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Tesla has repeatedly made misleading statements about the ability of their systems, and has intentionally caused these crashes. It is a very well known fact am

Tesla has repeatedly made misleading statements about the ability of their systems, and has intentionally caused these crashes. It is a very well known fact among people working in these fields that a half automated system is a disaster waiting to strike. Human-only controls require the driver to stay focused. Invisible enhancements (power steering) and enhancements used in emergency situations (collision avoidance braking) are just that - enhancements. Fully automated systems also work well. Half-automated systems like Tesla's, where the computer works 99% of the time, cause operators to get distracted - nobody concentrate on watching paint dry for hours on end - and then when the system fails everyone dies in a giant flaming fireball. One can make excuses about how the exaggerated claims about the system's abilities were made by the marketing department (not engineering) or that it says in the manual to stay focused on driving the vehicle. But ultimately it's all BS. Because this: > it’s always the driver’s responsibility to operate the vehicle. Should have been this: > it's always the manufacturer's responsibility to make a vehicle that can be safely operate. And Teslas cannot be safely operated by any human when autopilot is on. There are plenty of people at Tesla that know this. And no, just because marketing went on a giant campaign to show everyone how Teslas drive themselves, does not mean that the organization as a whole is not responsible for those actions and for reining it in. This is no different than Boeing repeatedly misleading the public and regulators about the safety of their planes over the span of many decades in order to shave a few dollars here and there on R&D/manufacturing costs. Boeing is as responsible for those deaths as Tesla is for the ones caused by Autopilot.

zaroth 7y ago
Unfortunately I disagree with basically everything you’re saying. AutoPilot is perfectly safe if you look out the damn window while it’s operating. There are some disputed statistics saying that it is in fact safer on than off, even over the same type of miles. AutoPilot has in fact been safely operated for over a billion miles in the real world. Drivers need to look out the window. It is not in any way difficult to maintain situational awareness while operating under AutoPilot for extended periods of time. In fact I find it easier to stay alert for longer periods of driving — that is, longer drives are less tiring — when using AutoPilot. It is in no way akin to “watching paint dry”. The claim has been made that Level 2 autonomy is dangerous because of the ability for the driver to become distracted. This is actually true of all modes of driving, and relevant from Level 0 through Level 4 autonomy. Smartphones are often cited as the reason why driving death rate stopped falling for the last several years. Meaning distracted driving has killed thousands of drivers in that time. Distracted driving has also killed 3 people while AutoPilot was engaged. This is tragic, but it is wholly the drivers’ fault. Using AutoPilot for about 5 minutes will disabuse you of the notion that you don’t have to pay attention. Anyone who has used it will testify that there is no question the driver needs to monitor it. The name of the feature, or Elon’s fantastical claims of future capabilities, is basically only perturbing to those who haven’t actually used the feature. However, I think it is reasonable to question whether Tesla AutoPilot presents simply too great a temptation to willfully abuse the system. That is, to check your cellphone or watch a movie or otherwise take your eyes off the road. Not because it is hard or too difficult to remain focused, not because the driver believes they don’t need to be looking out the window, but because while the driver knows they should watch the road, they decide to cheat anyway. Unfortunately the same thing happens in Level 0 vehicles, which tragic results, all the time. It’s reasonable to question how much cars should be monitoring the attention/gaze of the driver and alerting, chastising, or otherwise forcing the driver to re-engage. But any such discussion would be superficially anti-Tesla if it were to disregard the universal nature of the problem of distracted driving. Mandatory driver attention monitoring systems, in all cars from Level 0 to Level 4 autonomy, would likely save over a thousand lives a year in the US alone. It might even save 1 life a year in a Tesla. Your false equivalence with Boeing is egregious. Pilots stuggling to maintain control over a fatally flawed plane is not even on the same league as a distracted driver watching a movie while their car hurtles down the highway into the side of a big rig. The pilots of the 737 were in no way negligent or distracted whatsoever. They were actively subverted by a malfunctioning airframe intent on flying them into the ground, god rest their souls.

zaroth 7y ago

Unfortunately I disagree with basically everything you’re saying. AutoPilot is perfectly safe if you look out the damn window while it’s operating. There are some disputed statistics saying that it is in fact safer on than off, even over the same type of miles. AutoPilot has in fact been safely operated for over a billion miles in the real world. Drivers need to look out the window. It is not in any way difficult to maintain situational awareness while operating under AutoPilot for extended periods of time. In fact I find it easier to stay alert for longer periods of driving — that is, longer drives are less tiring — when using AutoPilot. It is in no way akin to “watching paint dry”. The claim has been made that Level 2 autonomy is dangerous because of the ability for the driver to become distracted. This is actually true of all modes of driving, and relevant from Level 0 through Level 4 autonomy. Smartphones are often cited as the reason why driving death rate stopped falling for the last several years. Meaning distracted driving has killed thousands of drivers in that time. Distracted driving has also killed 3 people while AutoPilot was engaged. This is tragic, but it is wholly the drivers’ fault. Using AutoPilot for about 5 minutes will disabuse you of the notion that you don’t have to pay attention. Anyone who has used it will testify that there is no question the driver needs to monitor it. The name of the feature, or Elon’s fantastical claims of future capabilities, is basically only perturbing to those who haven’t actually used the feature. However, I think it is reasonable to question whether Tesla AutoPilot presents simply too great a temptation to willfully abuse the system. That is, to check your cellphone or watch a movie or otherwise take your eyes off the road. Not because it is hard or too difficult to remain focused, not because the driver believes they don’t need to be looking out the window, but because while the driver knows they should watch the road, they decide to cheat anyway. Unfortunately the same thing happens in Level 0 vehicles, which tragic results, all the time. It’s reasonable to question how much cars should be monitoring the attention/gaze of the driver and alerting, chastising, or otherwise forcing the driver to re-engage. But any such discussion would be superficially anti-Tesla if it were to disregard the universal nature of the problem of distracted driving. Mandatory driver attention monitoring systems, in all cars from Level 0 to Level 4 autonomy, would likely save over a thousand lives a year in the US alone. It might even save 1 life a year in a Tesla. Your false equivalence with Boeing is egregious. Pilots stuggling to maintain control over a fatally flawed plane is not even on the same league as a distracted driver watching a movie while their car hurtles down the highway into the side of a big rig. The pilots of the 737 were in no way negligent or distracted whatsoever. They were actively subverted by a malfunctioning airframe intent on flying them into the ground, god rest their souls.