4 ms·

> Part of the reason white-collar salaries are so high (along with demand) is that a lot of jobs actually aren't that interesting to do. I'd buy that if all th

by clarry 7y ago

> Part of the reason white-collar salaries are so high (along with demand) is that a lot of jobs actually aren't that interesting to do. I'd buy that if all these blue collar jobs seemed more interesting. Holy shit they tend to sound boring. Even when there's something interesting involved in the job (for example, as a machinist, you get to play with fancy expensive CNC machines!), it's often turned into monotonous and repetitive grind.

sokoloff 7y ago
Agree; I can't think of many things more monotonous than laying bricks, nailing off roofing shingle, installing 100s of outlets, or concrete flatwork.
scruple 7y ago
Because they _are_ boring. I have no idea what to think of the GP other than to assume they've never actually worked a blue collar job. I have. They suck. They're boring. They are the definition of boring work. Here's a list of manual labor jobs that I worked during my teenage years. This list will not include any job that I worked in my 20s. If I added all of the manual labor jobs that I had in my 20s I'd be here for the next hour. * Picking corn/green & soy beans/tomatoes/peppers/berries by hand (this is summer and fall only, mind you, so not only is boring it is also hot -- even when you start at 5:45AM, you get very little reprieve working the fields because you're there until 11AM or noon). * Working a farm stand, selling aforementioned corn/green & soy beans/tomatoes/peppers/fruit (moving up in the world!). * Flipping burgers / running a fry station / running a fast food cash register / washing dishes in a fast food joint. * Delivering pizzas. * Delivering printed materials (hard to explain, friends dad had a printing business, I ran deliveries for them for a while -- loading, unloading, driving. Driving for a living is easily the most boring thing that can ever happen to you, IMHO). * All manner of construction -- but mostly roofing and framing. * Working the end of a glass plant factory line, inspecting glass television screens for defects. OT was in abundance here and I would often work 16 hour shifts doing this. * Waterproofing basements / dealing with broken sump pumps / digging out deteriorating septic tanks. * Throwing boxes at a FedEx. This list represents ages 13 (maybe 14?) - 19 for me. 3 of these jobs were things that I did while attending University (though I left and didn't return until later in life). It doesn't get much better until 22. At 22 there's some manual labor that is disguised as technical work (military). A lot of this is or was seasonal work. That was the nature of manual labor, when and where I grew up. I'm sure that hasn't changed too much. All of these are boring jobs. They are mind-numbing in ways that are genuinely hard to express. If salaries are dictated by who is doing the most uninteresting work then we have things _completely_ backwards, IMO.
- esotericn 7y ago
  Having looked it up I think my definition of 'blue collar' is a bit off. I'm British, so there is that, the term isn't in common use over here. I figured it just included everything that wasn't in an office. A decent amount of the stuff in your list is unskilled labour that I've done in the past and also hated. I mean, the fact you've switched between them all pretty much illustrates it - they're not careers, they're stuff you do for a bit of money to keep going until the next gig. What do you guys call a job that isn't the sort of thing that anyone physically able can do (well) with a day's instruction, but isn't office based either? Like, I can't imagine a car salesman is considered white collar? (Not that that's an example of my dream job...)
  - clarry 7y ago
    Blue collar job pretty much just means manual labour, although this definition gets stretched a little when you consider factory work where a machine performs the job and the worker pretty much just operates & oversees the machine. There are plenty of skilled blue collar jobs that you won't do with a day's worth of instruction. Salesmen are as white collar as it gets.
patrick5415 7y ago
I think this is true of just about any job. I was a carpenter for 8 years. Nailing up wall after wall gets pretty boring. Then I went to grad school. I swear I spent at least 25 % of my time making figures “publication quality”: adjust the axis limits, squeeze the axes 0.1mm in, fart with linestyles so it’s still intellligible in grayscale [1], whatever. I’ll taking framing any day over that nonsense. [1] Many journals still have a print version and charge for color figures.

by clarry 7y ago

sokoloff 7y ago

Agree; I can't think of many things more monotonous than laying bricks, nailing off roofing shingle, installing 100s of outlets, or concrete flatwork.

scruple 7y ago

Because they _are_ boring. I have no idea what to think of the GP other than to assume they've never actually worked a blue collar job. I have. They suck. They're boring. They are the definition of boring work. Here's a list of manual labor jobs that I worked during my teenage years. This list will not include any job that I worked in my 20s. If I added all of the manual labor jobs that I had in my 20s I'd be here for the next hour. * Picking corn/green & soy beans/tomatoes/peppers/berries by hand (this is summer and fall only, mind you, so not only is boring it is also hot -- even when you start at 5:45AM, you get very little reprieve working the fields because you're there until 11AM or noon). * Working a farm stand, selling aforementioned corn/green & soy beans/tomatoes/peppers/fruit (moving up in the world!). * Flipping burgers / running a fry station / running a fast food cash register / washing dishes in a fast food joint. * Delivering pizzas. * Delivering printed materials (hard to explain, friends dad had a printing business, I ran deliveries for them for a while -- loading, unloading, driving. Driving for a living is easily the most boring thing that can ever happen to you, IMHO). * All manner of construction -- but mostly roofing and framing. * Working the end of a glass plant factory line, inspecting glass television screens for defects. OT was in abundance here and I would often work 16 hour shifts doing this. * Waterproofing basements / dealing with broken sump pumps / digging out deteriorating septic tanks. * Throwing boxes at a FedEx. This list represents ages 13 (maybe 14?) - 19 for me. 3 of these jobs were things that I did while attending University (though I left and didn't return until later in life). It doesn't get much better until 22. At 22 there's some manual labor that is disguised as technical work (military). A lot of this is or was seasonal work. That was the nature of manual labor, when and where I grew up. I'm sure that hasn't changed too much. All of these are boring jobs. They are mind-numbing in ways that are genuinely hard to express. If salaries are dictated by who is doing the most uninteresting work then we have things _completely_ backwards, IMO.

esotericn 7y ago
Having looked it up I think my definition of 'blue collar' is a bit off. I'm British, so there is that, the term isn't in common use over here. I figured it just included everything that wasn't in an office. A decent amount of the stuff in your list is unskilled labour that I've done in the past and also hated. I mean, the fact you've switched between them all pretty much illustrates it - they're not careers, they're stuff you do for a bit of money to keep going until the next gig. What do you guys call a job that isn't the sort of thing that anyone physically able can do (well) with a day's instruction, but isn't office based either? Like, I can't imagine a car salesman is considered white collar? (Not that that's an example of my dream job...)
- clarry 7y ago
  Blue collar job pretty much just means manual labour, although this definition gets stretched a little when you consider factory work where a machine performs the job and the worker pretty much just operates & oversees the machine. There are plenty of skilled blue collar jobs that you won't do with a day's worth of instruction. Salesmen are as white collar as it gets.

patrick5415 7y ago

I think this is true of just about any job. I was a carpenter for 8 years. Nailing up wall after wall gets pretty boring. Then I went to grad school. I swear I spent at least 25 % of my time making figures “publication quality”: adjust the axis limits, squeeze the axes 0.1mm in, fart with linestyles so it’s still intellligible in grayscale [1], whatever. I’ll taking framing any day over that nonsense. [1] Many journals still have a print version and charge for color figures.