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Can anyone from China who has worked a 996 provide an account of what the work is like? Do they have heavy PMP-managed work with meeting paralysis or is it jus

Can anyone from China who has worked a 996 provide an account of what the work is like? Do they have heavy PMP-managed work with meeting paralysis or is it just sitting at your desk and being expected to magically perform, or is it just sitting around doing nothing and not being able to leave? All of those are their own types of hell, but they're all different. What are they doing in those 12 hours?

tluyben2 7y ago
As I see my colleagues in China; they are mostly wasting time to stay the longest in the office. I know a few guys who have some shares, that either do not go home or go home for 3-4 hours only. They arrive at 6 am, leave at 8 pm and then go to KTV to do sales which basically means drink like a maniac. And then either back to the office or home for a quick nap. Their boss does not directly tell them to but he does go crazy when they underdeliver or deliver past deadlines, so they show they did anything. Not sure if it helps or not. Some of them seem happy and content doing that life and show no signs os stress even at 40y/o, some are walking dead. The happy ones seem to be the ones that are well paid and get to sit and write code, while the unhappy ones deal with red tape and meetings. Which is what usually happens in my experience in the west as well.
whoevercares 7y ago
Not a direct answer, but most Chinese had undergone tougher hours and more dreadful win-or-your-life-is-screwed college examination pressure during high school. I was in a class where the morning session started from 5:30am and the day ends around 9pm(and we have full Sat and Sunday morning). Just imagine how mentally tough Chinese is when 1 point left you 10+k behind in regional ranking. So honestly 996 means nothing for a lot of people (esp new grads). Even though there are protests now, I’m pessimistic it’ll shake anything eventually
- viscanti 7y ago
  Cumulative stress is cumulative. One doesn't recover from burnout with more burning.
  - on_and_off 7y ago
    you need to experience it yourself or see someone close to you going through a burnout to understand how crippling it is. Some people I know where unable to get anyway near code for years after a burnout. Another person gained deep seated anxiety that they are unable to get rid of.
    - viscanti 7y ago
      Right. The idea that someone can become tougher by subjecting themselves to stress is silly (or at least misguided). That path leads to burnout which is crippling. It doesn't lead to tougher people who can keep burning themselves even more. They just hit a wall where they aren't capable of much of anything.
      - whoevercares 7y ago
        I mostly agree, I do think the limit is higher for Chinese, but it’s not infinite
hh42 7y ago
I worked for a Silicon Valley company. And now I am an employee of the Chinese 'A' company. There are endless features we have to develop. As a developer, I also need to concern about the business value of our project. Basically, I should handle two times of work than before.
- whoevercares 7y ago
  That’s true. I heard Chinese internet CTOs saying this about a feature that took a year to launch in NA when they do recruiting in CA: “We can deliver this in two weeks with the same team size”
  - hh42 7y ago
    What's worse, they just treat us as 'Resources'. One single developer should take care of several projects.(ﾉ｀⊿´)ﾉ
  - chris_wot 7y ago
    Surely that should raise massive red flags and you should realize almost immediately that this is problematic - basically don't do business with them?
  - C1sc0cat 7y ago
    So? In the UK I and another developer delivered in a month what another part of the companies would take 18 months. And we where physically not allowed to be in the office (BT Princess street) outside normal working hours because embarrassing security cockups six months before involving the Queens unlisted numbers :-)
    - logfromblammo 7y ago
      I once sat a desk next to another developer. He finished a UI control in 3 days, and then found out it completely replaced a legacy control that took multiple developers six months to finish. And then shortly thereafter we both got laid off, and the slower folks kept their jobs. It is a mistake to believe that the only requirements are the ones that the developers get to see.
matz1 7y ago
I have some experience but the things is obviously I don't work 12 hours a day continuously. I took plenty of breaks as needed. Also help is I live very close to the office and the pay was good. Overall I saw it as a positive experience.

tluyben2 7y ago

As I see my colleagues in China; they are mostly wasting time to stay the longest in the office. I know a few guys who have some shares, that either do not go home or go home for 3-4 hours only. They arrive at 6 am, leave at 8 pm and then go to KTV to do sales which basically means drink like a maniac. And then either back to the office or home for a quick nap. Their boss does not directly tell them to but he does go crazy when they underdeliver or deliver past deadlines, so they show they did anything. Not sure if it helps or not. Some of them seem happy and content doing that life and show no signs os stress even at 40y/o, some are walking dead. The happy ones seem to be the ones that are well paid and get to sit and write code, while the unhappy ones deal with red tape and meetings. Which is what usually happens in my experience in the west as well.

whoevercares 7y ago

Not a direct answer, but most Chinese had undergone tougher hours and more dreadful win-or-your-life-is-screwed college examination pressure during high school. I was in a class where the morning session started from 5:30am and the day ends around 9pm(and we have full Sat and Sunday morning). Just imagine how mentally tough Chinese is when 1 point left you 10+k behind in regional ranking. So honestly 996 means nothing for a lot of people (esp new grads). Even though there are protests now, I’m pessimistic it’ll shake anything eventually

viscanti 7y ago
Cumulative stress is cumulative. One doesn't recover from burnout with more burning.
- on_and_off 7y ago
  you need to experience it yourself or see someone close to you going through a burnout to understand how crippling it is. Some people I know where unable to get anyway near code for years after a burnout. Another person gained deep seated anxiety that they are unable to get rid of.
  - viscanti 7y ago
    Right. The idea that someone can become tougher by subjecting themselves to stress is silly (or at least misguided). That path leads to burnout which is crippling. It doesn't lead to tougher people who can keep burning themselves even more. They just hit a wall where they aren't capable of much of anything.
    - whoevercares 7y ago
      I mostly agree, I do think the limit is higher for Chinese, but it’s not infinite

hh42 7y ago

I worked for a Silicon Valley company. And now I am an employee of the Chinese 'A' company. There are endless features we have to develop. As a developer, I also need to concern about the business value of our project. Basically, I should handle two times of work than before.

whoevercares 7y ago
That’s true. I heard Chinese internet CTOs saying this about a feature that took a year to launch in NA when they do recruiting in CA: “We can deliver this in two weeks with the same team size”
- hh42 7y ago
  What's worse, they just treat us as 'Resources'. One single developer should take care of several projects.(ﾉ｀⊿´)ﾉ
- chris_wot 7y ago
  Surely that should raise massive red flags and you should realize almost immediately that this is problematic - basically don't do business with them?
- C1sc0cat 7y ago
  So? In the UK I and another developer delivered in a month what another part of the companies would take 18 months. And we where physically not allowed to be in the office (BT Princess street) outside normal working hours because embarrassing security cockups six months before involving the Queens unlisted numbers :-)
  - logfromblammo 7y ago
    I once sat a desk next to another developer. He finished a UI control in 3 days, and then found out it completely replaced a legacy control that took multiple developers six months to finish. And then shortly thereafter we both got laid off, and the slower folks kept their jobs. It is a mistake to believe that the only requirements are the ones that the developers get to see.

matz1 7y ago

I have some experience but the things is obviously I don't work 12 hours a day continuously. I took plenty of breaks as needed. Also help is I live very close to the office and the pay was good. Overall I saw it as a positive experience.