5 ms·

I don't think they are allowed to set prices. Furthermore, they are probably somehow punished if they don't accept the orders that app offers.

gsnedders 7y ago
They aren't, and the furthermore is also true beyond a certain percentage. This is part of the reason why in a number of jurisdictions the courts have ruled that the drivers aren't independent contractors.
thebradbain 7y ago
Uber and Lyft don’t let their drivers set rates, but the argument (and law) is that they should — since Uber won a judgement saying their drivers were contractors, not employees, their drivers, then, are legally entitled the right to charging their own rate. For a lot of intents and purposes Uber/Lyft wanted drivers to be classified as contractors so they wouldn’t be subject to laws re: minimum wage for employees, but it seems also don’t want to be subject to all laws re: contracting (price negotiation). Barring some extreme measure of lobbying for and passing a law that carves out an entirely new employment classification for the gig economy, Uber/Lyft/etc have to comply with at least one of the existing classifications.
- dnautics 7y ago
  Have you ever done contract coding? You don't always get to set the rates, because the rate for the contract is posted, and the other side is not going to negotiate.
  - thebradbain 7y ago
    I think in that case though it’s fine (even expected) because I can choose to take or not take it and find work elsewhere as a freelancer — the pro-labor argument with Uber/Lyft is that it’s systemic versus freelance work between two individuals is personal.
    - dnautics 7y ago
      having been an uber/lyft driver professionally for a year and half, I could definitely choose to take or not take it a find work elsewhere. Yes there were incentives to not reject too many, but that's true of general contracting work, too.
  - robmaister 7y ago
    The thing about contracting is you don't have to take the job if they aren't willing to negotiate. If no one wants to build your website for $5, then the client is either going to have to pay more, or not make a website. All of the drivers around that airport incur roughly the same costs for gas, wear and tear, rent, etc. So while you might find someone halfway across the world to build your website for $5, you won't be able to do the same for your driver between the airport and your hotel.
    - ummonk 7y ago
      Drivers are free to stop accepting rides whenever they want.
      - deleted 7y ago
        [deleted]
      - mcguire 7y ago
        Which they're doing. En-masse. Until the fares go up.
      - deleted 7y ago
        [deleted]
      - crooked-v 7y ago
        That's exactly what they did: stop accepting rides, then start accepting them again once Lyft offered to pay them enough that they thought it was worth it.
  - richardknop 7y ago
    Contractor here. Well you are not obligated to accept the contract if the rate is too low. These Lyft / Uber drivers do the same thing, the rate offered by Lyft/Uber for a ride is too low so they decline and only accept if they get their preferred rate. The same as software engineer contractor does, I don't accept every contract opportunity when I am in between contracts.
    - thebradbain 7y ago
      Except if you decline too many within a short time period Uber punishes you, I believe.
      - drawnwren 7y ago
        It seems to me that Uber's counter argument would be that they aren't obligated to offer a contract to all contractors equally. They would further argue that Uber's product is availability of drivers vs the rides themselves (remember they are only the middle men) and that they provide preference (in a binary manner) to contractors who allow them to provide consistent availability.
      - richardknop 7y ago
        That's why they log out of the app / turn off their phones instead of canceling rides. So they are just not available in the driver supply and then when they log back in they get surge price.
    - Jasper_ 7y ago
      In Uber Pool / Lyft Line, drivers are not allowed to refuse extra riders. If they accept one of these jobs they are locked in to whatever jobs Uber/Lyft throws at them afterwards unless they want to end their shift.

gsnedders 7y ago

They aren't, and the furthermore is also true beyond a certain percentage. This is part of the reason why in a number of jurisdictions the courts have ruled that the drivers aren't independent contractors.

thebradbain 7y ago

Uber and Lyft don’t let their drivers set rates, but the argument (and law) is that they should — since Uber won a judgement saying their drivers were contractors, not employees, their drivers, then, are legally entitled the right to charging their own rate. For a lot of intents and purposes Uber/Lyft wanted drivers to be classified as contractors so they wouldn’t be subject to laws re: minimum wage for employees, but it seems also don’t want to be subject to all laws re: contracting (price negotiation). Barring some extreme measure of lobbying for and passing a law that carves out an entirely new employment classification for the gig economy, Uber/Lyft/etc have to comply with at least one of the existing classifications.

dnautics 7y ago
Have you ever done contract coding? You don't always get to set the rates, because the rate for the contract is posted, and the other side is not going to negotiate.
- thebradbain 7y ago
  I think in that case though it’s fine (even expected) because I can choose to take or not take it and find work elsewhere as a freelancer — the pro-labor argument with Uber/Lyft is that it’s systemic versus freelance work between two individuals is personal.
  - dnautics 7y ago
    having been an uber/lyft driver professionally for a year and half, I could definitely choose to take or not take it a find work elsewhere. Yes there were incentives to not reject too many, but that's true of general contracting work, too.
- robmaister 7y ago
  The thing about contracting is you don't have to take the job if they aren't willing to negotiate. If no one wants to build your website for $5, then the client is either going to have to pay more, or not make a website. All of the drivers around that airport incur roughly the same costs for gas, wear and tear, rent, etc. So while you might find someone halfway across the world to build your website for $5, you won't be able to do the same for your driver between the airport and your hotel.
  - ummonk 7y ago
    Drivers are free to stop accepting rides whenever they want.
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]
    - mcguire 7y ago
      Which they're doing. En-masse. Until the fares go up.
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]
    - crooked-v 7y ago
      That's exactly what they did: stop accepting rides, then start accepting them again once Lyft offered to pay them enough that they thought it was worth it.
- richardknop 7y ago
  Contractor here. Well you are not obligated to accept the contract if the rate is too low. These Lyft / Uber drivers do the same thing, the rate offered by Lyft/Uber for a ride is too low so they decline and only accept if they get their preferred rate. The same as software engineer contractor does, I don't accept every contract opportunity when I am in between contracts.
  - thebradbain 7y ago
    Except if you decline too many within a short time period Uber punishes you, I believe.
    - drawnwren 7y ago
      It seems to me that Uber's counter argument would be that they aren't obligated to offer a contract to all contractors equally. They would further argue that Uber's product is availability of drivers vs the rides themselves (remember they are only the middle men) and that they provide preference (in a binary manner) to contractors who allow them to provide consistent availability.
    - richardknop 7y ago
      That's why they log out of the app / turn off their phones instead of canceling rides. So they are just not available in the driver supply and then when they log back in they get surge price.
  - Jasper_ 7y ago
    In Uber Pool / Lyft Line, drivers are not allowed to refuse extra riders. If they accept one of these jobs they are locked in to whatever jobs Uber/Lyft throws at them afterwards unless they want to end their shift.