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When the economy and population were properly booming, pretty much everyone had a decent change of getting promoted and building a strong career. If your office

by nikanj 7y ago

When the economy and population were properly booming, pretty much everyone had a decent change of getting promoted and building a strong career. If your office had 10 people today and 100 in a decade, odds are good that every one of the original ten made it into manager. We still build career expectations around this model, but it's mostly not true anymore. If you start in the mail room today, you'll retire from the mail room. Actually, you won't even retire, because mail handling is going to get outsourced.

jellicle 7y ago
You'll be fired from the mail room, but you'll be eligible to apply to be a subcontractor with Mail Room Supply, Inc. As a subcontractor, you'll be eligible for the standard hourly rate of $9 and you'll have the freedom to arrange for your own healthcare, own payment of all contractor taxes, and own retirement. You're also required to purchase your own Mail Room Supply, Inc. uniforms, but there's an easy payment plan for those that cannot afford them. Conveniently, your assigned work location at Mail Room Supply, Inc. will be in the basement of Acme Corp., where you used to work. (Work location not guaranteed.)
- NeedMoreTea 7y ago
  You'll also be fined for failing to deliver on the contract if you take time off due to sickness. You'll be sent home without pay when conditions find the mail room short on mail, but you are required to be available for work the rest of the day, just in case the delivery was late. You'll be repeatedly told how much more convenient this is for you.
  - swombat 7y ago
    America: land of the free (of worker rights)...
- coldtea 7y ago
  Which, incidentally, is not really different from how workers were treated in the US before the 40s, when many important laws for labor protections, minimum wage, etc were passed. Including purchasing your own uniform and tools (which you did at the "company store", often with "company money" (scrip), which you could only spend for products (food, drink, etc), there anyway.
coldtea 7y ago
>If your office had 10 people today and 100 in a decade, odds are good that every one of the original ten made it into manager. I don't think that's the problem for most - that they didn't become managers. And I doubt that many blue collar / working class people become managers in the 50s to 80s anyway, much less "10 out of 10". Having travelled around the US and talked with friends a bit, it's more destroyed rural communities, ex-industrial cities, etc. Blue collar jobs who offered work for life and let people buy a house quite easily in the 50s-80s, now are non existent, people have difficulty making ends up, are a health issue away from losing their whole savings (or house), or don't have even $2K in the bank. And for an increased number of the population it's not very different in many parts of Europe nowadays either, even the supposedly "going strong" ones like Germany (and you've already seen the Yellow Vest protests in France of course).
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
mrep 7y ago
> When the economy and population were properly booming, pretty much everyone had a decent change of getting promoted and building a strong career. If your office had 10 people today and 100 in a decade, odds are good that every one of the original ten made it into manager. We still build career expectations around this model, but it's mostly not true anymore. Got any sources for that because while I don't have don't have data sources, I do have anecdotes from friends who work at Amazon and work for directors/VP's who started out as fulfilment workers despite everyone here loving to hate on Amazon fulfillment centers.
shams93 7y ago
What happens now is if you don't found something your a permanent temporary.
- osrec 7y ago
  So true. I felt like this in my supposedly stable investment banking job. The stability is a farce - I've seen lifers get let go abruptly in an afternoon. Ultimately, the instability drove me to set up my own business, and while it was tough initially, I'm so glad I did.
rchaud 7y ago
> We still build career expectations around this model, but it's mostly not true anymore. Back in the day, the stodgy "legacy" SV companies like HP recruited for all positions internally. The NYT had a story in 2017 about a custodial worker who worked her way up into a corporate role over 10+ years. That was only possible because she saw and spoke with office staff every day and the familiarity and mutual respect helped her get a foot in the door when non-custodial positions became available. That would be impossible today because most firms use contract labour, that rotate across different employers. If I remember the article correctly, Google's policy even puts technical contractors and FT staff in separate canteens, so there's even less ability to share ideas and network with FT staff who might be able to recognize your work and recommend you to the internal HR team.

by nikanj 7y ago

jellicle 7y ago

You'll be fired from the mail room, but you'll be eligible to apply to be a subcontractor with Mail Room Supply, Inc. As a subcontractor, you'll be eligible for the standard hourly rate of $9 and you'll have the freedom to arrange for your own healthcare, own payment of all contractor taxes, and own retirement. You're also required to purchase your own Mail Room Supply, Inc. uniforms, but there's an easy payment plan for those that cannot afford them. Conveniently, your assigned work location at Mail Room Supply, Inc. will be in the basement of Acme Corp., where you used to work. (Work location not guaranteed.)

NeedMoreTea 7y ago
You'll also be fined for failing to deliver on the contract if you take time off due to sickness. You'll be sent home without pay when conditions find the mail room short on mail, but you are required to be available for work the rest of the day, just in case the delivery was late. You'll be repeatedly told how much more convenient this is for you.
- swombat 7y ago
  America: land of the free (of worker rights)...
coldtea 7y ago
Which, incidentally, is not really different from how workers were treated in the US before the 40s, when many important laws for labor protections, minimum wage, etc were passed. Including purchasing your own uniform and tools (which you did at the "company store", often with "company money" (scrip), which you could only spend for products (food, drink, etc), there anyway.

coldtea 7y ago

>If your office had 10 people today and 100 in a decade, odds are good that every one of the original ten made it into manager. I don't think that's the problem for most - that they didn't become managers. And I doubt that many blue collar / working class people become managers in the 50s to 80s anyway, much less "10 out of 10". Having travelled around the US and talked with friends a bit, it's more destroyed rural communities, ex-industrial cities, etc. Blue collar jobs who offered work for life and let people buy a house quite easily in the 50s-80s, now are non existent, people have difficulty making ends up, are a health issue away from losing their whole savings (or house), or don't have even $2K in the bank. And for an increased number of the population it's not very different in many parts of Europe nowadays either, even the supposedly "going strong" ones like Germany (and you've already seen the Yellow Vest protests in France of course).

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]

mrep 7y ago

> When the economy and population were properly booming, pretty much everyone had a decent change of getting promoted and building a strong career. If your office had 10 people today and 100 in a decade, odds are good that every one of the original ten made it into manager. We still build career expectations around this model, but it's mostly not true anymore. Got any sources for that because while I don't have don't have data sources, I do have anecdotes from friends who work at Amazon and work for directors/VP's who started out as fulfilment workers despite everyone here loving to hate on Amazon fulfillment centers.

shams93 7y ago

What happens now is if you don't found something your a permanent temporary.

osrec 7y ago
So true. I felt like this in my supposedly stable investment banking job. The stability is a farce - I've seen lifers get let go abruptly in an afternoon. Ultimately, the instability drove me to set up my own business, and while it was tough initially, I'm so glad I did.

rchaud 7y ago

> We still build career expectations around this model, but it's mostly not true anymore. Back in the day, the stodgy "legacy" SV companies like HP recruited for all positions internally. The NYT had a story in 2017 about a custodial worker who worked her way up into a corporate role over 10+ years. That was only possible because she saw and spoke with office staff every day and the familiarity and mutual respect helped her get a foot in the door when non-custodial positions became available. That would be impossible today because most firms use contract labour, that rotate across different employers. If I remember the article correctly, Google's policy even puts technical contractors and FT staff in separate canteens, so there's even less ability to share ideas and network with FT staff who might be able to recognize your work and recommend you to the internal HR team.