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I disagree - the education system itself is deeply unforgiving in how it functions. From even the most basic level of school scheduling being directly at odds w

I disagree - the education system itself is deeply unforgiving in how it functions. From even the most basic level of school scheduling being directly at odds with teenage biology, all the way to how students are ranked and filed purely based on test scores. These kids in poor neighborhoods usually (statistically) don't have the support that even the best students need to get through school. Of course there are always exceptions, but this is just what I've observed.

umvi 7y ago
Well, my neighbors are on public assistance, and I swear the kids are truant half the time. Doesn't matter how great your school is if the kids don't go and the parents don't care if they go or not.
- cameronbrown 7y ago
  Let me rephrase my point: if school was more engaging and less of a punishment (which is what it can feel like for these already disadvantaged kids) then they might be more inclined to want to go. Obviously some home situations are too rough to sort out, but I think that's a situation where the government needs to step in.
  - umvi 7y ago
    What you are suggesting is not possible for the government to solve IMO. You are basically saying that the school system needs to take on the role of parenting ("helping kids engage") in addition to actual education. When the kids' parents have not completed school themselves, can't help or motivate their kids with schoolwork, etc... you need an army of mentors to help engage those kids. Unfortunately, disadvantaged kids outnumber such mentors by a large factor and such a system would quickly swallow any budget fed to it.
    - cameronbrown 7y ago
      Not really. I don't believe you actually need to force/motivate kids to do homework. Homework as a concept is fundamentally flawed as it is IMO and is another problem with the system. I love maths and science and all that stuff we all do on that forum, but I don't believe for one second that kids should be forced into it. Forcing students to do homework/exams/uninteresting subjects, and not fostering natural curiosity, is why school is not engaging. I'm oversimplifying massively and understand there's a middle ground somewhere, but this is what I believe.

umvi 7y ago

Well, my neighbors are on public assistance, and I swear the kids are truant half the time. Doesn't matter how great your school is if the kids don't go and the parents don't care if they go or not.

cameronbrown 7y ago
Let me rephrase my point: if school was more engaging and less of a punishment (which is what it can feel like for these already disadvantaged kids) then they might be more inclined to want to go. Obviously some home situations are too rough to sort out, but I think that's a situation where the government needs to step in.
- umvi 7y ago
  What you are suggesting is not possible for the government to solve IMO. You are basically saying that the school system needs to take on the role of parenting ("helping kids engage") in addition to actual education. When the kids' parents have not completed school themselves, can't help or motivate their kids with schoolwork, etc... you need an army of mentors to help engage those kids. Unfortunately, disadvantaged kids outnumber such mentors by a large factor and such a system would quickly swallow any budget fed to it.
  - cameronbrown 7y ago
    Not really. I don't believe you actually need to force/motivate kids to do homework. Homework as a concept is fundamentally flawed as it is IMO and is another problem with the system. I love maths and science and all that stuff we all do on that forum, but I don't believe for one second that kids should be forced into it. Forcing students to do homework/exams/uninteresting subjects, and not fostering natural curiosity, is why school is not engaging. I'm oversimplifying massively and understand there's a middle ground somewhere, but this is what I believe.