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There are actually multiple levels of (Instagram) influencing. On the one end you have your mega influencers like Kylie Jenner. On the other there, are so calle

There are actually multiple levels of (Instagram) influencing. On the one end you have your mega influencers like Kylie Jenner. On the other there, are so called nano influencers, with as few as a thousand followers (and up to 10k). Usually, the fewer followers you have, the more engagement you can get from your followers and that's something companies will pay for. Also, most nano influencers are just doing it as a side gig for some free stuff, so it might actually be kind of economical as a marketing channel for many consumer companies (YMMV of course).

hn_throwaway_99 7y ago
Yeah, "nano influencer" is basically the Avon lady/Tupperware party host of this decade.
- zebraflask 7y ago
  That is both a cogent and hilariously accurate description.
  - willdotphipps 7y ago
    cogent? whats that mean?
    - satori99 7y ago
      A clear and convincing argument
      - deleted 7y ago
        [deleted]
    - seattle_spring 7y ago
      Heads up: If you're using Chrome, you can highlight a word, right click / context menu, and the very first option will be "Look up <word>".
- b_tterc_p 7y ago
  Great insight! I’m stealing this. Was also surprised to learn these are still a thing outside the US
- skciva 7y ago
  Anecdotally, I know multiple people who's followers count would put them in the category of "nano influencer" who do an excellent job using their platform to engage with interested clients / paying customers. I guess because of this one might not refer to them as purely an "influencer" but more and more people I know use instagram as a primary platform for advertising skills / wares as well as a place to spend money. If you know your audience spends time on instagram, you'd be stupid not to put resources into engaging with them on the platform.
  - ggg2 7y ago
    "Anecdotally, I know multiple people who's tupperware parties count would..." I am not talking trash about your point. Just that you replied to a comment with not much understand of multi level marketing (pyramid schems) that the previous comment was aluding to (and the commenter didn't expand on it either). Most people in the tech business do not have much exposure to it. But the success of things like herbalife, avon, etc rest on the "marketing reach potential" of their network, not just for the direct product. so in a way you are confirming the similarity that you thought you were denying with your comment. And the great insight here is how "influencer" is a kind of organic-multilevel-marketing scam.
    - majormajor 7y ago
      Other than your suggestion that a "nano-influencer" is akin to MLM (in the whole up/down graph stuff, and pyramid nature), I don't see reason here to conclude that. Small-to-medium brands engaging with small-to-medium scale individual marketers/influencers could be quite different than traditional MLM, with way fewer intermediaries.
    - adrianratnapala 7y ago
      > ... of organic-multilevel-marketing scam. Is it a scam though? A pyramid scam is self-similar: you sell to people who then expect to sell to people who expect to sell to people etc. I thought Avon, Tupperware etc. had a fixed length chains and multi-decade track records of sales to real consumers at the end of the chain.
- code_duck 7y ago
  As in, a microbusiness connecting with a group of dedicated customers? Sure.
- asdff 7y ago
  Oh man those are even worse. Arbonne is this decades mary kay.
- willdotphipps 7y ago
  does the MLM thing actually work for all that sign up? i never got into them
dontbenebby 7y ago
Or maybe the market is niche and it's not about the size of the follow count but the quality. Ex: I don't have an instagram currently, but if I did I'd bet I'd have better chance of selling wireless pineapples than even a "megainfluencer" like Kylie Jenner.
- 55555 7y ago
  No I'm pretty sure Kylie Jenner could sell millions of dollars worth of wireless pineapples tomorrow if she wanted. She could just ask her fans to buy them as a favor to her. and techies follow hot girls too so they'll see the post anyway.
  - dontbenebby 7y ago
    >techies follow hot girls too That's a pretty broad statement, not all "techies" are straight males.
fouc 7y ago
What if you're a casual instagram user and you end up with 10k followers? But you're not doing anything except posting regular pictures/stories/etc - zero engagement, zero working with any other company/etc. Would you still be counted as a nano influencer?
- goldenchrome 7y ago
  That rarely happens because most Instagrammers invest hundreds of hours of grinding work to get their followers (post frequency, posting at a certain times and days, deleting non-performing posts, obsessed with making it to the Explore page, etc). I guess that less than 1% of users with >10k followers got there "naturally".
  - HNLurker2 7y ago
    ... or just buy them like that guide that was on front-page
  - srpguy 7y ago
    Most of my friends who are good at skateboarding or surfing have 2-15k followers, regardless of whether or not they're sponsored. They do almost no personal branding, they're just well-known in their area. I imagine it's the same for most sports with a lot of participants, save those with a high financial barrier to entry (e.g. racing cars).
flanbiscuit 7y ago
This article goes into just how much you can make as an influencer: https://www.vox.com/the-goods/2018/11/28/18116875/influencer-marketing-social-media-engagement-instagram-youtube https://www.vox.com/the-goods/2018/11/28/18116875/influencer... From the article: > What do influencers charge per post? > It depends on the influencer, and their follower numbers. A micro-influencer, which is someone that has 10,000 to 50,000 followers, is actually pretty valuable. They used to only pick up a couple hundred bucks, but today, they get a minimum of a few thousands dollars a post. > Influencers with up to 1 million followers can get $10,000 [per post], depending on the platform, and 1 million followers and up, you’re getting into territory where they can charge $100,000. Some can even get $250,000 for a post! Especially if the content is on Youtube and the influencer is in the gaming industry. > How much do typical influencers make annually? > People with smaller followings [who are known as nanoinfluencers] can make between $30,000 and $60,000 a year. The micro-influencers can make anywhere from $40,000 to $100,000. Celeb influencers make way, way more.
- manigandham 7y ago
  From 12 years of adtech experience, this is absolutely false.
  - bryanrasmussen 7y ago
    what do you think the correct numbers are?
    - martin_a 7y ago
      Like written down below, fractions of those are probably correct. Have been involved in making a deal with an influencer with around 50k followers. Was around $400 for a single post.
    - manigandham 7y ago
      $5 per 1k followers average, so $500 per post for 100k followers, sometimes split with a talent agency/network that takes a cut. Smaller accounts are worthless but might get bought as a bundle. $1k+ per post needs 1M+ followers. $25k+ per post is just normal celebs. $250k on a social media post is extreme and only happens if the person is incredibly famous. It's no different than tv commercials and sports deals. Nothing has really changed other than adding a new medium to monetize. The fame is still the hard part, although there's more of it to go around and more opportunity for those that try.

hn_throwaway_99 7y ago

Yeah, "nano influencer" is basically the Avon lady/Tupperware party host of this decade.

zebraflask 7y ago
That is both a cogent and hilariously accurate description.
- willdotphipps 7y ago
  cogent? whats that mean?
  - satori99 7y ago
    A clear and convincing argument
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]
  - seattle_spring 7y ago
    Heads up: If you're using Chrome, you can highlight a word, right click / context menu, and the very first option will be "Look up <word>".
b_tterc_p 7y ago
Great insight! I’m stealing this. Was also surprised to learn these are still a thing outside the US
skciva 7y ago
Anecdotally, I know multiple people who's followers count would put them in the category of "nano influencer" who do an excellent job using their platform to engage with interested clients / paying customers. I guess because of this one might not refer to them as purely an "influencer" but more and more people I know use instagram as a primary platform for advertising skills / wares as well as a place to spend money. If you know your audience spends time on instagram, you'd be stupid not to put resources into engaging with them on the platform.
- ggg2 7y ago
  "Anecdotally, I know multiple people who's tupperware parties count would..." I am not talking trash about your point. Just that you replied to a comment with not much understand of multi level marketing (pyramid schems) that the previous comment was aluding to (and the commenter didn't expand on it either). Most people in the tech business do not have much exposure to it. But the success of things like herbalife, avon, etc rest on the "marketing reach potential" of their network, not just for the direct product. so in a way you are confirming the similarity that you thought you were denying with your comment. And the great insight here is how "influencer" is a kind of organic-multilevel-marketing scam.
  - majormajor 7y ago
    Other than your suggestion that a "nano-influencer" is akin to MLM (in the whole up/down graph stuff, and pyramid nature), I don't see reason here to conclude that. Small-to-medium brands engaging with small-to-medium scale individual marketers/influencers could be quite different than traditional MLM, with way fewer intermediaries.
  - adrianratnapala 7y ago
    > ... of organic-multilevel-marketing scam. Is it a scam though? A pyramid scam is self-similar: you sell to people who then expect to sell to people who expect to sell to people etc. I thought Avon, Tupperware etc. had a fixed length chains and multi-decade track records of sales to real consumers at the end of the chain.
code_duck 7y ago
As in, a microbusiness connecting with a group of dedicated customers? Sure.
asdff 7y ago
Oh man those are even worse. Arbonne is this decades mary kay.
willdotphipps 7y ago
does the MLM thing actually work for all that sign up? i never got into them

dontbenebby 7y ago

Or maybe the market is niche and it's not about the size of the follow count but the quality. Ex: I don't have an instagram currently, but if I did I'd bet I'd have better chance of selling wireless pineapples than even a "megainfluencer" like Kylie Jenner.

55555 7y ago
No I'm pretty sure Kylie Jenner could sell millions of dollars worth of wireless pineapples tomorrow if she wanted. She could just ask her fans to buy them as a favor to her. and techies follow hot girls too so they'll see the post anyway.
- dontbenebby 7y ago
  >techies follow hot girls too That's a pretty broad statement, not all "techies" are straight males.

fouc 7y ago

What if you're a casual instagram user and you end up with 10k followers? But you're not doing anything except posting regular pictures/stories/etc - zero engagement, zero working with any other company/etc. Would you still be counted as a nano influencer?

goldenchrome 7y ago
That rarely happens because most Instagrammers invest hundreds of hours of grinding work to get their followers (post frequency, posting at a certain times and days, deleting non-performing posts, obsessed with making it to the Explore page, etc). I guess that less than 1% of users with >10k followers got there "naturally".
- HNLurker2 7y ago
  ... or just buy them like that guide that was on front-page
- srpguy 7y ago
  Most of my friends who are good at skateboarding or surfing have 2-15k followers, regardless of whether or not they're sponsored. They do almost no personal branding, they're just well-known in their area. I imagine it's the same for most sports with a lot of participants, save those with a high financial barrier to entry (e.g. racing cars).

flanbiscuit 7y ago

This article goes into just how much you can make as an influencer: https://www.vox.com/the-goods/2018/11/28/18116875/influencer-marketing-social-media-engagement-instagram-youtube https://www.vox.com/the-goods/2018/11/28/18116875/influencer... From the article: > What do influencers charge per post? > It depends on the influencer, and their follower numbers. A micro-influencer, which is someone that has 10,000 to 50,000 followers, is actually pretty valuable. They used to only pick up a couple hundred bucks, but today, they get a minimum of a few thousands dollars a post. > Influencers with up to 1 million followers can get $10,000 [per post], depending on the platform, and 1 million followers and up, you’re getting into territory where they can charge $100,000. Some can even get $250,000 for a post! Especially if the content is on Youtube and the influencer is in the gaming industry. > How much do typical influencers make annually? > People with smaller followings [who are known as nanoinfluencers] can make between $30,000 and $60,000 a year. The micro-influencers can make anywhere from $40,000 to $100,000. Celeb influencers make way, way more.

manigandham 7y ago
From 12 years of adtech experience, this is absolutely false.
- bryanrasmussen 7y ago
  what do you think the correct numbers are?
  - martin_a 7y ago
    Like written down below, fractions of those are probably correct. Have been involved in making a deal with an influencer with around 50k followers. Was around $400 for a single post.
  - manigandham 7y ago
    $5 per 1k followers average, so $500 per post for 100k followers, sometimes split with a talent agency/network that takes a cut. Smaller accounts are worthless but might get bought as a bundle. $1k+ per post needs 1M+ followers. $25k+ per post is just normal celebs. $250k on a social media post is extreme and only happens if the person is incredibly famous. It's no different than tv commercials and sports deals. Nothing has really changed other than adding a new medium to monetize. The fame is still the hard part, although there's more of it to go around and more opportunity for those that try.