4 ms·

You didn't read my question correctly.

acqq 7y ago
Regarding you questioning the statement "> whoever set the trap obviously did so to control him..." I consider that part of the statement obviously true. Causing somebody to give up his political functions is effectively a kind of control over the person (and more, when the person is the head of the party). What I understand you don't agree is "not to expose him" part, which was also true for whole two years -- an eternity in politics -- the video was made but not used to expose him for two years. Therefore more interesting than philosophizing about the exact meaning of the words is following what was going on and how it was done: There is a known relatively recently told story about the most powerful country in the world organizing events to compromise somebody in order to blackmail them: "Snowden described his CIA experience in Geneva as formative, stating that the CIA deliberately got a Swiss banker drunk and encouraged him to drive home. Snowden said that when the latter was arrested, a CIA operative offered to help in exchange for the banker becoming an informant." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_Snowden https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_Snowden The scale of this what was used now is many orders of magnitude bigger. You mentioned in your other comment "the woman groomed Gudenus over half a year or so before the Ibiza meeting" and giving a link to the article in German, thanks for that -- so there is at least somebody writing trying to figure out who's behind this. Do you know what is the story mentioned there at the end (used Google Translate): "And last but not least, the house search in the BAT with all its consequences should be mentioned as a secret service disaster." The most interesting detail from the article you've linked: "Above all, the US, which sits in virtually every major intelligence agency, has expressed a great deal of concern that information could flow away to Russia."
- tom_mellior 7y ago
  > organizing events to compromise somebody in order to blackmail them Yes, but this is exactly what did not happen here. > so there is at least somebody writing trying to figure out who's behind this Of course there is, and claiming that there isn't is just paranoia on your part. For whatever it's worth, here is another one: https://derstandard.at/2000103424380/Die-Drahtzieher-hinter-dem-Strache-Video https://derstandard.at/2000103424380/Die-Drahtzieher-hinter-... All Austrian and most major German-language news sites should have something along these lines, but you do have to look rather than assume that it doesn't exist. > "And last but not least, the house search in the BAT with all its consequences should be mentioned as a secret service disaster." Here is a summary, but only in German: https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/BVT-Aff%C3%A4re https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/BVT-Aff%C3%A4re Very briefly, a police unit controlled by an FPÖ politician illegally searched the offices of the BVT (the office for constitutional protection and counterterrorism) and seized data, apparently mostly about right-wing extremist networks.
  - acqq 7y ago
    From your "der Standard" link: "In the field of intelligence, it points to the risk that left-wing activists would undertake with such an "operation" - after all, there are payment dates for the rental of the finca, the rental car and the flights that can be found out. Intelligence agencies would not have this problem. They can construct so-called legends, ie false identities. Even if the video were scattered in the activist scene, that does not mean that an intelligence background is excluded. So secret services used again and again confidants to spread content and disguise their involvement." So some western intelligence agency is still the most probable organizer, and it's not something that any country should be worried about? Even if the guy himself fell in the trap, the construction should be a major news topic. And it surely isn't, but I see that it's at least mentioned, thanks for that.

acqq 7y ago

Regarding you questioning the statement "> whoever set the trap obviously did so to control him..." I consider that part of the statement obviously true. Causing somebody to give up his political functions is effectively a kind of control over the person (and more, when the person is the head of the party). What I understand you don't agree is "not to expose him" part, which was also true for whole two years -- an eternity in politics -- the video was made but not used to expose him for two years. Therefore more interesting than philosophizing about the exact meaning of the words is following what was going on and how it was done: There is a known relatively recently told story about the most powerful country in the world organizing events to compromise somebody in order to blackmail them: "Snowden described his CIA experience in Geneva as formative, stating that the CIA deliberately got a Swiss banker drunk and encouraged him to drive home. Snowden said that when the latter was arrested, a CIA operative offered to help in exchange for the banker becoming an informant." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_Snowden https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_Snowden The scale of this what was used now is many orders of magnitude bigger. You mentioned in your other comment "the woman groomed Gudenus over half a year or so before the Ibiza meeting" and giving a link to the article in German, thanks for that -- so there is at least somebody writing trying to figure out who's behind this. Do you know what is the story mentioned there at the end (used Google Translate): "And last but not least, the house search in the BAT with all its consequences should be mentioned as a secret service disaster." The most interesting detail from the article you've linked: "Above all, the US, which sits in virtually every major intelligence agency, has expressed a great deal of concern that information could flow away to Russia."

tom_mellior 7y ago
> organizing events to compromise somebody in order to blackmail them Yes, but this is exactly what did not happen here. > so there is at least somebody writing trying to figure out who's behind this Of course there is, and claiming that there isn't is just paranoia on your part. For whatever it's worth, here is another one: https://derstandard.at/2000103424380/Die-Drahtzieher-hinter-dem-Strache-Video https://derstandard.at/2000103424380/Die-Drahtzieher-hinter-... All Austrian and most major German-language news sites should have something along these lines, but you do have to look rather than assume that it doesn't exist. > "And last but not least, the house search in the BAT with all its consequences should be mentioned as a secret service disaster." Here is a summary, but only in German: https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/BVT-Aff%C3%A4re https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/BVT-Aff%C3%A4re Very briefly, a police unit controlled by an FPÖ politician illegally searched the offices of the BVT (the office for constitutional protection and counterterrorism) and seized data, apparently mostly about right-wing extremist networks.
- acqq 7y ago
  From your "der Standard" link: "In the field of intelligence, it points to the risk that left-wing activists would undertake with such an "operation" - after all, there are payment dates for the rental of the finca, the rental car and the flights that can be found out. Intelligence agencies would not have this problem. They can construct so-called legends, ie false identities. Even if the video were scattered in the activist scene, that does not mean that an intelligence background is excluded. So secret services used again and again confidants to spread content and disguise their involvement." So some western intelligence agency is still the most probable organizer, and it's not something that any country should be worried about? Even if the guy himself fell in the trap, the construction should be a major news topic. And it surely isn't, but I see that it's at least mentioned, thanks for that.