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Given this article's argument (the speed of traffic is largely independent of the speed limit, and depends more on the road itself), the logical path to decreas

Given this article's argument (the speed of traffic is largely independent of the speed limit, and depends more on the road itself), the logical path to decreasing road speeds is https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traffic_calming https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traffic_calming. In my experience, California residential streets are especially egregiously bad in road design, having wide streets (often approaching 2 full lanes per direction, although the outer "lane" is unmarked and used for street parking) that suggest a speed 15 mph or so greater than the speed limit.

wolrah 7y ago
That is 100% correct. If you build a 50 MPH road through a neighborhood, you're going to get 50 MPH traffic through a neighborhood. What the signs say is irrelevant unless there's a cop right there. If you want slow traffic, build slow roads. Likewise, if you build your house on a fast road, don't expect traffic to slow down just because your kids are there.
notatoad 7y ago
traffic calming measures in residential streets have so many benefits. bulb-outs not only slow traffic, they reduce pedestrian crossing distances. street trees slow traffic by making the street seem visually narrower to drivers without actually narrowing the street, and also create shade, improve property values, and regulate temperature.
- mzs 7y ago
  Until the ladder truck can't negotiate the corner.
  - masonic 7y ago
    People downvoting this need to learn from history. The Oakland Hills fire[0] was made far more lethal than it should have been because the narrow, vehicle-clogged roads prevented fire trucks from ascending the hills. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oakland_firestorm_of_1991 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oakland_firestorm_of_1991
    - bobthepanda 7y ago
      It‘s worth noting that Europe has lots of small winding roads and is not noticeably more dangerous in terms of fire safety. In fact, what has happened is that average fire truck size in the US is much larger than in Europe, and that is what drives the requirement for wider streets. https://www.citylab.com/transportation/2018/12/fire-trucks-engines-emergency-vehicles-too-big-for-cities/577735/ https://www.citylab.com/transportation/2018/12/fire-trucks-e...
    - mzs 7y ago
      Or the subdivision I used to live in where right before they moved the city hall across the street they tore-up the landscaping in the middle of the entrance and bulges on the sides near intersections for this reason. For a few years it was this way, fortunately there was no fire in the meantime. They added more speed humps in the process.
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]
  - Doxin 7y ago
    Where the obvious solution is to build less obscenely oversized firefighting vehicles.
tomatotomato37 7y ago
I agree traffic calming is a very useful tool in making streets safe, but I also want to bring attention to this picture found in the gallery of that page and how it relates to the basis of the original article. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traffic_calming#/media/File:Directional_closure_violation.jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traffic_calming#/media/File:Di...

wolrah 7y ago

That is 100% correct. If you build a 50 MPH road through a neighborhood, you're going to get 50 MPH traffic through a neighborhood. What the signs say is irrelevant unless there's a cop right there. If you want slow traffic, build slow roads. Likewise, if you build your house on a fast road, don't expect traffic to slow down just because your kids are there.

notatoad 7y ago

traffic calming measures in residential streets have so many benefits. bulb-outs not only slow traffic, they reduce pedestrian crossing distances. street trees slow traffic by making the street seem visually narrower to drivers without actually narrowing the street, and also create shade, improve property values, and regulate temperature.

mzs 7y ago
Until the ladder truck can't negotiate the corner.
- masonic 7y ago
  People downvoting this need to learn from history. The Oakland Hills fire[0] was made far more lethal than it should have been because the narrow, vehicle-clogged roads prevented fire trucks from ascending the hills. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oakland_firestorm_of_1991 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oakland_firestorm_of_1991
  - bobthepanda 7y ago
    It‘s worth noting that Europe has lots of small winding roads and is not noticeably more dangerous in terms of fire safety. In fact, what has happened is that average fire truck size in the US is much larger than in Europe, and that is what drives the requirement for wider streets. https://www.citylab.com/transportation/2018/12/fire-trucks-engines-emergency-vehicles-too-big-for-cities/577735/ https://www.citylab.com/transportation/2018/12/fire-trucks-e...
  - mzs 7y ago
    Or the subdivision I used to live in where right before they moved the city hall across the street they tore-up the landscaping in the middle of the entrance and bulges on the sides near intersections for this reason. For a few years it was this way, fortunately there was no fire in the meantime. They added more speed humps in the process.
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
- Doxin 7y ago
  Where the obvious solution is to build less obscenely oversized firefighting vehicles.

tomatotomato37 7y ago

I agree traffic calming is a very useful tool in making streets safe, but I also want to bring attention to this picture found in the gallery of that page and how it relates to the basis of the original article. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traffic_calming#/media/File:Directional_closure_violation.jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traffic_calming#/media/File:Di...