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Unmatched opportunities for science, entrepreneurship, education, and technology. Population that's more welcoming to immigrants than any other place in the wor

Unmatched opportunities for science, entrepreneurship, education, and technology. Population that's more welcoming to immigrants than any other place in the world by far. Outdoors. Cleaner air and water. Cheap prices. Diversity. Optimistic, friendly, and humble people.

silverdemon 7y ago
This article suggests that its not "more welcoming to immigrants than any other place in the world by far" if a single private IM can get a guy banned for life. Still a great place to visit, but I'll take a burner phone next time. Maybe a Huawei device :)
- atemerev 7y ago
  They are not wrong. I am Russian living in Europe, occasionally visiting the US. Here in Switzerland, and to a lesser extent in the rest of the western Europe, I will always feel like an immigrant. It is cultural, there is always a divide of those who lived here before and those two came after. Perhaps only my children or their children will be able to fully integrate here. In the US it is different. There are a lot of hurdles to overcome to get there, including very insensitive TSA employees who have arbitrary powers over you, but when I come out of the airport building — I am an American. A Russian American, yes, but still there are nearly no differences in the attitude compared to everybody else. People are friendly and helpful, no matter if I speak with some strange accent or don’t look like a local. This is amazing, it is something that Americans take for granted, but it is a very big deal.
  - bloak 7y ago
    It's probably not possible to have both these things together in the long term: * A strong distinctive local culture. * Treating immigrants just like locals. Immigrants aren't going to learn the local dialect of Schwyzerdütsch unless you give them some kind of incentive, are they?
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]
    - n4r9 7y ago
      The way I see it based on atemerev's comment, the American treatment of immigrants is part of their strong local culture.
- cannonedhamster 7y ago
  A phone without data is just as likely to raise suspicion. It's come up before.
kaisn 7y ago
You must be joking or have never left the US for more than a few days.
- avocado4 7y ago
  I was born and lived most of my life in Europe.
  - S4M 7y ago
    Actually no European would say that, it would be (for example) "I was born in France and lived there, but also in Germany and Portugal".
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
mad_tortoise 7y ago
When you say unmatched that implies that nowhere else in the world can give opportunities in those fields that are equal, and that is plain wrong, in fact the USA is slipping from being the top in those. When you say population that's more welcoming to migrants, as someone from Africa, my own and those I know, our perception of the USA has changed so much that many people I know would not even consider moving there due to your current attitudes towards Muslim, Latin American and African migrants. When you say outdoors with cleaner air and water, I hear of your fracking, of Flint, of mass open cast mines across your country, of your president leaving the Paris climate agreement. When you say cheap prices, I've been all over the Third World and the USA is not cheap at all. When you say optimistic, friendly and humble, most of what I know of the USA's international actions is warmongering arrogance, of your far-right movements, of mass shootings and crazy abortion laws. I have many lovely American friends but they are not representative of the country that pushes a gun-friendly, war positive, women controlling message. That's why I wouldn't move to the US as it currently stands.
- avocado4 7y ago
  I'm European. I've travelled a lot for work though.
  - mad_tortoise 7y ago
    I'm not disputing your heritage or what you do, I'm disputing the content of your comment. You can challenge any points I made but that is a Third World perception of the USA.
zaarn 7y ago
I dunno if you have been to Europe but we have plenty of all that outdoors, clean air and water. From my location, it's less than 3 hours to the alps if you need even cleaner air and water with triple the outdoors. And lots of diversity there too, almost any place has somewhere around 2000 to 1500 years of history on the books, you can walk from your current location to another place with wildly different customs and traditions within an hour. You can say similar things about other parts of the world as well, not just Europe and the US too. Don't underestimate the rest of the world.
- avocado4 7y ago
  I'm born and raised in Europe.
  - zaarn 7y ago
    If you were, which I doubt, I would assume you didn't move around much or went to vacations in and around Europe. I would recommend doing that at some point, it's lovely.
- foldingmoney 7y ago
  Interestingly, 'villages of people with wildly different customs and traditions going back 1500-2000 years' is basically the opposite of what's meant by 'diversity' today, which is a high population of newly arrived immigrants. The former exists precisely because people historically didn't mingle much.
  - zaarn 7y ago
    The diversity of the US is largely imported, througout it's history starting from the first colonists, the US didn't have that much time to create it's own, cultural diversity to the extend that europe has yet. I don't think most people would qualify diversity as "lots of newly arrived immigrants", even those who champion diversity, they'll likely get closer to "people from lots of different life experiences".
    - 7y ago
hnarn 7y ago
As someone who, like you, was born in Europe, I feel like half of those points are open for debate and the other half are nonsensical. Are you saying that the nation that is the home of the Flint water crisis and has a weaker Environmental Protection Agency than ever is something you move to in order to get "cleaner air and water"? What do you mean when you say "diversity"? Have you been to the mid west? There are "un-diverse" and "diverse" areas of almost every country. People in the US are "optimistic"? "Friendly" and "humble"? The claim that Americans are "humble" when compared internationally is almost laughable (probably even by most americans), and I doubt that "friendliness" is really something you see drastic differences in around the globe. For the the last one there's no need to ask your gut because there are studies made regarding in what countries people feel the most optimistic about the future. As a matter of fact, most of them have pointed out China as the most optimistic country, which may make sense in a perspective of economical relative growth, but it doesn't on its own make me want to buy an apartment in Shanghai.
- avocado4 7y ago
  http://maps.who.int/airpollution/ http://maps.who.int/airpollution/
  - mcv 7y ago
    It is entirely unclear to me what that map represents. Is air pollution the worst in the Sahara, where practically nobody lives?
  - hnarn 7y ago
    In the zoomed out view shown by default the air quality is visualized as almost identical in Europe and the U.S. so I'm not sure what you're trying to say. I'd also encourage you to think about the correlation between air quality and population density -- compare the Scandinavian countries for example with the large swaths of land in the U.S. that have excellent air quality: they likely have one thing in common which is the amount of people that actually live there.
- golergka 7y ago
  > I doubt that "friendliness" is really something you see drastic differences in around the globe So, you have never been to Eastern Europe or CIS countries.
pablooliva 7y ago
To me, keeping immigrant kids in cages is not the least bit welcoming.
who-knows95 7y ago
sarcastic comments should have ~s after them. yours must be sarcastic as everything you have listed is fiction. -Says CareerAddict, “The average scientist in Switzerland receives an annual salary of roughly $95,000 (in Euros, of course), making Switzerland the country with the highest salary for scientists in the world. The best scientists can earn over $100,000 per year, though that is primarily in the private sector.” -An Investopedia article uses a World Bank report to rank Singapore as the top country for entrepreneurs (source: Best And Worst Countries For Entrepreneurs | Investopedia). -The UK has scooped the first spot in The 2019 Best Countries for Education, maintaining its rank from last year, according to a study by US News & World Report. -Japanese researchers have won many Nobel Prizes. Japan’s particularity lay down in the fact that they achieved results in every fields : from bio-technology to robotics. -The claim that the USA is the best for immigrants is hard to disprove in terms of study's. but, sociopolitical it is quite clear The USA isn't as welcoming as seen. cough trump cough -"outdoors" another almost impossible metric to prove/disprove, but i know for a fact that NZ (New Zealand) is held as the best place for adventurous activities. -Finland sits at the top of the list with a 90.68 EPI score.(EPI = Environmental performance index.) https://improb.com/top-cleanest-countries-in-the-world/ https://improb.com/top-cleanest-countries-in-the-world/ -do you know about the flint water crisis? Switzerland has the cleanest water levels in the water, to the point that many places don't even treat their water with chemicals. -cost of living is what i'll use to debunk the claim that america is "cheap" most expensive is Switzerland at COI= 121.16, USA is 20th at 69.91. below the USA at 99 countries, including at 24th the United Kingdom at 65.28, at 48 is Fiji with 50.93 and plenty more. https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/rankings_by_country.jsp https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/rankings_by_country.js... -Papua New Guinea is the most diverse, There are thousands of ethnic groups in the country, each with their own languages and customs. -supposedly china is the most optimistic, "The survey found that 94% of Chinese youth – defined in most cases as those aged 12-15 – were optimistic about their own country’s future, compared with 64% of their American counterparts. " -Portugal is the most friendly "Friendly attitude towards expats: 94%, Ease of making local friends: 58%, Expats likely to stay forever: 47%" https://www.forbes.com/sites/jennysouthan/2018/03/21/the-worlds-friendliest-countries-revealed/#498df67d54ea https://www.forbes.com/sites/jennysouthan/2018/03/21/the-wor... -i couldn't find any stats or studies about humble, but if you have to boast about how humble you are, you probably aren't. -------------------------------------------------------------------- Now let's talk about some things America is the leader the way in: -the US, Lesotho, Swaziland and new guinea are the only countries in the world that doesn't have paid mandate leave for mothers of newborns. -also the only country to not require companies to have paid vacation. -there is also no guarantee workers will get paid Sick days. -The US's education budget is the largest, but the results are shocking poor. -the US exports the most weapons in the world. -have the highest incarcerate % in the world. -highest healthcare costs, by a staggering amount. -babies death rate is the highest than any other industrialised country. -the wage gap between the "uber" rich and poorest is the biggest in the world. no hate, just don't enjoy the spread of false information.

silverdemon 7y ago

This article suggests that its not "more welcoming to immigrants than any other place in the world by far" if a single private IM can get a guy banned for life. Still a great place to visit, but I'll take a burner phone next time. Maybe a Huawei device :)

atemerev 7y ago
They are not wrong. I am Russian living in Europe, occasionally visiting the US. Here in Switzerland, and to a lesser extent in the rest of the western Europe, I will always feel like an immigrant. It is cultural, there is always a divide of those who lived here before and those two came after. Perhaps only my children or their children will be able to fully integrate here. In the US it is different. There are a lot of hurdles to overcome to get there, including very insensitive TSA employees who have arbitrary powers over you, but when I come out of the airport building — I am an American. A Russian American, yes, but still there are nearly no differences in the attitude compared to everybody else. People are friendly and helpful, no matter if I speak with some strange accent or don’t look like a local. This is amazing, it is something that Americans take for granted, but it is a very big deal.
- bloak 7y ago
  It's probably not possible to have both these things together in the long term: * A strong distinctive local culture. * Treating immigrants just like locals. Immigrants aren't going to learn the local dialect of Schwyzerdütsch unless you give them some kind of incentive, are they?
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
  - n4r9 7y ago
    The way I see it based on atemerev's comment, the American treatment of immigrants is part of their strong local culture.
cannonedhamster 7y ago
A phone without data is just as likely to raise suspicion. It's come up before.

kaisn 7y ago

You must be joking or have never left the US for more than a few days.

avocado4 7y ago
I was born and lived most of my life in Europe.
- S4M 7y ago
  Actually no European would say that, it would be (for example) "I was born in France and lived there, but also in Germany and Portugal".

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

mad_tortoise 7y ago

When you say unmatched that implies that nowhere else in the world can give opportunities in those fields that are equal, and that is plain wrong, in fact the USA is slipping from being the top in those. When you say population that's more welcoming to migrants, as someone from Africa, my own and those I know, our perception of the USA has changed so much that many people I know would not even consider moving there due to your current attitudes towards Muslim, Latin American and African migrants. When you say outdoors with cleaner air and water, I hear of your fracking, of Flint, of mass open cast mines across your country, of your president leaving the Paris climate agreement. When you say cheap prices, I've been all over the Third World and the USA is not cheap at all. When you say optimistic, friendly and humble, most of what I know of the USA's international actions is warmongering arrogance, of your far-right movements, of mass shootings and crazy abortion laws. I have many lovely American friends but they are not representative of the country that pushes a gun-friendly, war positive, women controlling message. That's why I wouldn't move to the US as it currently stands.

avocado4 7y ago
I'm European. I've travelled a lot for work though.
- mad_tortoise 7y ago
  I'm not disputing your heritage or what you do, I'm disputing the content of your comment. You can challenge any points I made but that is a Third World perception of the USA.

zaarn 7y ago

I dunno if you have been to Europe but we have plenty of all that outdoors, clean air and water. From my location, it's less than 3 hours to the alps if you need even cleaner air and water with triple the outdoors. And lots of diversity there too, almost any place has somewhere around 2000 to 1500 years of history on the books, you can walk from your current location to another place with wildly different customs and traditions within an hour. You can say similar things about other parts of the world as well, not just Europe and the US too. Don't underestimate the rest of the world.

avocado4 7y ago
I'm born and raised in Europe.
- zaarn 7y ago
  If you were, which I doubt, I would assume you didn't move around much or went to vacations in and around Europe. I would recommend doing that at some point, it's lovely.
foldingmoney 7y ago
Interestingly, 'villages of people with wildly different customs and traditions going back 1500-2000 years' is basically the opposite of what's meant by 'diversity' today, which is a high population of newly arrived immigrants. The former exists precisely because people historically didn't mingle much.
- zaarn 7y ago
  The diversity of the US is largely imported, througout it's history starting from the first colonists, the US didn't have that much time to create it's own, cultural diversity to the extend that europe has yet. I don't think most people would qualify diversity as "lots of newly arrived immigrants", even those who champion diversity, they'll likely get closer to "people from lots of different life experiences".
  - 7y ago

hnarn 7y ago

As someone who, like you, was born in Europe, I feel like half of those points are open for debate and the other half are nonsensical. Are you saying that the nation that is the home of the Flint water crisis and has a weaker Environmental Protection Agency than ever is something you move to in order to get "cleaner air and water"? What do you mean when you say "diversity"? Have you been to the mid west? There are "un-diverse" and "diverse" areas of almost every country. People in the US are "optimistic"? "Friendly" and "humble"? The claim that Americans are "humble" when compared internationally is almost laughable (probably even by most americans), and I doubt that "friendliness" is really something you see drastic differences in around the globe. For the the last one there's no need to ask your gut because there are studies made regarding in what countries people feel the most optimistic about the future. As a matter of fact, most of them have pointed out China as the most optimistic country, which may make sense in a perspective of economical relative growth, but it doesn't on its own make me want to buy an apartment in Shanghai.

avocado4 7y ago
http://maps.who.int/airpollution/ http://maps.who.int/airpollution/
- mcv 7y ago
  It is entirely unclear to me what that map represents. Is air pollution the worst in the Sahara, where practically nobody lives?
- hnarn 7y ago
  In the zoomed out view shown by default the air quality is visualized as almost identical in Europe and the U.S. so I'm not sure what you're trying to say. I'd also encourage you to think about the correlation between air quality and population density -- compare the Scandinavian countries for example with the large swaths of land in the U.S. that have excellent air quality: they likely have one thing in common which is the amount of people that actually live there.
golergka 7y ago
> I doubt that "friendliness" is really something you see drastic differences in around the globe So, you have never been to Eastern Europe or CIS countries.

pablooliva 7y ago

To me, keeping immigrant kids in cages is not the least bit welcoming.

who-knows95 7y ago

sarcastic comments should have ~s after them. yours must be sarcastic as everything you have listed is fiction. -Says CareerAddict, “The average scientist in Switzerland receives an annual salary of roughly $95,000 (in Euros, of course), making Switzerland the country with the highest salary for scientists in the world. The best scientists can earn over $100,000 per year, though that is primarily in the private sector.” -An Investopedia article uses a World Bank report to rank Singapore as the top country for entrepreneurs (source: Best And Worst Countries For Entrepreneurs | Investopedia). -The UK has scooped the first spot in The 2019 Best Countries for Education, maintaining its rank from last year, according to a study by US News & World Report. -Japanese researchers have won many Nobel Prizes. Japan’s particularity lay down in the fact that they achieved results in every fields : from bio-technology to robotics. -The claim that the USA is the best for immigrants is hard to disprove in terms of study's. but, sociopolitical it is quite clear The USA isn't as welcoming as seen. cough trump cough -"outdoors" another almost impossible metric to prove/disprove, but i know for a fact that NZ (New Zealand) is held as the best place for adventurous activities. -Finland sits at the top of the list with a 90.68 EPI score.(EPI = Environmental performance index.) https://improb.com/top-cleanest-countries-in-the-world/ https://improb.com/top-cleanest-countries-in-the-world/ -do you know about the flint water crisis? Switzerland has the cleanest water levels in the water, to the point that many places don't even treat their water with chemicals. -cost of living is what i'll use to debunk the claim that america is "cheap" most expensive is Switzerland at COI= 121.16, USA is 20th at 69.91. below the USA at 99 countries, including at 24th the United Kingdom at 65.28, at 48 is Fiji with 50.93 and plenty more. https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/rankings_by_country.jsp https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/rankings_by_country.js... -Papua New Guinea is the most diverse, There are thousands of ethnic groups in the country, each with their own languages and customs. -supposedly china is the most optimistic, "The survey found that 94% of Chinese youth – defined in most cases as those aged 12-15 – were optimistic about their own country’s future, compared with 64% of their American counterparts. " -Portugal is the most friendly "Friendly attitude towards expats: 94%, Ease of making local friends: 58%, Expats likely to stay forever: 47%" https://www.forbes.com/sites/jennysouthan/2018/03/21/the-worlds-friendliest-countries-revealed/#498df67d54ea https://www.forbes.com/sites/jennysouthan/2018/03/21/the-wor... -i couldn't find any stats or studies about humble, but if you have to boast about how humble you are, you probably aren't. -------------------------------------------------------------------- Now let's talk about some things America is the leader the way in: -the US, Lesotho, Swaziland and new guinea are the only countries in the world that doesn't have paid mandate leave for mothers of newborns. -also the only country to not require companies to have paid vacation. -there is also no guarantee workers will get paid Sick days. -The US's education budget is the largest, but the results are shocking poor. -the US exports the most weapons in the world. -have the highest incarcerate % in the world. -highest healthcare costs, by a staggering amount. -babies death rate is the highest than any other industrialised country. -the wage gap between the "uber" rich and poorest is the biggest in the world. no hate, just don't enjoy the spread of false information.