6 ms·

That's the marketing narrative. In reality, Apple's implementations tend to be just as half-assed as everyone else's. Egregious security problems like setting

That's the marketing narrative. In reality, Apple's implementations tend to be just as half-assed as everyone else's. Egregious security problems like setting the password as the hint on their FDE, date handling bugs forcing people to factory reset devices and lose data, for all the glory people give them on UI stuff, their file manager and window management on MacOS are exceedingly awful.

PascLeRasc 7y ago
Finder is a bad file manager? That's a new one. I'll listen to that take when Windows File Explorer has tabs.
- buildzr 7y ago
  Finder is awful IMO, this thread is probably fully of Apple-y types who will disagree, but if you're actually interested: - Why does hitting the enter key not "go into directory" or "open file"? - I can't even see a path tree to know where I am in the filesystem out of the box. - Search, by default searches the entire system not the directory I'm in - The default presentation is some weird list of random stuff from my system, recent files and temporary files and assorted irrelevant garbage. I had to fuss with options for quite some time just to get this to be intelligible. - What the hell are all these colors? Why would any sane person want to group their files by color? In the end I wiped OSX off the machine as I just couldn't put up with it's constant annoyances for no gain - more of window management than file management though. I shouldn't need 3rd party tools like Spectacle just to make things tolerable on a modern OS. Having used dozens of different desktops on Linux and Windows I didn't think a "user friendly" one would be such a pile of annoyances. Turns out that part was marketing wank too I guess. Just in case anyone reading this has noticed the problem here but hasn't quite woken up to it: I really hate that people seem to accept their marketing at face value and not analyze any further, think they're doing something wrong if they run into problems with an Apple product. It's not just you. They make garbage and promote it like it's gold and people fall for it.
  - reaperducer 7y ago
    I know I shouldn't feed the troll, but here goes anyway... Why does hitting the enter key not "go into directory" or "open file"? Because Return renames the file. To open the file or directory you use Command-O, just like you'd use Command-P to print the file. I can't even see a path tree to know where I am in the filesystem out of the box. View > Show Path Bar. Or, Command-Option-P Search, by default searches the entire system not the directory I'm in On my machine it searches where I am. Just tried it. The default presentation is some weird list of random stuff from my system, recent files and temporary files and assorted irrelevant garbage. I had to fuss with options for quite some time just to get this to be intelligible. Sounds like you're using a Mac from 1987. What the hell are all these colors? Why would any sane person want to group their files by color? I do it all the time. If I'm going through a bunch of files that I need to deal with later, I'll tag the files for one client yellow, and another client blue, and another client green. When it's time to do something with those files I just type "green" into the search, and all of those tagged files just show up. Also, while the tags are color-coded, it's not about the colors. It's file tagging. You can tag a file "Client X" or "Taxes" or "Animals" and then search for all files tagged Taxes modified in the last three months of a particular file type. The colors are just a place to start.
    - deathanatos 7y ago
      > Because Return renames the file. Pretty sure the guy you're responding to knows that. The question is why is the key mapped to "rename", when "open" is likely the far more common command? > On my machine it searches where I am. Just tried it. I also just tried it; the default is "This Mac". Here's a GIF of another user showing this behavior: https://apple.stackexchange.com/a/219410/73670 https://apple.stackexchange.com/a/219410/73670
      - pwinnski 7y ago
        Finder -> Preferences -> Advanced: "When performing a search:" you can choose from "Search the Current Folder" (my current setting) or "Search This Mac" (apparently yours) or "Use the Previous Search Scope"
- scarface74 7y ago
  John Siracusa has been ranting about how much worse the Finder is in OS X than classic MacOS for over 15 years. https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2003/04/finder/ https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2003/04/finder/
  - pwinnski 7y ago
    Seems like two different comparisons being made, which can possibly be resolved like this: MacOS Finder > OSX Finder > Windows Explorer
  - coldtea 7y ago
    John Siracusa flogged a particular dead horse idea few care about (spatial Finder) to death.
    - scarface74 7y ago
      To his credit, so far he’s two out of three with his hobby horses: Copeland 2010: that Apple needed to think about what’s next after Objective C and the related OS X frameworks. http://arstechnica.com/staff/fatbits/2005/09/1372.ars http://arstechnica.com/staff/fatbits/2005/09/1372.ars We already have Swift and Marzipan is on the way. And MacOS needing a new file system. https://www.macworld.com/article/1153576/siracusa_osx.html https://www.macworld.com/article/1153576/siracusa_osx.html Apple did that with APFS. Maybe there is hope....
ksec 7y ago
In reality, Some Apple's implementations tend to be just as half-assed as everyone else's.

PascLeRasc 7y ago

Finder is a bad file manager? That's a new one. I'll listen to that take when Windows File Explorer has tabs.

buildzr 7y ago
Finder is awful IMO, this thread is probably fully of Apple-y types who will disagree, but if you're actually interested: - Why does hitting the enter key not "go into directory" or "open file"? - I can't even see a path tree to know where I am in the filesystem out of the box. - Search, by default searches the entire system not the directory I'm in - The default presentation is some weird list of random stuff from my system, recent files and temporary files and assorted irrelevant garbage. I had to fuss with options for quite some time just to get this to be intelligible. - What the hell are all these colors? Why would any sane person want to group their files by color? In the end I wiped OSX off the machine as I just couldn't put up with it's constant annoyances for no gain - more of window management than file management though. I shouldn't need 3rd party tools like Spectacle just to make things tolerable on a modern OS. Having used dozens of different desktops on Linux and Windows I didn't think a "user friendly" one would be such a pile of annoyances. Turns out that part was marketing wank too I guess. Just in case anyone reading this has noticed the problem here but hasn't quite woken up to it: I really hate that people seem to accept their marketing at face value and not analyze any further, think they're doing something wrong if they run into problems with an Apple product. It's not just you. They make garbage and promote it like it's gold and people fall for it.
- reaperducer 7y ago
  I know I shouldn't feed the troll, but here goes anyway... Why does hitting the enter key not "go into directory" or "open file"? Because Return renames the file. To open the file or directory you use Command-O, just like you'd use Command-P to print the file. I can't even see a path tree to know where I am in the filesystem out of the box. View > Show Path Bar. Or, Command-Option-P Search, by default searches the entire system not the directory I'm in On my machine it searches where I am. Just tried it. The default presentation is some weird list of random stuff from my system, recent files and temporary files and assorted irrelevant garbage. I had to fuss with options for quite some time just to get this to be intelligible. Sounds like you're using a Mac from 1987. What the hell are all these colors? Why would any sane person want to group their files by color? I do it all the time. If I'm going through a bunch of files that I need to deal with later, I'll tag the files for one client yellow, and another client blue, and another client green. When it's time to do something with those files I just type "green" into the search, and all of those tagged files just show up. Also, while the tags are color-coded, it's not about the colors. It's file tagging. You can tag a file "Client X" or "Taxes" or "Animals" and then search for all files tagged Taxes modified in the last three months of a particular file type. The colors are just a place to start.
  - deathanatos 7y ago
    > Because Return renames the file. Pretty sure the guy you're responding to knows that. The question is why is the key mapped to "rename", when "open" is likely the far more common command? > On my machine it searches where I am. Just tried it. I also just tried it; the default is "This Mac". Here's a GIF of another user showing this behavior: https://apple.stackexchange.com/a/219410/73670 https://apple.stackexchange.com/a/219410/73670
    - pwinnski 7y ago
      Finder -> Preferences -> Advanced: "When performing a search:" you can choose from "Search the Current Folder" (my current setting) or "Search This Mac" (apparently yours) or "Use the Previous Search Scope"
scarface74 7y ago
John Siracusa has been ranting about how much worse the Finder is in OS X than classic MacOS for over 15 years. https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2003/04/finder/ https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2003/04/finder/
- pwinnski 7y ago
  Seems like two different comparisons being made, which can possibly be resolved like this: MacOS Finder > OSX Finder > Windows Explorer
- coldtea 7y ago
  John Siracusa flogged a particular dead horse idea few care about (spatial Finder) to death.
  - scarface74 7y ago
    To his credit, so far he’s two out of three with his hobby horses: Copeland 2010: that Apple needed to think about what’s next after Objective C and the related OS X frameworks. http://arstechnica.com/staff/fatbits/2005/09/1372.ars http://arstechnica.com/staff/fatbits/2005/09/1372.ars We already have Swift and Marzipan is on the way. And MacOS needing a new file system. https://www.macworld.com/article/1153576/siracusa_osx.html https://www.macworld.com/article/1153576/siracusa_osx.html Apple did that with APFS. Maybe there is hope....

ksec 7y ago

In reality, Some Apple's implementations tend to be just as half-assed as everyone else's.