7 ms·

It's amazing this article even needs to be written. You'd think the executives pulling in these crazy salaries would be competent enough to know that paying the

It's amazing this article even needs to be written. You'd think the executives pulling in these crazy salaries would be competent enough to know that paying their "team members" next to nothing is going to result in high turnover and be a bad business decision in the long run. This article frames his choice to actually pay his employees as some big discovery, but it's not. The fact is, execs already know, but they put their short-term greed over what is best for their employees, the company in the long term, and their communities.

toasterlovin 7y ago
Never ascribe to malice that which can be explained by incompetence. Lots of things persist because “that’s the way it’s always been done”. Probably what’s going on here, in my opinion.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- JimBrimble35 7y ago
  I think what you are identifying as incompetence is, in fact, well-aged malice. The greedy behavior that leads to the kind of inequality faced by today's society is now so well established that it has become hard to recognize for what it truly is. The fact that this article's author seems to find it novel to trickle down the proceeds of the company to the bulk of it's employees is a pretty good indication of that.
  - toasterlovin 7y ago
    > The greedy behavior that leads to the kind of inequality faced by today's society is now so well established that it has become hard to recognize for what it truly is. I know you think you’re arguing against me, but what you described supports my position.
    - _1100 7y ago
      Agreed. It doesn't matter if it is hard to recognize, if you are unable to understand something then you are by definition incompetent with respect to the task or idea.
    - JimBrimble35 7y ago
      It isn't incompetence, it's complacent acceptance of a toxic norm for personal gain.
      - toasterlovin 7y ago
        Fine, incompetence is the wrong word, but malice isn't the right word.
        JimBrimble35 7y ago
        I think that if you look at the history of the trend, and the politics behind it. The decreases in top marginal tax rate, decreases in corporate tax rates. It starts to really _feel_ malicious. Although you're probably right, I don't think that all of the current c-suite occupants in the nation are acting out of malice.
  - csallen 7y ago
    > The greedy behavior that leads to the kind of inequality faced by today's society is now so well established that it has become hard to recognize for what it truly is. So in other words: It no longer requires any malice to pay this way, as it's just a cultural norm in the business world. By the way, it's also a cultural norm in the US to complain about the lack of generosity among those richer than you, and yet spend almost 100% of your salary helping yourself, when you could just as easily spend it on those less fortunate. Charitable donation is trivially easy, even easier than raising the minimum wage at your company. Yet how many people in these comments are highly-paid millennials who would rather buy the newest iPhone than donate that money to those in need? If we want to understand the psychology of those at the "top," we need only look no further than ourselves. Unless you're at the bottom, you're also at the top as far as people less fortunate than you are concerned.
    - jakelazaroff 7y ago
      > So in other words: It no longer requires any malice to pay this way, as it's just a cultural norm in the business world. Sure. But I don't think this is a sufficient defense — at the extremes, cultural norms can result in horrific things even though individual actors may not be motivated by malice. > By the way, it's also a cultural norm in the US to complain about the lack of generosity among those richer than you, and yet spend almost 100% of your salary helping yourself, when you could just as easily spend it on those less fortunate. There's definitely an incongruity between people's expectations of those above them and what they contribute themselves. We should all give more! But even if I were to donate 100% of my salary, it would barely dent things for those 500 employees. When we complain about people above us, we're (usually) not chastising individuals but calling for systemic solutions to these issues. The overarching goal isn't for people to donate more of their resources, but to structure things in a more equitable way so that people don't rely on individual generosity in the first place.
      - DuskStar 7y ago
        > But even if I were to donate 100% of my salary, it would barely dent things for those 500 employees. There's a lot more people like you than billionares in the world, though.
geodel 7y ago
Well it absolutely needs to be written. Consider the incessant whine here that people ( mainly software engineers) need to be paid in proportion to "value" they deliver. According to them the lower paid employees like office staff or janitors would not deliver much value so they might as well work for nothing.
- pdimitar 7y ago
  Never in my life have I seen this. Not once. Where are you from?
  - throwaway55554 7y ago
    Look at just about any resume writing service. They make you come up with ways you have "added value" at your current employer. So, yeah, it's out there.
mywittyname 7y ago
It's more that they are out of touch, IMHO. They have absolutely no concept of how far $7.50/hr goes so they just say their employees need to budget better. Perhaps if senior executives received minimum wage paychecks for two months (and no bonuses), they might gain some empathy.
- ohaideredevs 7y ago
  You can't gain empathy when something is temporary. Most of the stress of being poor comes of worry about how to handle long term problems / the fact that life has no point except slaving away. That cannot be replicated without genuinely taking everything away from a person.
  - mywittyname 7y ago
    I disagree, if reading books can increase empathy [0], then I'd expect any activity that forced you to experience the way another person lives would do the same. [0] https://science.sciencemag.org/content/342/6156/377 https://science.sciencemag.org/content/342/6156/377
  - gremlinsinc 7y ago
    They need a show like undercover bosses, but instead the CEO must live on 7.50 for an entire year, and work as their own employee they have 0 access to savings, they cannot use credit either, and they are given 1 suitcase of clothes, a cellphone, laptop, and some feature comforts for their tiny apartment like a 32 inch tv.
    - diogenescynic 7y ago
      I'd pay money to watch Angelo Mozilo go through that.
    - c0vfefe 7y ago
      30 Days Season 1 Episode 1 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wmSGEGOVI34 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wmSGEGOVI34

toasterlovin 7y ago

Never ascribe to malice that which can be explained by incompetence. Lots of things persist because “that’s the way it’s always been done”. Probably what’s going on here, in my opinion.

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
JimBrimble35 7y ago
I think what you are identifying as incompetence is, in fact, well-aged malice. The greedy behavior that leads to the kind of inequality faced by today's society is now so well established that it has become hard to recognize for what it truly is. The fact that this article's author seems to find it novel to trickle down the proceeds of the company to the bulk of it's employees is a pretty good indication of that.
- toasterlovin 7y ago
  > The greedy behavior that leads to the kind of inequality faced by today's society is now so well established that it has become hard to recognize for what it truly is. I know you think you’re arguing against me, but what you described supports my position.
  - _1100 7y ago
    Agreed. It doesn't matter if it is hard to recognize, if you are unable to understand something then you are by definition incompetent with respect to the task or idea.
  - JimBrimble35 7y ago
    It isn't incompetence, it's complacent acceptance of a toxic norm for personal gain.
    - toasterlovin 7y ago
      Fine, incompetence is the wrong word, but malice isn't the right word.
      - JimBrimble35 7y ago
        I think that if you look at the history of the trend, and the politics behind it. The decreases in top marginal tax rate, decreases in corporate tax rates. It starts to really _feel_ malicious. Although you're probably right, I don't think that all of the current c-suite occupants in the nation are acting out of malice.
- csallen 7y ago
  > The greedy behavior that leads to the kind of inequality faced by today's society is now so well established that it has become hard to recognize for what it truly is. So in other words: It no longer requires any malice to pay this way, as it's just a cultural norm in the business world. By the way, it's also a cultural norm in the US to complain about the lack of generosity among those richer than you, and yet spend almost 100% of your salary helping yourself, when you could just as easily spend it on those less fortunate. Charitable donation is trivially easy, even easier than raising the minimum wage at your company. Yet how many people in these comments are highly-paid millennials who would rather buy the newest iPhone than donate that money to those in need? If we want to understand the psychology of those at the "top," we need only look no further than ourselves. Unless you're at the bottom, you're also at the top as far as people less fortunate than you are concerned.
  - jakelazaroff 7y ago
    > So in other words: It no longer requires any malice to pay this way, as it's just a cultural norm in the business world. Sure. But I don't think this is a sufficient defense — at the extremes, cultural norms can result in horrific things even though individual actors may not be motivated by malice. > By the way, it's also a cultural norm in the US to complain about the lack of generosity among those richer than you, and yet spend almost 100% of your salary helping yourself, when you could just as easily spend it on those less fortunate. There's definitely an incongruity between people's expectations of those above them and what they contribute themselves. We should all give more! But even if I were to donate 100% of my salary, it would barely dent things for those 500 employees. When we complain about people above us, we're (usually) not chastising individuals but calling for systemic solutions to these issues. The overarching goal isn't for people to donate more of their resources, but to structure things in a more equitable way so that people don't rely on individual generosity in the first place.
    - DuskStar 7y ago
      > But even if I were to donate 100% of my salary, it would barely dent things for those 500 employees. There's a lot more people like you than billionares in the world, though.

geodel 7y ago

Well it absolutely needs to be written. Consider the incessant whine here that people ( mainly software engineers) need to be paid in proportion to "value" they deliver. According to them the lower paid employees like office staff or janitors would not deliver much value so they might as well work for nothing.

pdimitar 7y ago
Never in my life have I seen this. Not once. Where are you from?
- throwaway55554 7y ago
  Look at just about any resume writing service. They make you come up with ways you have "added value" at your current employer. So, yeah, it's out there.

mywittyname 7y ago

It's more that they are out of touch, IMHO. They have absolutely no concept of how far $7.50/hr goes so they just say their employees need to budget better. Perhaps if senior executives received minimum wage paychecks for two months (and no bonuses), they might gain some empathy.

ohaideredevs 7y ago
You can't gain empathy when something is temporary. Most of the stress of being poor comes of worry about how to handle long term problems / the fact that life has no point except slaving away. That cannot be replicated without genuinely taking everything away from a person.
- mywittyname 7y ago
  I disagree, if reading books can increase empathy [0], then I'd expect any activity that forced you to experience the way another person lives would do the same. [0] https://science.sciencemag.org/content/342/6156/377 https://science.sciencemag.org/content/342/6156/377
- gremlinsinc 7y ago
  They need a show like undercover bosses, but instead the CEO must live on 7.50 for an entire year, and work as their own employee they have 0 access to savings, they cannot use credit either, and they are given 1 suitcase of clothes, a cellphone, laptop, and some feature comforts for their tiny apartment like a 32 inch tv.
  - diogenescynic 7y ago
    I'd pay money to watch Angelo Mozilo go through that.
  - c0vfefe 7y ago
    30 Days Season 1 Episode 1 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wmSGEGOVI34 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wmSGEGOVI34