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The Bloomberg article exacerbates the bigotry many Japanese have against their own fellow citizens. In the caption of the first picture: "She’s not all Japanes

The Bloomberg article exacerbates the bigotry many Japanese have against their own fellow citizens. In the caption of the first picture: "She’s not all Japanese, but she was Miss Universe Japan 2015." Yes, she is "all" Japanese. She grew up in Japan, with her Japanese mother, attending Japanese schools. This is the subtle bigotry toward people who are "half" (as they're called in Japan) rather than "dual". Many Japanese will always consider them "less Japanese" or outsiders. She had dual citizenship because of her father. When asked which citizenship she would she would choose, she said, 「もちろん、日本を選ぶわ。自分では、私はとことん日本人だと思っている。そう、１００％日本人よ。肌の色の違いは、その人となりとは全く関係ないはず」 "Of course I will choose Japan. I think of myself as thoroughly Japanese. 100% Japanese. It should have nothing to do with heredity, with a different skin color." https://www.sankei.com/premium/news/150429/prm1504290022-n3.html https://www.sankei.com/premium/news/150429/prm1504290022-n3....

Grustaf 7y ago
No it’s not bigotry to say that someone that is half-japanese is ‘not all Japanese”. Bigotry is if you treat her worse because of it. Citizenship may be “dual” but biological race isn’t, it has to add up to 100%. Clearly that is what they are referring to here. Not all countries are America, there are plenty of places with a pretty well defined ethnicity, like Japan.
55555 7y ago
The word Japanese can refer to both nationality and ethnicity, no?
hh3k0 7y ago
> Yes, she is "all" Japanese. She grew up in Japan, with her Japanese mother, attending Japanese schools. This is the subtle bigotry toward people who are "half" (as they're called in Japan) rather than "dual". Many Japanese will always consider them "less Japanese" or outsiders. Just because she qualifies as Japanese from your point of view doesn't mean that the Japanese have to view it like you. White savior complex much? I've spoken with Japanese friends about hafus and their point of view was that people do not materialize out of thin air, but rather are the genetic conglomerate of their ancestors (which is hard to argue against) and thus links in a chain -- which would make her less Japanese. And that seems fine to me, as long as she is not discriminated against for being viewed less Japanese.
- nabla9 7y ago
  Perceiving someone as 'not one of us' without discrimination is very rare, especially in Japan. Basically all Japanese citizens perceived as 'others' face heavy discrimination. Korean minority, burakumin, Ainu, etc.
- Tor3 7y ago
  > but rather are the genetic conglomerate of their ancestors (which is hard to argue against) and thus links in a chain But that's exactly it. It's not like that. Or shouldn't be. That's not what makes a person a part of a group (town, city, region, country, etc). It's a constraining, and wrong way of looking at things. It's something to grow out of. Heck, in my hometown we consider someone as 'from' this town (to translate the term we use, approximately) even if they're not born here, maybe they even moved here in their twenties, and maybe from another continent, maybe looking totally different; if they just 'fit in' and find their comfortable place here. If they bring on something new (combining culture/music from their background with something existing), even better. They are 100% part of what's us. Except for those of the never non-existent, but still tiny minority of the "you're not one of us" group. Those telling young girls (as did an old woman the other day, not in this town but out in the countryside) "you can't wear that traditional costume, you're not one of us" (the girl's grandfather was adopted from some place, or some such).
  - hh3k0 7y ago
    It is revolting how terribly arrogant your comment is, really. They don't have a "wrong way of looking at things" simply because it is not your way. And your way is by no means the way.
    - Tor3 7y ago
      I should maybe add 'in my opinion'. But in truth, I really believe it's wrong. It does not lead to anything positive, quite the contrary. And I've never seen a community become worse by moving into a more modern, open view on diversity and acceptance. And to focus: I really, truly mean that the idea that what "makes" you (and that's what I was commenting on) is your ancestors, is just wrong. Genetic chain? Well, so what, we're all a part of a genetic chain, and the same one at that, which goes back nearly four billion years. Take one step back to get the overview and it matters nothing (nor should it) who your father was.
coldtea 7y ago
>Yes, she is "all" Japanese. She grew up in Japan, with her Japanese mother, attending Japanese schools. This is the subtle bigotry toward people who are "half" (as they're called in Japan) rather than "dual". Many Japanese will always consider them "less Japanese" or outsiders. That's her culture and nationality (and even the culture part could be dual). They refer to her ethnicity and ancestry.
sridca 7y ago
> Many Japanese will always consider them "less Japanese" or outsiders. Isn't this true of other nations?
- Tor3 7y ago
  > Isn't this true of other nations? Not as a general rule, no. What makes the distinction for me is the dialect they speak and their way of speaking. Then I'll have them firmly identified as 'from that town', or 'that particular part of the country' and there's no way for me to think of them differently. Where their parents came from has no part of it for me or for most people. It's just not possible for my mind to think of somebody who speaks like a native (as they will, when they were born here or moved here as a child) as being any kind of "outsider". In my experience small children never make any distinction either, anywhere in the world. That comes later, and they learn it from their parents. That's when the problems start.
  - sridca 7y ago
    > In my experience small children never make any distinction either, anywhere in the world. Are you familiar with The Clarks' doll experiments? The doll experiment involved a child being presented with two dolls. Both of these dolls were completely identical except for the skin and hair color. One doll was white with yellow hair, while the other was brown with black hair. The child was then asked questions inquiring as to which one is the doll they would play with, which one is the nice doll, which one looks bad, which one has the nicer color, etc. The experiment showed a clear preference for the white doll among all children in the study. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenneth_and_Mamie_Clark#Doll_experiments https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenneth_and_Mamie_Clark#Doll_e... Though the effect was less intense for children from integrated schools.
    - Tor3 7y ago
      Yes, I'm aware of it. And I think it backs up what I mentioned - the Clark experiment was made with young children attending schools. That's way past the time when they've had time to soak up the attitudes around them. How does the experiment work with 1-year (or 2, up to maybe three year) old children? That's where my anecdotal experience comes from: they don't care. But I once heard a five year old boy complaining "I don't want to have to see naked people!" or some such thing. But he was from a country where that (nudeness) is made an issue. From other countries children of that age don't even notice or care. In other words, the complainer learned that from someone. That episode really stuck with me because I had never in my life heard a child opiniate about that before.
anthuman 7y ago
If you claim that she is all japanese, then aren't you denying her african-american roots? She is half japanese because half of her family and genetic history is from japan. The other half is from her african american father. Isn't it more bigoted to deny that half of her comes from her african american father? Also, there is a difference between ethnicity and nationality. She may be a full japanese national, but she is not a full ethnic japanese. Just like charlize theron could be a south african national, but you wouldn't call her a black woman. I agree with her that being a japanese national should have nothing to do with heredity or skin color, but heredity and skin color most definitely has something to do with the japanese ethnicity. To claim otherwise is to claim there is no suching thing as a japanese ethnicity and it destroys any sense of human diversity that we all pretend to love while trying to actively destroy human diversity.
- havill 7y ago
  > heredity and skin color most definitely has something to do with the japanese ethnicity. Only to racists. Just as being Jewish is an ethnicity (as well as a religion), you don't have to be white or have Jewish parents to be of Jewish ethnicity. More and more Japanese Nationals with mixed race are born all the time, and raised completely in Japan and only speak Japanese, yet would "pass as white." And when they're famous and appear in the media, they are considered by most of the Japanese audience to be ethnically Japanese. On the other hand, there are quite a few Japanese-Americans whose parents are both racially "100%" Japanese, yet because they speak awful or nonexistent Japanese and or "act American" or "have American values", are not considered to be ethnically Japanese.
  - blub 7y ago
    I've included a definition of racism here for you: "prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against someone of a different race based on the belief that one's own race is superior". Given that there is no prejudice or antagonism present, your accusation of racism is nonsense. In fact you're doing something as equally poisonous as racists, except in reverse: pretending that there is no race, no ethnicity. Erasing the heritage of people with a sponge in order to depict a so-called utopia that nobody except extremists wants.
lm28469 7y ago
I don't think "bigotry" means what you think it means. It applies to opinions, as in being intolerant to people who have different opinions than yours, not origins/ethnicity/&c.

Grustaf 7y ago

No it’s not bigotry to say that someone that is half-japanese is ‘not all Japanese”. Bigotry is if you treat her worse because of it. Citizenship may be “dual” but biological race isn’t, it has to add up to 100%. Clearly that is what they are referring to here. Not all countries are America, there are plenty of places with a pretty well defined ethnicity, like Japan.

55555 7y ago

The word Japanese can refer to both nationality and ethnicity, no?

hh3k0 7y ago

> Yes, she is "all" Japanese. She grew up in Japan, with her Japanese mother, attending Japanese schools. This is the subtle bigotry toward people who are "half" (as they're called in Japan) rather than "dual". Many Japanese will always consider them "less Japanese" or outsiders. Just because she qualifies as Japanese from your point of view doesn't mean that the Japanese have to view it like you. White savior complex much? I've spoken with Japanese friends about hafus and their point of view was that people do not materialize out of thin air, but rather are the genetic conglomerate of their ancestors (which is hard to argue against) and thus links in a chain -- which would make her less Japanese. And that seems fine to me, as long as she is not discriminated against for being viewed less Japanese.

nabla9 7y ago
Perceiving someone as 'not one of us' without discrimination is very rare, especially in Japan. Basically all Japanese citizens perceived as 'others' face heavy discrimination. Korean minority, burakumin, Ainu, etc.
Tor3 7y ago
> but rather are the genetic conglomerate of their ancestors (which is hard to argue against) and thus links in a chain But that's exactly it. It's not like that. Or shouldn't be. That's not what makes a person a part of a group (town, city, region, country, etc). It's a constraining, and wrong way of looking at things. It's something to grow out of. Heck, in my hometown we consider someone as 'from' this town (to translate the term we use, approximately) even if they're not born here, maybe they even moved here in their twenties, and maybe from another continent, maybe looking totally different; if they just 'fit in' and find their comfortable place here. If they bring on something new (combining culture/music from their background with something existing), even better. They are 100% part of what's us. Except for those of the never non-existent, but still tiny minority of the "you're not one of us" group. Those telling young girls (as did an old woman the other day, not in this town but out in the countryside) "you can't wear that traditional costume, you're not one of us" (the girl's grandfather was adopted from some place, or some such).
- hh3k0 7y ago
  It is revolting how terribly arrogant your comment is, really. They don't have a "wrong way of looking at things" simply because it is not your way. And your way is by no means the way.
  - Tor3 7y ago
    I should maybe add 'in my opinion'. But in truth, I really believe it's wrong. It does not lead to anything positive, quite the contrary. And I've never seen a community become worse by moving into a more modern, open view on diversity and acceptance. And to focus: I really, truly mean that the idea that what "makes" you (and that's what I was commenting on) is your ancestors, is just wrong. Genetic chain? Well, so what, we're all a part of a genetic chain, and the same one at that, which goes back nearly four billion years. Take one step back to get the overview and it matters nothing (nor should it) who your father was.

coldtea 7y ago

sridca 7y ago

> Many Japanese will always consider them "less Japanese" or outsiders. Isn't this true of other nations?

Tor3 7y ago
> Isn't this true of other nations? Not as a general rule, no. What makes the distinction for me is the dialect they speak and their way of speaking. Then I'll have them firmly identified as 'from that town', or 'that particular part of the country' and there's no way for me to think of them differently. Where their parents came from has no part of it for me or for most people. It's just not possible for my mind to think of somebody who speaks like a native (as they will, when they were born here or moved here as a child) as being any kind of "outsider". In my experience small children never make any distinction either, anywhere in the world. That comes later, and they learn it from their parents. That's when the problems start.
- sridca 7y ago
  > In my experience small children never make any distinction either, anywhere in the world. Are you familiar with The Clarks' doll experiments? The doll experiment involved a child being presented with two dolls. Both of these dolls were completely identical except for the skin and hair color. One doll was white with yellow hair, while the other was brown with black hair. The child was then asked questions inquiring as to which one is the doll they would play with, which one is the nice doll, which one looks bad, which one has the nicer color, etc. The experiment showed a clear preference for the white doll among all children in the study. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenneth_and_Mamie_Clark#Doll_experiments https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenneth_and_Mamie_Clark#Doll_e... Though the effect was less intense for children from integrated schools.
  - Tor3 7y ago
    Yes, I'm aware of it. And I think it backs up what I mentioned - the Clark experiment was made with young children attending schools. That's way past the time when they've had time to soak up the attitudes around them. How does the experiment work with 1-year (or 2, up to maybe three year) old children? That's where my anecdotal experience comes from: they don't care. But I once heard a five year old boy complaining "I don't want to have to see naked people!" or some such thing. But he was from a country where that (nudeness) is made an issue. From other countries children of that age don't even notice or care. In other words, the complainer learned that from someone. That episode really stuck with me because I had never in my life heard a child opiniate about that before.

anthuman 7y ago

If you claim that she is all japanese, then aren't you denying her african-american roots? She is half japanese because half of her family and genetic history is from japan. The other half is from her african american father. Isn't it more bigoted to deny that half of her comes from her african american father? Also, there is a difference between ethnicity and nationality. She may be a full japanese national, but she is not a full ethnic japanese. Just like charlize theron could be a south african national, but you wouldn't call her a black woman. I agree with her that being a japanese national should have nothing to do with heredity or skin color, but heredity and skin color most definitely has something to do with the japanese ethnicity. To claim otherwise is to claim there is no suching thing as a japanese ethnicity and it destroys any sense of human diversity that we all pretend to love while trying to actively destroy human diversity.

havill 7y ago
> heredity and skin color most definitely has something to do with the japanese ethnicity. Only to racists. Just as being Jewish is an ethnicity (as well as a religion), you don't have to be white or have Jewish parents to be of Jewish ethnicity. More and more Japanese Nationals with mixed race are born all the time, and raised completely in Japan and only speak Japanese, yet would "pass as white." And when they're famous and appear in the media, they are considered by most of the Japanese audience to be ethnically Japanese. On the other hand, there are quite a few Japanese-Americans whose parents are both racially "100%" Japanese, yet because they speak awful or nonexistent Japanese and or "act American" or "have American values", are not considered to be ethnically Japanese.
- blub 7y ago
  I've included a definition of racism here for you: "prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against someone of a different race based on the belief that one's own race is superior". Given that there is no prejudice or antagonism present, your accusation of racism is nonsense. In fact you're doing something as equally poisonous as racists, except in reverse: pretending that there is no race, no ethnicity. Erasing the heritage of people with a sponge in order to depict a so-called utopia that nobody except extremists wants.

lm28469 7y ago

I don't think "bigotry" means what you think it means. It applies to opinions, as in being intolerant to people who have different opinions than yours, not origins/ethnicity/&c.