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Just out of curiosity - How have your interactions been with law enforcement during your life? Largely positive? Largely negative? Or non-existent? Do you, ove

Just out of curiosity - How have your interactions been with law enforcement during your life? Largely positive? Largely negative? Or non-existent? Do you, overall, feel that the US in largely a place where law-abiding citizens are free to go about their days?

asdfasgasdgasdg 7y ago
There are obviously serious problems with law enforcement in the united states. Although I think that these mostly manifest in face to face encounters with the poor, people of color, and the mentally ill. I can't think of many recent cases where local law enforcement's application of information technology resulted in gross injustice.
- llamataboot 7y ago
  The idealistic argument would be that moving to IT and algorithms reduces the gross amount of human bias that currently enters into the system. The reality may be far different as the algorithms themselved make the biases even less seen and less able to be contested.We're not in full minority report territory, but I think the worry is that added the ability to do near permanent surveillance to an already militarized police force that thinks they are fighting a war is not...going to turn out well for some of us.
  - asdfasgasdgasdg 7y ago
    > The idealistic argument would be that moving to IT and algorithms reduces the gross amount of human bias that currently enters into the system. That is not my argument. I am merely saying that I don't think facial recognition is going to present problems that outweigh its value as a law enforcement tool. There will no doubt be some abuses, just as there is of any new technology. I support regulation and intense scrutiny of how law enforcement uses these tools, to minimize the severity and duration of these abuses. But I don't think that means it's a good idea that Amazon's board should have to approve each entity attempting to use their services individually.
philwelch 7y ago
I’ll respond too, since I agree with the guy you’re responding to. By and large, I distrust American cops. I’ve had some bad experiences with them (though never catastrophic) but I’m well-aware that some people have had it far worse. I don’t have a problem with facial recognition software being used by police. I have concerns about equipping police with MRAP vehicles, flashbangs, tasers, body armor, rifles, tear gas, and a few dozen other things, but not facial recognition. Why should I be concerned?
- IOT_Apprentice 7y ago
  So it is ok that China is using Facial Recognition and active surveillance to oppress, as long as it is not in your backyard? https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/22/world/asia/china-surveillance-xinjiang.html https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/22/world/asia/china-surveill...
  - philwelch 7y ago
    I’m not in favor of doing business with the Chinese government. Pretty sure the Chinese are capable of developing the technology themselves, anyway.
manigandham 7y ago
All positive. Any negative experiences were in court, not the frontline police patrols. There are many layers to enforcement and it might be surprising where exactly the biggest problems are. Adding increasing automation when the foundations aren't great is a bad idea though. There are more stories everyday about people finding trouble with the law because of some software system with no human oversight.

asdfasgasdgasdg 7y ago

There are obviously serious problems with law enforcement in the united states. Although I think that these mostly manifest in face to face encounters with the poor, people of color, and the mentally ill. I can't think of many recent cases where local law enforcement's application of information technology resulted in gross injustice.

llamataboot 7y ago
The idealistic argument would be that moving to IT and algorithms reduces the gross amount of human bias that currently enters into the system. The reality may be far different as the algorithms themselved make the biases even less seen and less able to be contested.We're not in full minority report territory, but I think the worry is that added the ability to do near permanent surveillance to an already militarized police force that thinks they are fighting a war is not...going to turn out well for some of us.
- asdfasgasdgasdg 7y ago
  > The idealistic argument would be that moving to IT and algorithms reduces the gross amount of human bias that currently enters into the system. That is not my argument. I am merely saying that I don't think facial recognition is going to present problems that outweigh its value as a law enforcement tool. There will no doubt be some abuses, just as there is of any new technology. I support regulation and intense scrutiny of how law enforcement uses these tools, to minimize the severity and duration of these abuses. But I don't think that means it's a good idea that Amazon's board should have to approve each entity attempting to use their services individually.

philwelch 7y ago

I’ll respond too, since I agree with the guy you’re responding to. By and large, I distrust American cops. I’ve had some bad experiences with them (though never catastrophic) but I’m well-aware that some people have had it far worse. I don’t have a problem with facial recognition software being used by police. I have concerns about equipping police with MRAP vehicles, flashbangs, tasers, body armor, rifles, tear gas, and a few dozen other things, but not facial recognition. Why should I be concerned?

IOT_Apprentice 7y ago
So it is ok that China is using Facial Recognition and active surveillance to oppress, as long as it is not in your backyard? https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/22/world/asia/china-surveillance-xinjiang.html https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/22/world/asia/china-surveill...
- philwelch 7y ago
  I’m not in favor of doing business with the Chinese government. Pretty sure the Chinese are capable of developing the technology themselves, anyway.

manigandham 7y ago

All positive. Any negative experiences were in court, not the frontline police patrols. There are many layers to enforcement and it might be surprising where exactly the biggest problems are. Adding increasing automation when the foundations aren't great is a bad idea though. There are more stories everyday about people finding trouble with the law because of some software system with no human oversight.