4 ms·

The article is misleading. The manufacturer does fix this. They just don't fix the bad chip. The replace the card instead.

rizwank 7y ago
Thank you. What a willful ridiculous article from the author.
- icelancer 7y ago
  No, it isn't. When the board is out of warranty they make you replace the entire media unit, which can cost up to $5000. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o-7b1waoj9Q&t=525 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o-7b1waoj9Q&t=525
starshadowx2 7y ago
Except they don't if the car is out of warranty, which (at least in Canada) is 4 years or 80,000 km. I don't think this is just me but I believe cars should be able to last longer than 4 years and not get bricked by fault of the manufacturer and then not at least easily give me the ability to fix it myself if they won't.
- slg 7y ago
  Do they not replace it out of warranty or simply don't pay for it out of warranty? There is a huge difference between those two options. If it is the former, I would imagine it is just a matter of time before a lawsuit. If it is the latter, then isn't this functionally the same as a particular model of car having a bad transmission or similarly critical ICE component that regularly fails much earlier than expected?
  - lutorm 7y ago
    Powertrain components are required by EPA to have a 10yr/100k miles warranty, I thought? So it's not exactly the same situation because fundamental parts of the powertrain are covered by a longer warranty.
    - slg 7y ago
      That doesn't appear to be true [1]. It seems like a majority of powertrain warranties are in the 4-6 year and 50k-70k mile range. Tesla's 4 year and 50k warranty on this part would therefore be on the low end, but it matches the powertrain warranties for Audi, BMW, Volvo, Mercedes, and several other manufacturers. [1] - https://www.motor1.com/features/253277/comparing-new-vehicle-warranties/ https://www.motor1.com/features/253277/comparing-new-vehicle...
wil421 7y ago
Wait. Do they have a fix but the fix is replacing the board and not the bad chip? Is Telsa not fixing things or did they just use something that had a short life span? Not sure why I read this article.
- zrobotics 7y ago
  Tesla screwed up by using eMMC memory (flash memory with an integrated controller) and not disabling system logging. The additional writes cause the flash memory to wear rapidly, which should have been mitigated as this is not a new issue in embedded devices. As the chip is soldered and not socketed, the solution is to swap the entire (expensive) board, and Tesla won't do this for out-of-warranty vehicles and hasn't extended warranty support. What makes this somewhat egregious is the lack of foresight, as well as the fact that Tesla uses standard socketed SD cards in other modules in the vehicle.
  - zaroth 7y ago
    Tesla won’t do this for free for out-of-warranty vehicles. Replacement cost of the entire board is unfortunately high at around $2,700. [1] - https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/2700-to-fix-mcu-might-diy-but-how-much-to-reprogram-new-unit.94391/ https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/2700-to-fix-mcu-migh...
    - atonse 7y ago
      Ok but why not fix the engineering flaw so so it isn't a $2,700 fix? This seems like doing a software fix, where you add buffering to your logging writes, would go a long way to fixing this.
    - wil421 7y ago
      From your link: >I think we are on drivetrain #5 and it is now that one clunking intermittently, so maybe we take that one back in. We are on battery charger #2 and battery rebuild #3. We had most of the upgrades (wind noise on the door windows, etc). We had a left rear door handle start to go bad, took it to the shop and they fiddled with it and wanted to replace it, but afterwards no problems so we did not replace it. Drivetrain #5, charger #2, and battery #3. All under 125k miles. Wow I’m not so sure I’ll be buying a Tesla for my wife.
mannykannot 7y ago
According to [1], Tesla will not replace the minimum removable unit, but only the entire assembly, at a cost of around $2.7k. And, as with other parts replacement issues at Tesla, it is apparently not a quick turnaround. The article is wrong to say these cars are bricked, but it is not a small issue, either. [1] https://youtube.com/watch?v=o-7b1waoj9Q&t=525 https://youtube.com/watch?v=o-7b1waoj9Q&t=525

rizwank 7y ago

Thank you. What a willful ridiculous article from the author.

icelancer 7y ago
No, it isn't. When the board is out of warranty they make you replace the entire media unit, which can cost up to $5000. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o-7b1waoj9Q&t=525 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o-7b1waoj9Q&t=525

starshadowx2 7y ago

Except they don't if the car is out of warranty, which (at least in Canada) is 4 years or 80,000 km. I don't think this is just me but I believe cars should be able to last longer than 4 years and not get bricked by fault of the manufacturer and then not at least easily give me the ability to fix it myself if they won't.

slg 7y ago
Do they not replace it out of warranty or simply don't pay for it out of warranty? There is a huge difference between those two options. If it is the former, I would imagine it is just a matter of time before a lawsuit. If it is the latter, then isn't this functionally the same as a particular model of car having a bad transmission or similarly critical ICE component that regularly fails much earlier than expected?
- lutorm 7y ago
  Powertrain components are required by EPA to have a 10yr/100k miles warranty, I thought? So it's not exactly the same situation because fundamental parts of the powertrain are covered by a longer warranty.
  - slg 7y ago
    That doesn't appear to be true [1]. It seems like a majority of powertrain warranties are in the 4-6 year and 50k-70k mile range. Tesla's 4 year and 50k warranty on this part would therefore be on the low end, but it matches the powertrain warranties for Audi, BMW, Volvo, Mercedes, and several other manufacturers. [1] - https://www.motor1.com/features/253277/comparing-new-vehicle-warranties/ https://www.motor1.com/features/253277/comparing-new-vehicle...

wil421 7y ago

Wait. Do they have a fix but the fix is replacing the board and not the bad chip? Is Telsa not fixing things or did they just use something that had a short life span? Not sure why I read this article.

zrobotics 7y ago
Tesla screwed up by using eMMC memory (flash memory with an integrated controller) and not disabling system logging. The additional writes cause the flash memory to wear rapidly, which should have been mitigated as this is not a new issue in embedded devices. As the chip is soldered and not socketed, the solution is to swap the entire (expensive) board, and Tesla won't do this for out-of-warranty vehicles and hasn't extended warranty support. What makes this somewhat egregious is the lack of foresight, as well as the fact that Tesla uses standard socketed SD cards in other modules in the vehicle.
- zaroth 7y ago
  Tesla won’t do this for free for out-of-warranty vehicles. Replacement cost of the entire board is unfortunately high at around $2,700. [1] - https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/2700-to-fix-mcu-might-diy-but-how-much-to-reprogram-new-unit.94391/ https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/2700-to-fix-mcu-migh...
  - atonse 7y ago
    Ok but why not fix the engineering flaw so so it isn't a $2,700 fix? This seems like doing a software fix, where you add buffering to your logging writes, would go a long way to fixing this.
  - wil421 7y ago
    From your link: >I think we are on drivetrain #5 and it is now that one clunking intermittently, so maybe we take that one back in. We are on battery charger #2 and battery rebuild #3. We had most of the upgrades (wind noise on the door windows, etc). We had a left rear door handle start to go bad, took it to the shop and they fiddled with it and wanted to replace it, but afterwards no problems so we did not replace it. Drivetrain #5, charger #2, and battery #3. All under 125k miles. Wow I’m not so sure I’ll be buying a Tesla for my wife.

mannykannot 7y ago

According to [1], Tesla will not replace the minimum removable unit, but only the entire assembly, at a cost of around $2.7k. And, as with other parts replacement issues at Tesla, it is apparently not a quick turnaround. The article is wrong to say these cars are bricked, but it is not a small issue, either. [1] https://youtube.com/watch?v=o-7b1waoj9Q&t=525 https://youtube.com/watch?v=o-7b1waoj9Q&t=525