7 ms·
If he would've been correctly re-integrated, this would've maybe never happened. This proves it: all this prison time alone, without good programs in place, wa
by Faaak 7y ago
If he would've been correctly re-integrated, this would've maybe never happened.
This proves it: all this prison time alone, without good programs in place, was just "vengeance" and it didn't work.
- nick_kline 7y agoYou can't draw conclusions from one case. Treatment could have helped him, but he was a menace in that state and shouldn't be released. So you can use this one case to argue either way. I'd sure not want him released. Most people aren't like this.
- Faaak 7y agoYou don't know either if he was a menace or not. People change, believe it or not.
- Grustaf 7y agoIs there any evidence that it’s possible to “cure” violent sex offenders?
- butteroverflow 7y agoOr psychopaths, for that matter. I would very much like to see the attempts to "cure" someone like Ted Bundy.
- King-Aaron 7y agoThey cured him pretty well IIRC.
- Fjolsvith 7y agoPeople can change, but it requires a lot. Most of the time, people will just follow their patterns of thinking and behavior, mainly because they are not aware of the patterns and do not have correctives to change their behavior when they recognize old patterns. Sex offender treatment tries to train them in this.
- thejohnconway 7y agoI don’t believe there is any evidence suggesting successful treatment for these kinds of offenders. Known recidivism is quite high, and combined with the underreporting of sexual crimes, meaning the reoffending rate is almost certainly way higher. We’re taking a massive risk releasing them. I’m comfortable making the moral call that the freedom of a convicted child molester is worth less than the 25-99% risk that they will molest another child.
- Fjolsvith 7y agoCareful, there's a slippery slope to drawing these conclusions about other classes of undesirables that start with your broad and unproven statement about sex offenders. Show us some studies about recidivism that prove sex offenders recommit sex crimes at a greater recidivism rate than, say, drunk drivers or drug users.
- Fjolsvith 7y agoThe slippery slope goes in two directions, mainly: First, if we as society are going to lock them up forever, why not just save ourselves the expense and execute them all. Secondly, if we are going to do this to Sex Offenders, and it proves really useful and effective, let's start doing it to violent criminals. Then, say, bank robbers. Then, we should get rid of all the drug dealers. The repeat drug users gotta go now. While we're making society better, let's also clean up all the fraudsters and tax cheats. An example that springs to mind is the way Nazi Germany dealt with the Jewish people. I believe they were morally okay with it, too.
- thejohnconway 7y ago> First, if we as society are going to lock them up forever, why not just save ourselves the expense and execute them all. Because locking someone up is reversible. Your slippery slope argument is a logical fallacy in any case. Not all crimes have equal rates of damage or recidivism. There are many good reasons to differentiate between types of crimes and their motivations. Presumably you agree that we should probably lock up serial killers, right? According to your style of slippery-slope argument you have no way of distinguishing between that and executing children that won't go to bed on time, because it's all a continuum.
- dragonwriter 7y ago> People change, believe it or not. People do change, but people who sexually abuse children outside of their immediate family do so far more rarely than, well, most other socially unacceptable behaviors. The degree of certainty that someone who has displayed that behavior remains a menace just based on that fact alone is fairly high.
- Fjolsvith 7y agoI also agree with this. A very wise man I once knew had a saying he liked to give. "Past behavior is the best predictor of future thinking. "
- _pmf_ 7y agoHomosexual conversion therapy does not work, but pedophilia conversion therapy magically works?
- Faaak 7y agoWell, these are two different things. One is to like A instead of B. The other is to still like A, but not do anything about it.
- ramblerman 7y agoIf we follow your analogy, that these 2 things are similar. Then we should also accept the premise that pedophiles are probably born that way. Which would make identifying them, before they commit a crime, hugely beneficial. Treating it as a disease, might lower the stigma, and allow these people to self identify themselves.
- adrianN 7y agoThere actually are programs like that. I've seen posters saying something like "Do you like children more than you like? Contact ..."
- layoutIfNeeded 7y agoDefine “correctly re-integrated”. Note: defining it based of re-offending makes your argument circular.
- qazpot 7y agoSo it is the society's fault and not the fact that he is pedophile.
- ramblerman 7y agoWhat a simplistic dichotomy. Consider the possibility that there are a set amount of pedophile's born in every generation. We as a society can decide how we treat people with that condition, and what might work best, reducing suffering, at a reasonable cost. It's not a ridiculous statement to assume we haven't found the global optimum for that problem. Specially considering the huge risk of recidivism.
- qazpot 7y ago> Consider the possibility that there are a set amount of pedophile's born in every generation He was not jailed because he was born that way. He molested and raped a child.
- majewsky 7y agoThere are programs for enabling pedophiles to live with their kink without committing crimes. The public is generally not interested in funding them because they don't like to admit that pedophiles are humans, too. So yeah, it's absolutely a failure of society.
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- PedroBatista 7y agoIf you think all those people in prison can be re-integrated you’ve never seen true evil. Fantasies and wishful-thinking apart, most of the prison population are a real threat to society and a not-so-small percentage will stay that way forever. Others are made that way inside prisons.
- keanzu 7y agoIncarceration rates per 100K population: U.S. 693; Germany 76; Netherlands 69 Germany and the Netherlands both have lower violent crime rates. An extra 600 per 100K Americans deserve to be imprisoned and are a real threat to society or there's something wrong with the US approach.