3 ms·

Full self driving hardware. Elon musk takes hands off the wheel. https://www.businessinsider.co.za/elon-musk-breaks-tesla-autopilot-rule-2018-12 https://www.bu

Full self driving hardware. Elon musk takes hands off the wheel. https://www.businessinsider.co.za/elon-musk-breaks-tesla-autopilot-rule-2018-12 https://www.businessinsider.co.za/elon-musk-breaks-tesla-aut... Tesla very much makes it sound like that you just need to sit back and enjoy a coffee while your car drives. Many imagine that the car will give them 5-10 seconds of heads up before takeover is needed.

pooya13 7y ago
Musk was demonstrating auto braking. I don’t see him in that video or anywhere else promoting careless driving or sleeping at the wheel. > Tesla very much makes it sound like that you just need to sit back and enjoy a coffee while your car drives Again citation needed. Although this might sound like a fact in the HN forums, it is far from the reality.
- rohit2412 7y ago
  Citation needed? Coast to coast autonomous drive, cross country summon mode, full self driving on highways from entry to exit, the fsd fake demo video with "driver is there only for legal reasons", million robotaxis that earn you 30k$ a year from 2020, lidar is a fools errand etc etc. You need more? Here's Elon musk in 2016 proclaiming self driving to be easy and solved. Showing entire lack of understanding what driving is like and why computers fail at it. https://youtu.be/wsixsRI-Sz4?t=1h17m57s https://youtu.be/wsixsRI-Sz4?t=1h17m57s
  - pooya13 7y ago
    Let’s go over them one by one: > Coast to coast autonomous drive, cross country summon mode They have not claimed that they have achieved that yet. > full self driving on highways from entry to exit This is from the Tesla website when I search for the above: “The currently enabled features require active driver supervision and do not make the vehicle autonomous” [1] > the fsd fake demo video with "driver is there only for legal reasons" Based on what evidence do you claim it is “fake”? That video is to demonstrate FSD and show the future value of the system. It does not say here is how you should operate AP. > million robotaxis that earn you 30k$ a year from 2020 Oh shit, is it 2020 already? > lidar is a fools errand How is that even relevant to this thread? > You need more? More than the zero citations you have provided so far? Yes. Yes I do need more. > Here's Elon musk in 2016 proclaiming self driving to be easy and solved. Showing entire lack of understanding what driving is like and why computers fail at it. Again not relevant here since we are not talking about future promises here. The discussion is on how Tesla encourages its drivers to use the car today. If they say they are working on a flying car would anyone try to drive their car of a cliff? Again, if you think any of the above are not accurate please provide citations for your claim. (I’m starting to think folks around here don’t know what citation means) [1] https://www.tesla.com/support/full-self-driving-capability-trial https://www.tesla.com/support/full-self-driving-capability-t...
    - bussierem 7y ago
      First off, you need to remember that Tesla has made Musk's twitter feed an official announcement platform, so literally any promise, claim, or offhanded remark he makes there can (and often does) get treated as fact by people and by media. Second, regarding your link, it also states you can >[...] summon your car to come find you. How can it do this but _also_ "require active driver supervision"? This statement implies that it can, without you in the car, drive to come find you, and it _definitely_ implies the vehicle is autonomous. Yes, they also say like you said, but these are conflicting statements, and it's VERY easy between this, average Joe's understanding of autonomous cars, and Elon's behavior on twitter to see why so many people think that the Tesla is fully autonomous, and thus get into accidents like they have by simply not paying attention. You can link stuff from Tesla all you want showing how they do a good job covering their ass, but if people are still doing this, then Tesla isn't doing a good job of making this clear. They simply hide it inside the legal documents so that when people _do_ treat the car as autonomous, they can't be sued for it.
      - pooya13 7y ago
        > ... treated as fact by people and media Sure it is a fact that Elon Musk predicts they will have robotaxis in a year. It is not however a fact that Elon Musk advises the drivers to drive carelessly. > How can it do this but __also__ "require active driver supervision"? This statement implies .... Yes it does. In a parking lot. At parking lot speed. While you are not in the car. > and it __definitly__ implies the vehicle is autonomous. If by autonomous you mean it can automatically come to you in a parking lot then yes. If by autonomous you mean you can sleep behind the wheel while it is driving in the streets then it __definitly__ does not imply that. > But these are conflicting statements... No they are not. One is about operation in a parking lot. One is about future functionality/value of the product. And one is about the current functionality of the product. > people think that Tesla is fully autonomous and thus get into accidents like this Citation needed. I'd say it is more likely that they are not using the car as intended, not that they mistakenly think their car is fully autonomous. > ... covering their ass Not sure what your point is here. So they are damned if they do damned if they don't? > but if people are still doing this then Tesla isn't doing a good job of making this clear People don't always use things as designed. This is not exclusive to Tesla cars. > They simply hide it inside the legal documents Not true. It is on the first page when you search for Tesla FSD. And I am pretty sure the warning is shown to the users at different steps before AP can be activated.

pooya13 7y ago

Musk was demonstrating auto braking. I don’t see him in that video or anywhere else promoting careless driving or sleeping at the wheel. > Tesla very much makes it sound like that you just need to sit back and enjoy a coffee while your car drives Again citation needed. Although this might sound like a fact in the HN forums, it is far from the reality.

rohit2412 7y ago
Citation needed? Coast to coast autonomous drive, cross country summon mode, full self driving on highways from entry to exit, the fsd fake demo video with "driver is there only for legal reasons", million robotaxis that earn you 30k$ a year from 2020, lidar is a fools errand etc etc. You need more? Here's Elon musk in 2016 proclaiming self driving to be easy and solved. Showing entire lack of understanding what driving is like and why computers fail at it. https://youtu.be/wsixsRI-Sz4?t=1h17m57s https://youtu.be/wsixsRI-Sz4?t=1h17m57s
- pooya13 7y ago
  Let’s go over them one by one: > Coast to coast autonomous drive, cross country summon mode They have not claimed that they have achieved that yet. > full self driving on highways from entry to exit This is from the Tesla website when I search for the above: “The currently enabled features require active driver supervision and do not make the vehicle autonomous” [1] > the fsd fake demo video with "driver is there only for legal reasons" Based on what evidence do you claim it is “fake”? That video is to demonstrate FSD and show the future value of the system. It does not say here is how you should operate AP. > million robotaxis that earn you 30k$ a year from 2020 Oh shit, is it 2020 already? > lidar is a fools errand How is that even relevant to this thread? > You need more? More than the zero citations you have provided so far? Yes. Yes I do need more. > Here's Elon musk in 2016 proclaiming self driving to be easy and solved. Showing entire lack of understanding what driving is like and why computers fail at it. Again not relevant here since we are not talking about future promises here. The discussion is on how Tesla encourages its drivers to use the car today. If they say they are working on a flying car would anyone try to drive their car of a cliff? Again, if you think any of the above are not accurate please provide citations for your claim. (I’m starting to think folks around here don’t know what citation means) [1] https://www.tesla.com/support/full-self-driving-capability-trial https://www.tesla.com/support/full-self-driving-capability-t...
  - bussierem 7y ago
    First off, you need to remember that Tesla has made Musk's twitter feed an official announcement platform, so literally any promise, claim, or offhanded remark he makes there can (and often does) get treated as fact by people and by media. Second, regarding your link, it also states you can >[...] summon your car to come find you. How can it do this but _also_ "require active driver supervision"? This statement implies that it can, without you in the car, drive to come find you, and it _definitely_ implies the vehicle is autonomous. Yes, they also say like you said, but these are conflicting statements, and it's VERY easy between this, average Joe's understanding of autonomous cars, and Elon's behavior on twitter to see why so many people think that the Tesla is fully autonomous, and thus get into accidents like they have by simply not paying attention. You can link stuff from Tesla all you want showing how they do a good job covering their ass, but if people are still doing this, then Tesla isn't doing a good job of making this clear. They simply hide it inside the legal documents so that when people _do_ treat the car as autonomous, they can't be sued for it.
    - pooya13 7y ago
      > ... treated as fact by people and media Sure it is a fact that Elon Musk predicts they will have robotaxis in a year. It is not however a fact that Elon Musk advises the drivers to drive carelessly. > How can it do this but __also__ "require active driver supervision"? This statement implies .... Yes it does. In a parking lot. At parking lot speed. While you are not in the car. > and it __definitly__ implies the vehicle is autonomous. If by autonomous you mean it can automatically come to you in a parking lot then yes. If by autonomous you mean you can sleep behind the wheel while it is driving in the streets then it __definitly__ does not imply that. > But these are conflicting statements... No they are not. One is about operation in a parking lot. One is about future functionality/value of the product. And one is about the current functionality of the product. > people think that Tesla is fully autonomous and thus get into accidents like this Citation needed. I'd say it is more likely that they are not using the car as intended, not that they mistakenly think their car is fully autonomous. > ... covering their ass Not sure what your point is here. So they are damned if they do damned if they don't? > but if people are still doing this then Tesla isn't doing a good job of making this clear People don't always use things as designed. This is not exclusive to Tesla cars. > They simply hide it inside the legal documents Not true. It is on the first page when you search for Tesla FSD. And I am pretty sure the warning is shown to the users at different steps before AP can be activated.