4 ms·

Israel’s “successful” system is just racial profiling. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_profiling_in_Israel https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_profili

Israel’s “successful” system is just racial profiling. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_profiling_in_Israel https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_profiling_in_Israel

oh_sigh 7y ago
At what point is it wrong to profile someone? If every terrorist and no one else had a blue crystal at the end of their nose, could we use that as a signal to check these people? What if every terrorist and 1 innocent had that? Where is the line drawn between when you can and can't use a data point to influence your decision? For what it's worth, I'm a man, and it seems that men tend to be more violent and more likely to be terrorists than women. I wouldn't mind if I on average got extra scrutiny because of my gender relative to women.
- cheerlessbog 7y ago
  The problem is when you profile for negative behavior based on characteristics that attract bigotry and prejudice. Whatever your motivation is, you're reinforcing the negative dynamic. If there was an outbreak of aircraft hijacking among men with pierced noses it would probably not be too problematic to profile for it at least initially.
veidr 7y ago
That's sometimes how Japan does it as well. A few years back I had to take a day trip from Tokyo to Sapporo to install a piece of hardware. At the Tokyo Narita airport, this Japanese guy in jeans and a leisure jacket standing next to me suddenly pulled out a badge and said (in English), "Police." That was unusual, but he went away after asking me a few questions about where I was going. When I arrived at Sapporo, I collected my bag and was walking to the bus when this Japanese guy in jeans and a leisure jacket walked over to me, pulled out a badge, and said (in English), "Police." He too asked me a few questions and went away. When I returned to the airport a few hours later to fly back to Tokyo, this young woman in an Oakland Raiders jacket came over to where I was buying a drink from a vending machine and asked where I was from. I told her that I was actually from northern California and the Raiders were my home team. After chatting with her for a couple minutes, I went to find my gate, and as I was walking this Japanese guy in jeans and a leisure jacket stepped over to me and pulled out a badge and said (in English), "Police." And yes, it happened again one more time when I got back to Narita. So the MO was obviously, "Find all visually identifiable persons of non-Japanese ethnicity and conduct a brief interview. And dress casually!" It was slightly annoying, but they were all reasonably polite. I told the fourth cop that I had been stopped four times that day, and asked why they were doing it, and he told me there was some sort of Asian economic summit happening. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
- wongarsu 7y ago
  To be fair, you could have been profiled based on your choice of shoes or hairstyle. Without knowing who else they stopped you can't really tell whether it was about etnicity or something else.
  - veidr 7y ago
    Yes, but I have a hunnnnnch...
wongarsu 7y ago
Racial profiling is a part of it, but a large part is also seeing how people are acting around the airport and reacting to security and questions. Putting down the entire approach just because you don't agree with one facet of it is unfair.

Israel’s “successful” system is just racial profiling. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_profiling_in_Israel https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_profiling_in_Israel

oh_sigh 7y ago

At what point is it wrong to profile someone? If every terrorist and no one else had a blue crystal at the end of their nose, could we use that as a signal to check these people? What if every terrorist and 1 innocent had that? Where is the line drawn between when you can and can't use a data point to influence your decision? For what it's worth, I'm a man, and it seems that men tend to be more violent and more likely to be terrorists than women. I wouldn't mind if I on average got extra scrutiny because of my gender relative to women.

cheerlessbog 7y ago
The problem is when you profile for negative behavior based on characteristics that attract bigotry and prejudice. Whatever your motivation is, you're reinforcing the negative dynamic. If there was an outbreak of aircraft hijacking among men with pierced noses it would probably not be too problematic to profile for it at least initially.

veidr 7y ago

That's sometimes how Japan does it as well. A few years back I had to take a day trip from Tokyo to Sapporo to install a piece of hardware. At the Tokyo Narita airport, this Japanese guy in jeans and a leisure jacket standing next to me suddenly pulled out a badge and said (in English), "Police." That was unusual, but he went away after asking me a few questions about where I was going. When I arrived at Sapporo, I collected my bag and was walking to the bus when this Japanese guy in jeans and a leisure jacket walked over to me, pulled out a badge, and said (in English), "Police." He too asked me a few questions and went away. When I returned to the airport a few hours later to fly back to Tokyo, this young woman in an Oakland Raiders jacket came over to where I was buying a drink from a vending machine and asked where I was from. I told her that I was actually from northern California and the Raiders were my home team. After chatting with her for a couple minutes, I went to find my gate, and as I was walking this Japanese guy in jeans and a leisure jacket stepped over to me and pulled out a badge and said (in English), "Police." And yes, it happened again one more time when I got back to Narita. So the MO was obviously, "Find all visually identifiable persons of non-Japanese ethnicity and conduct a brief interview. And dress casually!" It was slightly annoying, but they were all reasonably polite. I told the fourth cop that I had been stopped four times that day, and asked why they were doing it, and he told me there was some sort of Asian economic summit happening. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

wongarsu 7y ago
To be fair, you could have been profiled based on your choice of shoes or hairstyle. Without knowing who else they stopped you can't really tell whether it was about etnicity or something else.
- veidr 7y ago
  Yes, but I have a hunnnnnch...

wongarsu 7y ago

Racial profiling is a part of it, but a large part is also seeing how people are acting around the airport and reacting to security and questions. Putting down the entire approach just because you don't agree with one facet of it is unfair.