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So are you arguing that it isn't useful to know about racial differences, even if they're true? I hear about them all the time! People wonder why there are so m

by _h4xr 18y ago

So are you arguing that it isn't useful to know about racial differences, even if they're true? I hear about them all the time! People wonder why there are so many black people in prison, or why there are so many Asians earning PhDs. Some people have good explanations for these phenomena. One problem with ignoring data about racial differences is that you end up being forced to argue that some races (or all races) are viciously racist -- that white folks want Africa to be a hellhole, and are willing to sacrifice all kinds of natural resources to keep it that way. The world makes more sense if people vary in abilities and tendencies, rather than being absolutely equal in every way, except that some people are evil. You would really be indifferent between finding yourself in Boro Park or Bedford-Stuyvessant? I understand the rent is very cheap in the latter (I lived there a while). Bed-Stuy doesn't have sub-Saharan Africans (or if it does, they're very smart immigrants who are likely to move to a better neighborhood in a few years), but the people there are from roughly that group, plus some admixture.

natrius 18y ago
Actually, I think the reason so much attention is paid to which races earn PhDs or end up in jail is to find out how to increase the number of PhDs of other races or reduce the prison population of certain races. If those differences are caused by genetic differences, then there's nothing we can do to change that. There are other factors at work in both situations, like socioeconomic status and culture, which we can use to make everyone better off. I think socioeconomic status is a better predictor of criminality than race. With that said, if I'm walking through an unfamiliar neighborhood, race is one of the few variables I have to work with. Unfortunately, in America, race is a moderately effective indicator of socioeconomic status, so I would use it as one factor in judging my safety. Even then, I usually use clothes and appearance rather than race to judge one's propensity for crime. This is actually a more interesting problem in terms of what to tell children than racial differences in intelligence. I think by the time they're old enough to be somewhere without adult supervision, they are able to determine what looks like a poor area or poor person and act accordingly. I can see the logic that would lead someone to tell their kids to use race as such a proxy instead, but the consequences of doing so make it not worth the negligible increase in safety in my opinion.
- _h4xr 18y ago
  Actually, race is the single best predictor of how much crime to expect in a given area. Besides population already in prison, at least. I think it's a red herring to ask why we're collecting the data in order to decide whether or not the data are accurate.
  - natrius 18y ago
    Really? That would be interesting data to look at. Do you have a source? I don't care why we're collecting the data, and I was assuming the data was accurate. I'm just saying that as far as genetic differences are a factor in the data, there's nothing we can do about it or with it, so it's useless.

by _h4xr 18y ago

natrius 18y ago

Actually, I think the reason so much attention is paid to which races earn PhDs or end up in jail is to find out how to increase the number of PhDs of other races or reduce the prison population of certain races. If those differences are caused by genetic differences, then there's nothing we can do to change that. There are other factors at work in both situations, like socioeconomic status and culture, which we can use to make everyone better off. I think socioeconomic status is a better predictor of criminality than race. With that said, if I'm walking through an unfamiliar neighborhood, race is one of the few variables I have to work with. Unfortunately, in America, race is a moderately effective indicator of socioeconomic status, so I would use it as one factor in judging my safety. Even then, I usually use clothes and appearance rather than race to judge one's propensity for crime. This is actually a more interesting problem in terms of what to tell children than racial differences in intelligence. I think by the time they're old enough to be somewhere without adult supervision, they are able to determine what looks like a poor area or poor person and act accordingly. I can see the logic that would lead someone to tell their kids to use race as such a proxy instead, but the consequences of doing so make it not worth the negligible increase in safety in my opinion.

_h4xr 18y ago
Actually, race is the single best predictor of how much crime to expect in a given area. Besides population already in prison, at least. I think it's a red herring to ask why we're collecting the data in order to decide whether or not the data are accurate.
- natrius 18y ago
  Really? That would be interesting data to look at. Do you have a source? I don't care why we're collecting the data, and I was assuming the data was accurate. I'm just saying that as far as genetic differences are a factor in the data, there's nothing we can do about it or with it, so it's useless.