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I've really tried to like Mastodon, but I see too many toots accusing seemingly innocent people of being "fascists" and being complicit in the killing of minori

by Funes- 7y ago

I've really tried to like Mastodon, but I see too many toots accusing seemingly innocent people of being "fascists" and being complicit in the killing of minorities every time I step foot in almost any instance (that was an extreme case to illustrate the actual situation, but I hope you know what I'm saying). As well as other types of content you can already find on Twitter: rants, uninspired one liners, ego masturbation, etc. I don't like these kind of broadcast platforms because they tend to incite abuse; only in Mastodon it leans more toward the left most of the time, given the strict rules most instances enforce. I also don't like not owning my data.

phoe-krk 7y ago
> I also don't like not owning my data. In molochs such as Twitter or Facebook, you already do not own your data, so the only option is to not use them. When it comes to federated networks, the resolution is simple: do not federate with the instances whom you do not trust. Regardless of the choice you make, if you make it, then please do not complain that your content has no visibility. If you want other people to see the stuff you post, you naturally give them a right to save, repost, screenshot, print, memorize or otherwise make a copy of it. If you do not want that to happen, either do not post it online, or invest in getting a social network to run via Widevine.
- Funes- 7y ago
  >In molochs such as Twitter or Facebook, you already do not own your data, so the only option is to not use them. When it comes to federated networks, the resolution is simple: do not federate with the instances whom you do not trust. I do not have an account on either Facebook nor Twitter. Federated and centralized networks are not that different in terms of how your data is handled: they both rely on trust. Indeed, in centralized platforms you only have one possible group of people in which you can place your trust, but it comes down the very same thing in both cases: hosting your data somewhere else and hoping for the best. Peer to peer networks come with other shortcomings, but that is not one of them. >If you want other people to see the stuff you post, you naturally give them a right to save, repost, screenshot, print, memorize or otherwise make a copy of it I agree. Nonetheless, microblogging platforms like Twitter or Mastodon incentivize abusive content with their design. That's why Jack and others at Twitter are testing new ways of presenting and interacting with tweets by means of projects like twttr, and also why some instances on Mastodon let you disable boosts and so on. I won't complain about anything because that's not something I generally intend to do and because I don't think I will ever sign up for Mastodon.
- tomjen3 7y ago
  >If you want other people to see the stuff you post, you naturally give them a right to save, repost, screenshot, print, memorize or otherwise make a copy of it No. Under current copyright you don't grant them any rights, except a very few narrow ones. Memorize is arguably one of them, but reproducing it (accurately) from memory is not.
jchw 7y ago
Finding an instance that you enjoy is hard. I am on a small instance dedicated to a specific niche, and it works great.
claudiawerner 7y ago
My experience on the Fediverse is actually directly opposite yours: there is a whole host of explicitly right-wing instances to the point where a lot of other instances filter them out through blocklists. It it also my experience that a good deal of Mastodon instances tend to be left-leaning (as a result of per-instance rules/moderation practices) and a good deal of Pleroma instances the opposite. Of course there are exceptions here, but it's really not hard to find right-wing instances on the Fediverse. In fact, to find them you only need to browse popular blocklists[0]. There is nothing preventing you from signing up to one of those, though I think it's fair that I warn you that they're not the kind of instances you'd want to spend much time on for your own sanity. Disclaimer: I'm sympathetic to a lot of the "leaning to the left" practices you name, such as calling people out and the issue of complicity by voting to maintain the status-quo. [0] https://github.com/dzuk-mutant/blockchain https://github.com/dzuk-mutant/blockchain
- olah_1 7y ago
  90% of those block lists passed around are just free speech friendly instances that abide by United States speech laws. It’s really disturbing to me that a server can follow US laws and get on these shared block lists. I guess free speech is synonymous with evil totalitarian fascism? It’s no wonder the phrase “clown world” became popular.
  - claudiawerner 7y ago
    The only person using the phrase "evil totalitarian fascism" is you. It's entirely reasonable for an instance owned by a private individual to have higher restrictions on what they permit than the US does. Most countries, as a matter of fact, also have more restrictive policies. Opting into using the blacklist is just that - an option, and you can customize the list as you please on your own instance. There is no problem here.
    - olah_1 7y ago
      No. If a server admin does not use that block list, they are excluded from the larger (original) Mastodon community. So every instance is effectively bullied into also using the block list if they want access to the largest fediverse. Otherwise others won’t federate with them. This kind of nannying makes for an incredibly depressed and not-fun space. Twitter is a fun space precisely because of the possibility of altercations with those that disagree with you. I think the world has spoken in this regard (based on user and usage volume). People prefer more speech as opposed to less speech. Echo chambers / hive minds are boring and oppressive.
pndy 7y ago
Try setting up filters for home timeline, notifications, public timelines and conversations - that should protect you from those who like attack and accuse anyone because of literally any reason. I was targeted by some random teenage girl because of one word in my post - after quickly checking her profile I was sure it wasn't worth interacting with her.

by Funes- 7y ago

phoe-krk 7y ago

> I also don't like not owning my data. In molochs such as Twitter or Facebook, you already do not own your data, so the only option is to not use them. When it comes to federated networks, the resolution is simple: do not federate with the instances whom you do not trust. Regardless of the choice you make, if you make it, then please do not complain that your content has no visibility. If you want other people to see the stuff you post, you naturally give them a right to save, repost, screenshot, print, memorize or otherwise make a copy of it. If you do not want that to happen, either do not post it online, or invest in getting a social network to run via Widevine.

Funes- 7y ago
>In molochs such as Twitter or Facebook, you already do not own your data, so the only option is to not use them. When it comes to federated networks, the resolution is simple: do not federate with the instances whom you do not trust. I do not have an account on either Facebook nor Twitter. Federated and centralized networks are not that different in terms of how your data is handled: they both rely on trust. Indeed, in centralized platforms you only have one possible group of people in which you can place your trust, but it comes down the very same thing in both cases: hosting your data somewhere else and hoping for the best. Peer to peer networks come with other shortcomings, but that is not one of them. >If you want other people to see the stuff you post, you naturally give them a right to save, repost, screenshot, print, memorize or otherwise make a copy of it I agree. Nonetheless, microblogging platforms like Twitter or Mastodon incentivize abusive content with their design. That's why Jack and others at Twitter are testing new ways of presenting and interacting with tweets by means of projects like twttr, and also why some instances on Mastodon let you disable boosts and so on. I won't complain about anything because that's not something I generally intend to do and because I don't think I will ever sign up for Mastodon.
tomjen3 7y ago
>If you want other people to see the stuff you post, you naturally give them a right to save, repost, screenshot, print, memorize or otherwise make a copy of it No. Under current copyright you don't grant them any rights, except a very few narrow ones. Memorize is arguably one of them, but reproducing it (accurately) from memory is not.

jchw 7y ago

Finding an instance that you enjoy is hard. I am on a small instance dedicated to a specific niche, and it works great.

claudiawerner 7y ago

My experience on the Fediverse is actually directly opposite yours: there is a whole host of explicitly right-wing instances to the point where a lot of other instances filter them out through blocklists. It it also my experience that a good deal of Mastodon instances tend to be left-leaning (as a result of per-instance rules/moderation practices) and a good deal of Pleroma instances the opposite. Of course there are exceptions here, but it's really not hard to find right-wing instances on the Fediverse. In fact, to find them you only need to browse popular blocklists[0]. There is nothing preventing you from signing up to one of those, though I think it's fair that I warn you that they're not the kind of instances you'd want to spend much time on for your own sanity. Disclaimer: I'm sympathetic to a lot of the "leaning to the left" practices you name, such as calling people out and the issue of complicity by voting to maintain the status-quo. [0] https://github.com/dzuk-mutant/blockchain https://github.com/dzuk-mutant/blockchain

olah_1 7y ago
90% of those block lists passed around are just free speech friendly instances that abide by United States speech laws. It’s really disturbing to me that a server can follow US laws and get on these shared block lists. I guess free speech is synonymous with evil totalitarian fascism? It’s no wonder the phrase “clown world” became popular.
- claudiawerner 7y ago
  The only person using the phrase "evil totalitarian fascism" is you. It's entirely reasonable for an instance owned by a private individual to have higher restrictions on what they permit than the US does. Most countries, as a matter of fact, also have more restrictive policies. Opting into using the blacklist is just that - an option, and you can customize the list as you please on your own instance. There is no problem here.
  - olah_1 7y ago
    No. If a server admin does not use that block list, they are excluded from the larger (original) Mastodon community. So every instance is effectively bullied into also using the block list if they want access to the largest fediverse. Otherwise others won’t federate with them. This kind of nannying makes for an incredibly depressed and not-fun space. Twitter is a fun space precisely because of the possibility of altercations with those that disagree with you. I think the world has spoken in this regard (based on user and usage volume). People prefer more speech as opposed to less speech. Echo chambers / hive minds are boring and oppressive.

pndy 7y ago

Try setting up filters for home timeline, notifications, public timelines and conversations - that should protect you from those who like attack and accuse anyone because of literally any reason. I was targeted by some random teenage girl because of one word in my post - after quickly checking her profile I was sure it wasn't worth interacting with her.