5 ms·

It's going to be a wild ride. While (*most) people seem to like using Uber, headlines about how the unit economics don't work, how drivers can't make a living,

It's going to be a wild ride. While (*most) people seem to like using Uber, headlines about how the unit economics don't work, how drivers can't make a living, how their working conditions aren't tenable keep popping up. How does Uber intend to address this? In addition, I have questions about the service's ability to grow significant multipliers. It really feels like they've reached the majority of their markets three years ago, and have been tweaking things since. Why would you invest in this? Is there a clear value proposition for future growth?

behringer 7y ago
You're investing in driverless cars at this point.
- munk-a 7y ago
  But not in one of the companies that appears to be well poised to win first entrance into the market. I think it's likely a dark horse will end up being first to market - but I think google will be there pretty soon after - uber's probably going to end up retrofitting any hardware they've developed with the winner's software as a way to scrounge back some of the R&D costs.
- jressey 7y ago
  I am a bit more cynical and I would say you are investing in paying off the earlier investors.
- inflatableDodo 7y ago
  Sounds like a euphemism for betting on horses.
  - behringer 7y ago
    That's what the stock market is
strikelaserclaw 7y ago
The whole thing is bizarre, who is buying these stocks?
- r00fus 7y ago
  Institutional investors?
- chomp 7y ago
  Funds, mostly. Investors who want a large stake of control and see intrinsic value in a TNC outside of the numbers. People who buy into California math. People buying a $42 lottery ticket. ML trading algorithms who have a tensor weighted heavily on "unicorn going public" that ends up equating to "Buy". Family or friends of employees that want to buy so they can "root for the company" (Yes this sounds ridiculous but this happened to a personal friend of mine and his mother still always asks why the stock is down 300% from when she bought it, and when she can expect for it to go up.) There's a lot of reasons why people would buy Uber. But for anyone who is investing safely for retirement, I think it's easy to see that this is not an investable company at the moment.
- inscionent 7y ago
  Many retirement portfolio managers.
- sigstoat 7y ago
  not the index funds, unlike what the sibling comments are suggesting. IPOs aren't even added to the indexes until it's been some months since their IPO.
ProAm 7y ago
OR how about the super questionable culture of the company and its executives and leadership? Those are such red flags by themselves... This is a horrid company with a horrible past that wouldn't die because of VC money.
- inflatableDodo 7y ago
  I had a funny discussion about Uber with my uncle. I said I refuse to use it because they are a shitty company who are only cheap because they are using investor money to subsidise the rides on the plan of forcing the other players out of the market. His answer was that the barriers to entry on private car hire are so low that if Uber are doing this as their plan and I dislike them, I should use them as much as possible, as then they will collapse quicker.
  - eridius 7y ago
    Doing exactly what Uber wants isn't how you kill them. They're subsidizing the rides right now, but if everybody followed your uncle's advice, Uber would very quickly "win" the rideshare wars, establish their long-sought-after monopoly, and raise prices.
    - toomuchtodo 7y ago
      Better to support legislation that pushes the minimum wage up for rideshare and taxi drivers in top markets (see: Lyft $17/hr minimum in NYC). Faster death than trying to bleed Uber and Lyft dry through rides (which could take forever depending on investor taste for losses), and full self driving won't arrive anytime soon. Ride the populism wave.
      - inflatableDodo 7y ago
        >which could take forever depending on investor taste for losses If the existing investors had much more of a taste for losses, why the IPO?
zeropnc 7y ago
Ehm majority of their markets? The entire developing world says hello
Morialkar 7y ago
I think they hope to boost their value by going into the self-driving cars/cabs business, how much that will work if up in the air though...
- mtgx 7y ago
  Full self-driving cars will be unproven/limited to certain very specific areas for a while. And Uber will have to deal with the liability from accidents, too, plus the media storms (and they have enough of those already).
partiallypro 7y ago
Is not just Uber, it's LYFT, neither can seem to make a profit. That kind of worries me because both are so convenient and so help people with limited income.

behringer 7y ago

You're investing in driverless cars at this point.

munk-a 7y ago
But not in one of the companies that appears to be well poised to win first entrance into the market. I think it's likely a dark horse will end up being first to market - but I think google will be there pretty soon after - uber's probably going to end up retrofitting any hardware they've developed with the winner's software as a way to scrounge back some of the R&D costs.
jressey 7y ago
I am a bit more cynical and I would say you are investing in paying off the earlier investors.
inflatableDodo 7y ago
Sounds like a euphemism for betting on horses.
- behringer 7y ago
  That's what the stock market is

strikelaserclaw 7y ago

The whole thing is bizarre, who is buying these stocks?

r00fus 7y ago
Institutional investors?
chomp 7y ago
Funds, mostly. Investors who want a large stake of control and see intrinsic value in a TNC outside of the numbers. People who buy into California math. People buying a $42 lottery ticket. ML trading algorithms who have a tensor weighted heavily on "unicorn going public" that ends up equating to "Buy". Family or friends of employees that want to buy so they can "root for the company" (Yes this sounds ridiculous but this happened to a personal friend of mine and his mother still always asks why the stock is down 300% from when she bought it, and when she can expect for it to go up.) There's a lot of reasons why people would buy Uber. But for anyone who is investing safely for retirement, I think it's easy to see that this is not an investable company at the moment.
inscionent 7y ago
Many retirement portfolio managers.
sigstoat 7y ago
not the index funds, unlike what the sibling comments are suggesting. IPOs aren't even added to the indexes until it's been some months since their IPO.

ProAm 7y ago

OR how about the super questionable culture of the company and its executives and leadership? Those are such red flags by themselves... This is a horrid company with a horrible past that wouldn't die because of VC money.

inflatableDodo 7y ago
I had a funny discussion about Uber with my uncle. I said I refuse to use it because they are a shitty company who are only cheap because they are using investor money to subsidise the rides on the plan of forcing the other players out of the market. His answer was that the barriers to entry on private car hire are so low that if Uber are doing this as their plan and I dislike them, I should use them as much as possible, as then they will collapse quicker.
- eridius 7y ago
  Doing exactly what Uber wants isn't how you kill them. They're subsidizing the rides right now, but if everybody followed your uncle's advice, Uber would very quickly "win" the rideshare wars, establish their long-sought-after monopoly, and raise prices.
  - toomuchtodo 7y ago
    Better to support legislation that pushes the minimum wage up for rideshare and taxi drivers in top markets (see: Lyft $17/hr minimum in NYC). Faster death than trying to bleed Uber and Lyft dry through rides (which could take forever depending on investor taste for losses), and full self driving won't arrive anytime soon. Ride the populism wave.
    - inflatableDodo 7y ago
      >which could take forever depending on investor taste for losses If the existing investors had much more of a taste for losses, why the IPO?

zeropnc 7y ago

Ehm majority of their markets? The entire developing world says hello

Morialkar 7y ago

I think they hope to boost their value by going into the self-driving cars/cabs business, how much that will work if up in the air though...

mtgx 7y ago
Full self-driving cars will be unproven/limited to certain very specific areas for a while. And Uber will have to deal with the liability from accidents, too, plus the media storms (and they have enough of those already).

partiallypro 7y ago

Is not just Uber, it's LYFT, neither can seem to make a profit. That kind of worries me because both are so convenient and so help people with limited income.