4 ms·

I'm not homosexual, but have you seen the portrayls of such on the likes of 'next top model', 'queer eye...', and honestly just about any mainstream media now

I'm not homosexual, but have you seen the portrayls of such on the likes of 'next top model', 'queer eye...', and honestly just about any mainstream media now that I think about it. They're petty much all caricatures of 'offensively eccentric negative-female- characteristics high-pitched limp-wristed men with obsessions for fashion and celebrity culture'. Its exactly the same thing and pretty standard...if i was less cynical, id think it should of created more of an uproar... I'm sure I could come up with examples for the other groups...

TheHegemon 7y ago
I mean this are slightly more excusable because they're supposed to the host's actual personality. Whereas in a sitcom it's what the writer's determine the character is supposed to act like.
fetus8 7y ago
I don't know if your description of the men on Queer Eye is apt. It's a reality show, which admittedly doesn't mean the hosts aren't acting, but the show is hosted by a cast of all homosexual men. Being in the age we're in, it's easy to go find more content that shows the hosts aren't acting for Queer Eye, and perhaps they're being their genuine selves. Jonathon Van Ness, has a podcast, and has done some Youtube content over the years, and doesn't seem to portray a different "character" than he does on QE. Mainstream media, especially in the last 10 years, has really changed the way homosexuals, and other LGBTQ+ are presented and seen. I would argue that it's a lot less problematic, and more genuine than it's ever been. HBO's 'Looking' did a decent job of portraying the spectrum of gay men that exist today. (Not a particularly great show otherwise). Amazon's 'Transparent' does an incredible job of highlighting the fact that sexuality exists on a spectrum, and those people can be hyper-fem, hyper-masc, and anywhere in between. As a gay nerd, I personally think it's important we see all kinds of LGBTQ+ identifying people, and shows like Queer Eye have done that.
- mcguire 7y ago
  I haven't seen the reboot of Queer Eye, but most of the cast of the original were hardly stereotypical. Ted Allen?
  - ACow_Adonis 7y ago
    I admit, I had no idea there was a reboot, and I don't know who Ted Allen is :p
    - CrowFly 7y ago
      We know! You made it very clear you're "not a homosexual." And we believe you.
    - mcguire 7y ago
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queer_Eye https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queer_Eye
- ACow_Adonis 7y ago
  ug, honestly I don't want to go down this rabbit hole now, but there's no contradiction between "actually being that way in real life" and making money off of projecting a negative stereotype in mainstream culture. There's real bored obsessive housewives, black inner city gangsters, Mormons with large families, and yes, even people who act a bit like Sheldon. But the thing about culture is that negative portrayls accentuate those behaviors and supress their contrasts in general cultural visibility. The portrayls of male homosexuality has everything to do with a particular cultural expression and shoeboxing in western culture. And like the big bang theory, there's a fine line and tension between exposure and acceptance of a subculture as a good thing, and a mockery/caricature. obviously I'm all down on the negative side, i feel bbt is unwatchable but I knew other nerds where I used to work who liked it. It's not my place, but given my similar negative feelings towards hyper-gender- portrayls of femininity (and that's generally what's emphasised in mainstream portrayls of gays) celebrity and fashion, and the gay people I do know IRL (we're not in America), i almost feel offended for them. At a higher level though, I'd point out that using YouTube as an example of where someone 'seems the same as their character' is highly flawed. By now, I would hope everyone assumes all celebrities are playing characters all the time in all media. it's literally their product...
msla 7y ago
Are there any trans main characters in a broadcast TV series? Not Netflix original, not Hulu, not satellite or cable, but ABC/NBC/CBS/Fox free-to-air broadcast TV. I can't think of any off the top of my head, and I think that comes down to the demographic targeted by broadcast TV: People fifty or older. https://www.marketingcharts.com/television/tv-audiences-and-consumption-106649 https://www.marketingcharts.com/television/tv-audiences-and-... > According to the analysis of audiences of 5 networks measured using Nielsen’s Digital Content Ratings in September 2018, 59% of live TV viewers ages 13 and older were in the 55+ group, compared to just 5% who were aged 13-24. The median age of a live TV viewer worked out to 56. MarketingCharts’ own research – US Media Audience Demographics – has found that weekly broadcast TV viewers are skewing older over time, and cable TV viewers also have a growing skew towards older adults. Also, let's look at the other broadcast medium, radio: https://www.marketingcharts.com/demographics-and-audiences/men-demographics-and-audiences-46338 https://www.marketingcharts.com/demographics-and-audiences/m... > While the age distribution of network radio listeners skews towards the 45+ demographic, a large share of Americans of all ages listen to network radio. The study also points out that listeners are spread across the US and tend to represent an attractive group in terms of their income and education levels. Also graying, but more slowly. And, yes, it's a trend: https://www.westwoodone.com/2015/06/24/this-just-in-new-data-on-tv-viewing-levels-and-demographics/ https://www.westwoodone.com/2015/06/24/this-just-in-new-data... (Graph on the bottom shows median age of radio listeners increasing.) My point is this: Shows made for broadcast media are not going to change because the people making those shows know their demographic and aren't going to shed viewers by doing things their audience considers controversial. Viewership numbers are low enough already. Broadcast media is in a death spiral and whatever stereotypes, representation, and lack of representation it currently has is what it's going to have from now until it goes dark.
- ppseafield 7y ago
  Chaz Bono was on The Bold and the Beautiful, but as a guest character. Sadly trans inclusion in casting has been pretty damn abysmal across the board. My impression is that most audiences are actually willing to watch something different, but the people making casting choices chose often not to cast them.
ppseafield 7y ago
Well, we now have positive queer role models in other shows mixed in with those caricatures, which is leaps and bounds above what we used to have. Go back and watch In Living Color's Men On Film, which is one of the more "positive" portrayals. I find it incredibly cringeworthy today. Shows like Next Top Model and Queer Eye play up their queerness for ratings, but that's actually progress: queer folks (actually played by other queer folks, not straight people parodying us) are being queer on camera, and people want to watch them for that. Millions of people. It's actually the point of those shows. That's huge! Commonly people's first reaction to things they don't understand or things that are unusual is fear. I used to resent Will and Grace for being over the top, contrived, and playing on stereotypes. But I think, like Big Bang Theory, however cringeworthy the humor is, they've both put gay folks and nerdiness in prime television slots. People watch them, and they become less "foreign" to millions of televison watchers. They're made relateable (simply because not as many folks would watch it if it wasn't), and in turn nerdiness and queerness are made relateable and understandable. I don't need to watch either, but... I don't have to. It's not for me.

TheHegemon 7y ago

I mean this are slightly more excusable because they're supposed to the host's actual personality. Whereas in a sitcom it's what the writer's determine the character is supposed to act like.

fetus8 7y ago

I don't know if your description of the men on Queer Eye is apt. It's a reality show, which admittedly doesn't mean the hosts aren't acting, but the show is hosted by a cast of all homosexual men. Being in the age we're in, it's easy to go find more content that shows the hosts aren't acting for Queer Eye, and perhaps they're being their genuine selves. Jonathon Van Ness, has a podcast, and has done some Youtube content over the years, and doesn't seem to portray a different "character" than he does on QE. Mainstream media, especially in the last 10 years, has really changed the way homosexuals, and other LGBTQ+ are presented and seen. I would argue that it's a lot less problematic, and more genuine than it's ever been. HBO's 'Looking' did a decent job of portraying the spectrum of gay men that exist today. (Not a particularly great show otherwise). Amazon's 'Transparent' does an incredible job of highlighting the fact that sexuality exists on a spectrum, and those people can be hyper-fem, hyper-masc, and anywhere in between. As a gay nerd, I personally think it's important we see all kinds of LGBTQ+ identifying people, and shows like Queer Eye have done that.

mcguire 7y ago
I haven't seen the reboot of Queer Eye, but most of the cast of the original were hardly stereotypical. Ted Allen?
- ACow_Adonis 7y ago
  I admit, I had no idea there was a reboot, and I don't know who Ted Allen is :p
  - CrowFly 7y ago
    We know! You made it very clear you're "not a homosexual." And we believe you.
  - mcguire 7y ago
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queer_Eye https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queer_Eye
ACow_Adonis 7y ago
ug, honestly I don't want to go down this rabbit hole now, but there's no contradiction between "actually being that way in real life" and making money off of projecting a negative stereotype in mainstream culture. There's real bored obsessive housewives, black inner city gangsters, Mormons with large families, and yes, even people who act a bit like Sheldon. But the thing about culture is that negative portrayls accentuate those behaviors and supress their contrasts in general cultural visibility. The portrayls of male homosexuality has everything to do with a particular cultural expression and shoeboxing in western culture. And like the big bang theory, there's a fine line and tension between exposure and acceptance of a subculture as a good thing, and a mockery/caricature. obviously I'm all down on the negative side, i feel bbt is unwatchable but I knew other nerds where I used to work who liked it. It's not my place, but given my similar negative feelings towards hyper-gender- portrayls of femininity (and that's generally what's emphasised in mainstream portrayls of gays) celebrity and fashion, and the gay people I do know IRL (we're not in America), i almost feel offended for them. At a higher level though, I'd point out that using YouTube as an example of where someone 'seems the same as their character' is highly flawed. By now, I would hope everyone assumes all celebrities are playing characters all the time in all media. it's literally their product...

msla 7y ago

Are there any trans main characters in a broadcast TV series? Not Netflix original, not Hulu, not satellite or cable, but ABC/NBC/CBS/Fox free-to-air broadcast TV. I can't think of any off the top of my head, and I think that comes down to the demographic targeted by broadcast TV: People fifty or older. https://www.marketingcharts.com/television/tv-audiences-and-consumption-106649 https://www.marketingcharts.com/television/tv-audiences-and-... > According to the analysis of audiences of 5 networks measured using Nielsen’s Digital Content Ratings in September 2018, 59% of live TV viewers ages 13 and older were in the 55+ group, compared to just 5% who were aged 13-24. The median age of a live TV viewer worked out to 56. MarketingCharts’ own research – US Media Audience Demographics – has found that weekly broadcast TV viewers are skewing older over time, and cable TV viewers also have a growing skew towards older adults. Also, let's look at the other broadcast medium, radio: https://www.marketingcharts.com/demographics-and-audiences/men-demographics-and-audiences-46338 https://www.marketingcharts.com/demographics-and-audiences/m... > While the age distribution of network radio listeners skews towards the 45+ demographic, a large share of Americans of all ages listen to network radio. The study also points out that listeners are spread across the US and tend to represent an attractive group in terms of their income and education levels. Also graying, but more slowly. And, yes, it's a trend: https://www.westwoodone.com/2015/06/24/this-just-in-new-data-on-tv-viewing-levels-and-demographics/ https://www.westwoodone.com/2015/06/24/this-just-in-new-data... (Graph on the bottom shows median age of radio listeners increasing.) My point is this: Shows made for broadcast media are not going to change because the people making those shows know their demographic and aren't going to shed viewers by doing things their audience considers controversial. Viewership numbers are low enough already. Broadcast media is in a death spiral and whatever stereotypes, representation, and lack of representation it currently has is what it's going to have from now until it goes dark.

ppseafield 7y ago
Chaz Bono was on The Bold and the Beautiful, but as a guest character. Sadly trans inclusion in casting has been pretty damn abysmal across the board. My impression is that most audiences are actually willing to watch something different, but the people making casting choices chose often not to cast them.

ppseafield 7y ago

Well, we now have positive queer role models in other shows mixed in with those caricatures, which is leaps and bounds above what we used to have. Go back and watch In Living Color's Men On Film, which is one of the more "positive" portrayals. I find it incredibly cringeworthy today. Shows like Next Top Model and Queer Eye play up their queerness for ratings, but that's actually progress: queer folks (actually played by other queer folks, not straight people parodying us) are being queer on camera, and people want to watch them for that. Millions of people. It's actually the point of those shows. That's huge! Commonly people's first reaction to things they don't understand or things that are unusual is fear. I used to resent Will and Grace for being over the top, contrived, and playing on stereotypes. But I think, like Big Bang Theory, however cringeworthy the humor is, they've both put gay folks and nerdiness in prime television slots. People watch them, and they become less "foreign" to millions of televison watchers. They're made relateable (simply because not as many folks would watch it if it wasn't), and in turn nerdiness and queerness are made relateable and understandable. I don't need to watch either, but... I don't have to. It's not for me.