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As a naturalized US citizen, I had to give up my Japanese citizenship. It was a hard decision to make since half my immediate family is still Japanese and I sti

by omot 7y ago

As a naturalized US citizen, I had to give up my Japanese citizenship. It was a hard decision to make since half my immediate family is still Japanese and I still love Japan. In part I never forgave Japan that they forced me to make this decision. Which is why I'm excited for a more ethnically diverse Japan. As a resident of the Bay Area I only see diversity as an advantage of introducing new thoughts and creativity. It comes with challenges of lower trust among neighbors. Though, I learned that through respectful interactions and an open mind the perspectives of someone completely different shaped me into a more mature human being, and it made me realize that my fears were only conjectures derived from no real evidence. In this transition to a more diverse Japan, will the world lose some of its traditional beauty? Undoubtedly. But, I would like to argue that Japan is a developed country where it already lost a significant amount of its traditional culture during its modernization, and new distinctly Japanese culture emerged from the ashes of the old. I can't wait for the new culture that will emerge from a ethnically diverse Japan. And hopefully they'll let me be Japanese again, as I was born there and still dearly love it.

random42_ 7y ago
Did you actually had to give up on your Japanese citizenship? I know that when taking the oath you reject all other citizenship you may have but AFAIK this is not enforced, meaning you don't have to go to your embassy and formally require to give up on your citizenship. Really curious to know more about this.
- bliblah 7y ago
  This is very accurate, countries do not share citizenship data so it is impossible for them to know who has 2 or more passports. I have several friends that have remained in possessions of their previous passports and still renew them in case they ever need them.
  - rockinghigh 7y ago
    No, it’s highly dependent on the countries involved. When you apply for the second citizenship, that country knows about your first citizenship. They can decide to force you to choose one. And the first country may or may not allow you to give up that citizenship. As an example, you can read about dual citizenship in Europe here: https://m.dw.com/cda/en/dual-citizenship-in-europe-which-rules-apply-where/a-38174853 https://m.dw.com/cda/en/dual-citizenship-in-europe-which-rul... You will see that the rules differ by country.
    - mvid 7y ago
      Yes, but I believe the point is that you can lie that you gave up the first one, even if you didn’t. There isn’t a way of checking
      - Xeago 7y ago
        There’s quite a few territories where you need to get a license/seal/stamp/signature from the administration of your current citizenship. Going deeper, it’s then common for that request to only be authorized given the promise of the administration of the new citizenship to grand you this new citizenship. A two-way commit of sorts.
    - bliblah 7y ago
      You misunderstand. The USA does not have a list of Japanese Citizens, meaning that if a Japanese citizen decides to become and American one they have no concrete proof that he discarded his proof of Japanese citizenship (in this case a Passport) unless they reach out to Japan. Unless you are an international criminal the US will not waste time or resources requesting that information. This is true for most countries.
- pandaman 7y ago
  The US does not care if you have any other citizenships but some countries do. E.g. Japan will revoke its citizenship on the citizens who obtained another one [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_nationality_law#Loss_of_citizenship https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_nationality_law#Loss_...
- omot 7y ago
  I actually got work in Japan. My passport was expired, and I went to renew it. They always ask how you're staying in the states and to show evidence. At that point my green card was expired and I only had naturalization to show. At that point I had to give up my Japanese citizenship, in order to get a visa. I don't remember if that was the exact reason but I was able to get away with dual for a while. Maybe if I tried renewing it in Japan it wouldn't have been a problem?
  - distantaidenn 7y ago
    Ouch... Hopefully Japan will change this at some point, with the increase in international marriages. I've been living here long enough and paid enough taxes to consider becoming a citizen. But I wouldn't trade it for my US citizenship. Interesting aside. One of my Taiwanese friends got his Japanese citizenship, and thus renounced his Taiwanese. But plot twist: Taiwan allows (what's akin to) temporary renouncment. Now he's a dual citizen.
bassman9000 7y ago
If it changes too much, will it be the same Japan you left and loved?
- omot 7y ago
  Its probably unconditional love. Japan is like family for me.
spookybones 7y ago
Serious question: Hasn’t the the Bay Area become the antithesis of diversity and killed the local culture? I don’t just mean black culture, but also the beat culture, the Italian neighborhoods, etc.
- omot 7y ago
  Maybe in some bubbles. I lived in Utah and I frequently visit Japan. Comparatively its a no brainer, the Bay Area is way more diverse. When people talk about gentrification and how local culture is disappearing, from my perspective and historically speaking, the Bay Area is a place of constant change. People forget that this use to be one of the prime destination during the gold rush and the great depression. The Golden Gate Bridge welcomes immigrants that came in through the Pacific. The cities names are all in Spanish, because this used to be Mexican territory. San Bruno was used as a site for a internment camp for the Japanese. To me the era were living in right now is just another gold rush where skilled workers and hungry entrepreneur arrive hoping to strike it rich. This wave of migration happens to be predominantly white and Asian. Is that antithesis of diversity? I personally don't think so, its another wave of change in history. Like Japan trying to preserve its traditions, I understand the fear of change, but I think we need to embrace it and try to mitigate any problems that change may bring.

by omot 7y ago

random42_ 7y ago

Did you actually had to give up on your Japanese citizenship? I know that when taking the oath you reject all other citizenship you may have but AFAIK this is not enforced, meaning you don't have to go to your embassy and formally require to give up on your citizenship. Really curious to know more about this.

bliblah 7y ago
This is very accurate, countries do not share citizenship data so it is impossible for them to know who has 2 or more passports. I have several friends that have remained in possessions of their previous passports and still renew them in case they ever need them.
- rockinghigh 7y ago
  No, it’s highly dependent on the countries involved. When you apply for the second citizenship, that country knows about your first citizenship. They can decide to force you to choose one. And the first country may or may not allow you to give up that citizenship. As an example, you can read about dual citizenship in Europe here: https://m.dw.com/cda/en/dual-citizenship-in-europe-which-rules-apply-where/a-38174853 https://m.dw.com/cda/en/dual-citizenship-in-europe-which-rul... You will see that the rules differ by country.
  - mvid 7y ago
    Yes, but I believe the point is that you can lie that you gave up the first one, even if you didn’t. There isn’t a way of checking
    - Xeago 7y ago
      There’s quite a few territories where you need to get a license/seal/stamp/signature from the administration of your current citizenship. Going deeper, it’s then common for that request to only be authorized given the promise of the administration of the new citizenship to grand you this new citizenship. A two-way commit of sorts.
  - bliblah 7y ago
    You misunderstand. The USA does not have a list of Japanese Citizens, meaning that if a Japanese citizen decides to become and American one they have no concrete proof that he discarded his proof of Japanese citizenship (in this case a Passport) unless they reach out to Japan. Unless you are an international criminal the US will not waste time or resources requesting that information. This is true for most countries.
pandaman 7y ago
The US does not care if you have any other citizenships but some countries do. E.g. Japan will revoke its citizenship on the citizens who obtained another one [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_nationality_law#Loss_of_citizenship https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_nationality_law#Loss_...
omot 7y ago
I actually got work in Japan. My passport was expired, and I went to renew it. They always ask how you're staying in the states and to show evidence. At that point my green card was expired and I only had naturalization to show. At that point I had to give up my Japanese citizenship, in order to get a visa. I don't remember if that was the exact reason but I was able to get away with dual for a while. Maybe if I tried renewing it in Japan it wouldn't have been a problem?
- distantaidenn 7y ago
  Ouch... Hopefully Japan will change this at some point, with the increase in international marriages. I've been living here long enough and paid enough taxes to consider becoming a citizen. But I wouldn't trade it for my US citizenship. Interesting aside. One of my Taiwanese friends got his Japanese citizenship, and thus renounced his Taiwanese. But plot twist: Taiwan allows (what's akin to) temporary renouncment. Now he's a dual citizen.

bassman9000 7y ago

If it changes too much, will it be the same Japan you left and loved?

omot 7y ago
Its probably unconditional love. Japan is like family for me.

spookybones 7y ago

Serious question: Hasn’t the the Bay Area become the antithesis of diversity and killed the local culture? I don’t just mean black culture, but also the beat culture, the Italian neighborhoods, etc.

omot 7y ago
Maybe in some bubbles. I lived in Utah and I frequently visit Japan. Comparatively its a no brainer, the Bay Area is way more diverse. When people talk about gentrification and how local culture is disappearing, from my perspective and historically speaking, the Bay Area is a place of constant change. People forget that this use to be one of the prime destination during the gold rush and the great depression. The Golden Gate Bridge welcomes immigrants that came in through the Pacific. The cities names are all in Spanish, because this used to be Mexican territory. San Bruno was used as a site for a internment camp for the Japanese. To me the era were living in right now is just another gold rush where skilled workers and hungry entrepreneur arrive hoping to strike it rich. This wave of migration happens to be predominantly white and Asian. Is that antithesis of diversity? I personally don't think so, its another wave of change in history. Like Japan trying to preserve its traditions, I understand the fear of change, but I think we need to embrace it and try to mitigate any problems that change may bring.