuition about progress.

rswail 7y ago
The reason the British Empire flourished is because, well, the British Empire flourished. The industrial revolution began in the UK, the engineering of the time was lead by the British. So yes, London got the tube, it got sewerage, it got all wonders of public facility because it was a win-win. Proclaimed the glory of the Empire to keep others in check and provide the people with the spoils of Empire.
- roboys 7y ago
  To be fair, robbing indigenous people at gun point is a very profitable endeavor and why Britain flourished. Fact: There is no chance of Britian reaching its former greatness without this crucial criminal component.
  - JoeAltmaier 7y ago
    Fact: that was made up
    - roboys 7y ago
      You may not know the economic history of Britain, if you disagree. Peak of British economy was after it invaded/sabotaged/drugged/then robbed two of the richest civilizations at that point (accounting for 50% of world GDP) China & India. The beginning of British decline started in the early 1900s with the end of the opium trade (which at its peak, in ~1895, accounted for 35% of Britain's GDP) Do you think UK, China, India, US, Germany, etc... placed at the same starting point, would result in UK economic victory without foul play? UK can't even beat California on many economic metrics after centuries of historical advantages, lol.
      - JoeAltmaier 7y ago
        Not the issue. The made-up part was, that's the only way for Britain to move back up in the world. So many ways for that to happen - tech, information, space, diplomacy to name a few.
mattlondon 7y ago
The Victorians generally did not give a crap about "old" stuff and willfully and frequently built/rebuilt/demolished/dug-up/forced-out pretty much whatever they wanted or was in their way to get stuff done. They also had a large and cheap labor force with questionable safety protections. These days we spend a lot of effort on "preserving" older things, you cant just railroad (pun intended!) your way through a suburb demolishing things to lay railway tracks more or less where you want, and obviously there is a lot more focus now on individual worker safety (for the better). I guess they were able to build things during the "wild west" where rules, procedures, , respect for individual rights & safety, and laws had not yet caught up with industrialisation.
- netcan 7y ago
  On the labour point.. it still doesn't make sense to me. Sure, they had very poor oh&s but they also used shovels to dig and baskets to remove fill. It just doesn't seem like the extra cost of safe work practices could possibly offset the productive bump from machinery.

by netcan 7y ago

rswail 7y ago

The reason the British Empire flourished is because, well, the British Empire flourished. The industrial revolution began in the UK, the engineering of the time was lead by the British. So yes, London got the tube, it got sewerage, it got all wonders of public facility because it was a win-win. Proclaimed the glory of the Empire to keep others in check and provide the people with the spoils of Empire.

roboys 7y ago
To be fair, robbing indigenous people at gun point is a very profitable endeavor and why Britain flourished. Fact: There is no chance of Britian reaching its former greatness without this crucial criminal component.
- JoeAltmaier 7y ago
  Fact: that was made up
  - roboys 7y ago
    You may not know the economic history of Britain, if you disagree. Peak of British economy was after it invaded/sabotaged/drugged/then robbed two of the richest civilizations at that point (accounting for 50% of world GDP) China & India. The beginning of British decline started in the early 1900s with the end of the opium trade (which at its peak, in ~1895, accounted for 35% of Britain's GDP) Do you think UK, China, India, US, Germany, etc... placed at the same starting point, would result in UK economic victory without foul play? UK can't even beat California on many economic metrics after centuries of historical advantages, lol.
    - JoeAltmaier 7y ago
      Not the issue. The made-up part was, that's the only way for Britain to move back up in the world. So many ways for that to happen - tech, information, space, diplomacy to name a few.

mattlondon 7y ago

The Victorians generally did not give a crap about "old" stuff and willfully and frequently built/rebuilt/demolished/dug-up/forced-out pretty much whatever they wanted or was in their way to get stuff done. They also had a large and cheap labor force with questionable safety protections. These days we spend a lot of effort on "preserving" older things, you cant just railroad (pun intended!) your way through a suburb demolishing things to lay railway tracks more or less where you want, and obviously there is a lot more focus now on individual worker safety (for the better). I guess they were able to build things during the "wild west" where rules, procedures, , respect for individual rights & safety, and laws had not yet caught up with industrialisation.

netcan 7y ago
On the labour point.. it still doesn't make sense to me. Sure, they had very poor oh&s but they also used shovels to dig and baskets to remove fill. It just doesn't seem like the extra cost of safe work practices could possibly offset the productive bump from machinery.