7 ms·

This is the exact kind of comment that would make it to the top because it just empowered everyone that DOESN'T have one such system. It's filled with finger po

This is the exact kind of comment that would make it to the top because it just empowered everyone that DOESN'T have one such system. It's filled with finger pointing. Most of the replies basically point out yeah, I hate IoT lights, but this use case is good... It's not genuine to dismiss the entire enchilada because YOU don't have it. In 5 years when all the crap is worked out and you eventually buy a system with extra security at your door or backyard, or a something to that effect I'd like you to come back and admit it.

AlexandrB 7y ago
> In 5 years when all the crap is worked out and you eventually buy a system with extra security at your door or backyard, or a something to that effect I'd like you to come back and admit it. I heard this same song and dance 5 years ago. The problems with the "IoT" market are foundational. Most IoT devices are not designed to be used for extended periods without internet access and a continuous stream of updates. The former means that, in general, they are only as reliable as your internet connection (including that crappy modem/router the ISP gave you). The latter means that unlike traditional home hardware, once you install "smart" devices you're at the mercy of the business plans of the vendor. So even if you get something set up that works acceptably, it will last 5 years tops (see Nest) before the vendor's priorities change. Finally to address the "extra security" comment. Security from what? The developed world is objectively safer than ever, why would I invest in "solutions" to problems invented out of whole cloth? The paranoia of people installing cameras all over their own home (often cameras whose footage they have no real control over) astounds me. We're more mistrustful of our own neighbours than the companies that are actually exploiting our privacy and manipulating us psychologically for profit.
- smbullet 7y ago
  Not all of us live in safe neighborhoods like yourself.
  - bradlys 7y ago
    It's not even a matter of "safe". I live in a neighborhood that is seen as very safe. Yet, we had a burglary two houses down not too long ago. And they happen frequently enough to myself. I've had plenty stolen. Without a camera, there's ~0% chance of anyone being caught. I ended up buying a camera for peace of mind and for checking in on my place to see who's entering my residence area. Sometimes it's genuinely helpful.
    - smoyer 7y ago
      Why do you think you live in a very safe neighborhood? I guess perception can be a funny thing but I'm thinking this is the same as Mercedes-Benz owners saying their cars are above average reliability when the service records disprove it.
    - giggles_giggles 7y ago
      I'm just nervous about off-the-shelf "smart" cameras also sharing the feed with someone upstream who is not me
      - asdff 7y ago
        There used to be a subreddit full of unsecured webcam links. Sometimes you'd see babycams even, completely open to whoever crawled for the link.
    - veritas_veritad 7y ago
      have you caught any thieves yet?
    - dx87 7y ago
      If you're frequently having things stolen, you don't live in a "very safe" neighborhood. I've lived in working class neighborhoods most of my life, and the only thing I've ever had stolen from me was a bike that I left on my front porch when I was a kid. The only thing the people I know have had stolen is stuff like car stereos or GPS devices back before most people used their phones. Just small crime of opportunity stuff, no breaking into people's homes.
- MegaButts 7y ago
  I can buy the notion that smart devices are dumb for a litany of reasons. But the notion that security cameras are dumb, regardless of whether or not they're smart, is absurd. Most people use it to try to find/deter package thieves. Many people park their cars out front and want to be able to identify a license plate in case of a hit-and-run. I use security cameras to check on my pets and to make sure the dog walker isn't stealing anything. I also once found out my landlord was illegally entering my apartment. You live in fantasy world if you think nothing bad will ever happen to you just because you have high regard for your neighbors.
- la_barba 7y ago
  >Most IoT devices are not designed to be used for extended periods without internet access and a continuous stream of updates. But you could design one with a manual fallback option. Doesn't seem foundational to me. Nothing about an IoT design prevents one from doing that. >The latter means that unlike traditional home hardware, once you install "smart" devices you're at the mercy of the business plans of the vendor. So even if you get something set up that works acceptably, it will last 5 years tops (see Nest) before the vendor's priorities change. Yes, that is the downside of dealing with any service oriented business, in any domain. But again, you can have a manual fallback option (as I think most devices do FWICT) >Finally to address the "extra security" comment. Security from what? I suppose it depends on what you consider security. For an intruder alert system, you'd need something that can transmit a notification to someone. An IoT device seems like a good option, but I guess you could also use a device that can send a text over a cellular network. I personally have no use for anything IoT, but I think its premature to go completely in the other direction and say that IoT is completely useless. What we're seeing with so called "disruptive" technologies is that things get worse (or sometimes a lot worse), before they get better.
  - JadeNB 7y ago
    > But you could design one with a manual fallback option. Doesn't seem foundational to me. Nothing about an IoT design prevents one from doing that. Certainly I could (or at least someone with the engineering skills could), but the actual IoT companies don't. My impression of IoT devices (do not want) is based on what actually exists, not on what could theoretically exist.
    - la_barba 7y ago
      >Certainly I could (or at least someone with the engineering skills could), but the actual IoT companies don't. That is incorrect. There are several IoT products with manual fallback options on the market. I don't even know why you're disagreeing to be honest. You don't like IoT devices, I got that part.
      - TeMPOraL 7y ago
pjc50 7y ago
People aren't dismissing it because they don't have it, they're dismissing it because the UX is terrible, it's too high maintenance, and the future of any individual solution uncertain. In some ways it's like pre-iPhone mobile apps. They absolutely did exist, but were mostly too much hassle until they could be seamlessly downloaded from the App Store, sandboxed, and held to quality standards. We're still in the Symbian era of home automation. (My wife worked at a home automation / security company about a decade ago. It had basically all the same problems back then too, but for a couple of years I had an internet-connected doorbell)
- stickfigure 7y ago
  How many people in your house know how to operate your (presumably non-smart) AV system, with its receiver and four different remotes? When someone new comes over, how long would it take them to figure out how to watch a movie?
  - mike00632 7y ago
    Woah, that is a right. I'm thinking now of such common phrases when you visit someone's house: "Can you turn on the TV?", "How do you change the volume?", "Which remote do I use?". Recently my sister's response was, "Actually, you use the X-box controller." What a future we live in.
    - HeyLaughingBoy 7y ago
      Psst! They make XBox controllers that look just like a "regular" remote.
  - pjc50 7y ago
    There's a TV remote and a satellite remote. Press the "Netflix" button on the TV remote. (Having said that, I failed to watch a DVD at the weekend; the Xbox wouldn't play it as it was region locked, then I realised that I'd not hooked up the DVD player in the six months since buying the television, and it flaked out trying to play on my laptop.) None of this makes me think that a "home automation" system will be any more convenient or reliable. I've only just made my peace with the "smart TV". I wanted a dumb TV, but will admit that the smartness has mostly delivered. It even seems to have HDMI-CEC that works with the satellite box from a different manufacturer. It still occasionally nags about updates or informs me that something it shipped with no longer works or requires a new EULA. I have dealt with the complexity of "AV recievers", whatever they are exactly, by not knowing why I might need one and not having one. The one feature I may end up building is the ability to listen to the TV in the kitchen, which I may do by running thirty feet of wire.
rayiner 7y ago
It will never be worked out. Desktop computing is how many decades old? And it’s still crap. Basic Windows desktop functions still have intermittent problems (that missing file issue in Windows 10). Computer controlled consumer stuff will never reach the reliability and predictability of dumb consumer electronics.
- HeWhoLurksLate 7y ago
  And how many times have you had a flat tire?
  - rayiner 7y ago
    How many times has your toaster deleted your toast because Microsoft pushed a bad update? (I had an Ecobee that just decided to try and freeze my family for funsies on a winter day when I was at work. Threw it out and replaced it with a dumb thermostat.)
  - cardinalfang 7y ago
    Modern cars have a wireless pressure sensor failure instead.
  - tptacek 7y ago
    Like twice in the 25 years I've been driving. Are you really trying to suggest that the failure rate of tires is comparable to that of computing devices? I lose one device or other about once every 4 months or so.
  - wglb 7y ago
    In over 60 years of driving maybe twice. Software doesn’t even come close. Read the part about merchantability and fitness for purpose.
dustinmoris 7y ago
> In 5 years when all the crap is worked out and you eventually buy a system with extra security at your door or backyard, or a something to that effect I'd like you to come back and admit it. Honestly I change my mind much faster than 5 years. I have no issue to admit that I changed my mind over something. Personally I even like to be taught better by something or someone as I feel I've learned something then. All in all my comment is very tongue in cheek, but I really mean everything I said, because that is just how I personally feel today. I don't see much value in smart home devices today. Not a big fan of the products which are on the market, not a big fan from my own experience using them when I did and not a big fan of all the big issues that people constantly report when relying on them. I'm not Einstein who invented some physics law which will stand forever. I have a personal opinion which is relevant today. If things change tomorrow then there will be a new HN discussion and perhaps I'll have a new opinion which will be relevant tomorrow. I don't see anything wrong in voicing my thoughts on this topic today as it stands today.
HeWhoLurksLate 7y ago
Honestly, I think that smart home stuff is really cool, and also that I don't want anything (okay, much) from the current spread of commercial offerings. What I do want to do is put a ESP board with an IR receiver and a servo on a lightswitch in my basement so that I can turn on and off the lights without moving from the couch.
- craigsmansion 7y ago
  Smart home stuff is really cool, if you build it yourself. Other than that it just feels like keeping up with the Joneses, with the notable exception of the disabled, for whom mass-produced smart home stuff must be a Godsend. So I guess all the geek/tech-posturing does have an upside.
iscrewyou 7y ago
I don't have a smart home device and I won't buy it in a few years. And the simple reason is that there is no regulation for bad behavior. These companies keep getting away with massive privacy violations. We can dig into the big companies but at this time, that point has been beaten to death. When there is better regulation and the software engineers are being jailed for violations of privacy, I will trust the system and buy it. Until then, I simply don't trust it. And won't buy it. I don't hate the lights. It's great innovation. I am amused at the fact that you can turn off your ac from work in case you forgot. But privacy. Privacy is becoming a bigger and bigger issue. And I'd like it to be addressed before I let the companies run my data on aws.
- mixmastamyk 7y ago
  s/software engineers/management team/
  - iscrewyou 7y ago
    Anybody. Who ever makes those negligent decisions that compromise systems.
  - greenyoda 7y ago
    As a software engineer, I don't software engineers should be immune from prosecution if they knowingly violate laws. Your manager telling you to do something (even under threat of firing) is not an excuse if you know that it's illegal. For example, the guy who wrote the software for Bernie Madoff's company knew that he was helping Madoff perpetrate fraud, and ended up in prison.[1] [1] http://static7.businessinsider.com/r-ex-madoff-computer-programmer-gets-2-1/2-years-prison-for-fraud-2014-12 http://static7.businessinsider.com/r-ex-madoff-computer-prog...
    - mixmastamyk 7y ago
      Not saying they should be immune, but rather pointing the focus at decision makers. Some of them could be engineers too.
- 7y ago
mcguire 7y ago
If you want a security system, don't buy one that is glued to the side of an insecure IoT system. I like convenience as much as anyone, but you may want to consider that it's paid for by continuous monitoring by someone whose business model is to manipulate your future behavior.
TeMPOraL 7y ago
> In 5 years when all the crap is worked out and you eventually buy a system with extra security at your door or backyard, or a something to that effect I'd like you to come back and admit it. It won't be worked out in 5 years, because the issues with IoT aren't technological, but business. Go to a random Hackerspace and half of the people you find there could build better IoT devices (and many are). IoT's main issue is garbage products designed as vehicles to lock you into some vendor's "ecosystem". It won't get better until it all gets commoditized.
mixmastamyk 7y ago
> In 5 years They had x-10 in the 90s, maybe earlier. Never saw the need, but my place was small. Could see the use if I had a mansion. But that is selling to the 1%, not a huge market. That said, I sort of liked the nest demo where it shows you traffic and weather in the morning before work. Might be useful if I still was still in the rat-race, but it's on my phone already, so meh.
oarabbus_ 7y ago
Smart security system? Sure. Smart everything else? Why? What happens when your internet goes down? What happens when criminals buy a $100 wifi jammer and ruin you? Didn't anyone watch the movie Smart Home?
- slantyyz 7y ago
  Smart doesn't necessarily mean wi-fi. I find Z-wave to provide a much better experience than Wifi smart home products.
- Karunamon 7y ago
  If your threat profile includes the kind of targeting that criminals with radio jamming hardware imply, you need a lot more than the $100 WiFi system you can get off the shelf on amazon. And then what are the other options? It’s not that hard to build/buy cell jammers either.
  - oarabbus_ 7y ago
    >And then what are the other options? It’s not that hard to build/buy cell jammers either. Analog locks opened with a physical key.
stephenr 7y ago
A light switch is not fundamentally broken, it doesn't need any improvement, besides maybe including a little LED in the switch itself so it's easier to find when the room is dark. But no internet connection is required. 10 years won't change that. And a lock, that depends in some way on internet access? You can FUCK RIGHT OFF.
- dfrage 7y ago
  That find in the dark feature was available in the 1970s, substituting a neon bulb for a LED.
  - stephenr 7y ago
    Our dimmer switches (which are all slowly blowing out - maybe too much current? I don't know, I didn't install them) include this, but I've never seen it on other switches. Weirdly some wall outlets have a little clear plastic section that looks like it should have a light behind it... but nothing. Asked a local 'builder' (I won't say electrician, because that doesn't exist here) and he had no idea what it's for either.
    - dfrage 7y ago
      Interesting; neon bulbs have the advantage of working on (US) line voltage without anything else needed, sticking an LED in there requires more stuff. Both could have been squashed in the US market due to Federal energy regulations. Or that clear section could be for the GFI version of the outlet, the few years old one in my bathroom has a tiny clear window for a green light when it's not tripped.
      - asdff 7y ago
        Glow in the dark star stuck to the faceplate works about as well
MR4D 7y ago
I had it ( not the 100k version) and it worked pretty well. But he’s still right - the use case just isn’t there. At least it wasn’t for me.
thatoneuser 7y ago
So you're defending companies selling shitty products with the excuse of "in several years it won't be all garbage!"? Fuck that. For the price this iot garbage goes for I'd better damn well have a functional product for several years. Corporate shilling. I'll never understand it.
StanislavPetrov 7y ago
No, this is the kind of comment that appeals to people who understand that making simple things more complicated is not always desirable, needed or beneficial. If you want to buy a robot that can pick up your beer, twist off the cap, and pour it into your glass, more power to you! If you want to pretend that having such a robot is at any way optimal then you deserve to be ridiculed.

AlexandrB 7y ago

> In 5 years when all the crap is worked out and you eventually buy a system with extra security at your door or backyard, or a something to that effect I'd like you to come back and admit it. I heard this same song and dance 5 years ago. The problems with the "IoT" market are foundational. Most IoT devices are not designed to be used for extended periods without internet access and a continuous stream of updates. The former means that, in general, they are only as reliable as your internet connection (including that crappy modem/router the ISP gave you). The latter means that unlike traditional home hardware, once you install "smart" devices you're at the mercy of the business plans of the vendor. So even if you get something set up that works acceptably, it will last 5 years tops (see Nest) before the vendor's priorities change. Finally to address the "extra security" comment. Security from what? The developed world is objectively safer than ever, why would I invest in "solutions" to problems invented out of whole cloth? The paranoia of people installing cameras all over their own home (often cameras whose footage they have no real control over) astounds me. We're more mistrustful of our own neighbours than the companies that are actually exploiting our privacy and manipulating us psychologically for profit.

smbullet 7y ago
Not all of us live in safe neighborhoods like yourself.
- bradlys 7y ago
  It's not even a matter of "safe". I live in a neighborhood that is seen as very safe. Yet, we had a burglary two houses down not too long ago. And they happen frequently enough to myself. I've had plenty stolen. Without a camera, there's ~0% chance of anyone being caught. I ended up buying a camera for peace of mind and for checking in on my place to see who's entering my residence area. Sometimes it's genuinely helpful.
  - smoyer 7y ago
    Why do you think you live in a very safe neighborhood? I guess perception can be a funny thing but I'm thinking this is the same as Mercedes-Benz owners saying their cars are above average reliability when the service records disprove it.
  - giggles_giggles 7y ago
    I'm just nervous about off-the-shelf "smart" cameras also sharing the feed with someone upstream who is not me
    - asdff 7y ago
      There used to be a subreddit full of unsecured webcam links. Sometimes you'd see babycams even, completely open to whoever crawled for the link.
  - veritas_veritad 7y ago
    have you caught any thieves yet?
  - dx87 7y ago
    If you're frequently having things stolen, you don't live in a "very safe" neighborhood. I've lived in working class neighborhoods most of my life, and the only thing I've ever had stolen from me was a bike that I left on my front porch when I was a kid. The only thing the people I know have had stolen is stuff like car stereos or GPS devices back before most people used their phones. Just small crime of opportunity stuff, no breaking into people's homes.
MegaButts 7y ago
I can buy the notion that smart devices are dumb for a litany of reasons. But the notion that security cameras are dumb, regardless of whether or not they're smart, is absurd. Most people use it to try to find/deter package thieves. Many people park their cars out front and want to be able to identify a license plate in case of a hit-and-run. I use security cameras to check on my pets and to make sure the dog walker isn't stealing anything. I also once found out my landlord was illegally entering my apartment. You live in fantasy world if you think nothing bad will ever happen to you just because you have high regard for your neighbors.
la_barba 7y ago
>Most IoT devices are not designed to be used for extended periods without internet access and a continuous stream of updates. But you could design one with a manual fallback option. Doesn't seem foundational to me. Nothing about an IoT design prevents one from doing that. >The latter means that unlike traditional home hardware, once you install "smart" devices you're at the mercy of the business plans of the vendor. So even if you get something set up that works acceptably, it will last 5 years tops (see Nest) before the vendor's priorities change. Yes, that is the downside of dealing with any service oriented business, in any domain. But again, you can have a manual fallback option (as I think most devices do FWICT) >Finally to address the "extra security" comment. Security from what? I suppose it depends on what you consider security. For an intruder alert system, you'd need something that can transmit a notification to someone. An IoT device seems like a good option, but I guess you could also use a device that can send a text over a cellular network. I personally have no use for anything IoT, but I think its premature to go completely in the other direction and say that IoT is completely useless. What we're seeing with so called "disruptive" technologies is that things get worse (or sometimes a lot worse), before they get better.
- JadeNB 7y ago
  > But you could design one with a manual fallback option. Doesn't seem foundational to me. Nothing about an IoT design prevents one from doing that. Certainly I could (or at least someone with the engineering skills could), but the actual IoT companies don't. My impression of IoT devices (do not want) is based on what actually exists, not on what could theoretically exist.
  - la_barba 7y ago
    >Certainly I could (or at least someone with the engineering skills could), but the actual IoT companies don't. That is incorrect. There are several IoT products with manual fallback options on the market. I don't even know why you're disagreeing to be honest. You don't like IoT devices, I got that part.
    - TeMPOraL 7y ago

pjc50 7y ago

People aren't dismissing it because they don't have it, they're dismissing it because the UX is terrible, it's too high maintenance, and the future of any individual solution uncertain. In some ways it's like pre-iPhone mobile apps. They absolutely did exist, but were mostly too much hassle until they could be seamlessly downloaded from the App Store, sandboxed, and held to quality standards. We're still in the Symbian era of home automation. (My wife worked at a home automation / security company about a decade ago. It had basically all the same problems back then too, but for a couple of years I had an internet-connected doorbell)

stickfigure 7y ago
How many people in your house know how to operate your (presumably non-smart) AV system, with its receiver and four different remotes? When someone new comes over, how long would it take them to figure out how to watch a movie?
- mike00632 7y ago
  Woah, that is a right. I'm thinking now of such common phrases when you visit someone's house: "Can you turn on the TV?", "How do you change the volume?", "Which remote do I use?". Recently my sister's response was, "Actually, you use the X-box controller." What a future we live in.
  - HeyLaughingBoy 7y ago
    Psst! They make XBox controllers that look just like a "regular" remote.
- pjc50 7y ago
  There's a TV remote and a satellite remote. Press the "Netflix" button on the TV remote. (Having said that, I failed to watch a DVD at the weekend; the Xbox wouldn't play it as it was region locked, then I realised that I'd not hooked up the DVD player in the six months since buying the television, and it flaked out trying to play on my laptop.) None of this makes me think that a "home automation" system will be any more convenient or reliable. I've only just made my peace with the "smart TV". I wanted a dumb TV, but will admit that the smartness has mostly delivered. It even seems to have HDMI-CEC that works with the satellite box from a different manufacturer. It still occasionally nags about updates or informs me that something it shipped with no longer works or requires a new EULA. I have dealt with the complexity of "AV recievers", whatever they are exactly, by not knowing why I might need one and not having one. The one feature I may end up building is the ability to listen to the TV in the kitchen, which I may do by running thirty feet of wire.

rayiner 7y ago

It will never be worked out. Desktop computing is how many decades old? And it’s still crap. Basic Windows desktop functions still have intermittent problems (that missing file issue in Windows 10). Computer controlled consumer stuff will never reach the reliability and predictability of dumb consumer electronics.

HeWhoLurksLate 7y ago
And how many times have you had a flat tire?
- rayiner 7y ago
  How many times has your toaster deleted your toast because Microsoft pushed a bad update? (I had an Ecobee that just decided to try and freeze my family for funsies on a winter day when I was at work. Threw it out and replaced it with a dumb thermostat.)
- cardinalfang 7y ago
  Modern cars have a wireless pressure sensor failure instead.
- tptacek 7y ago
  Like twice in the 25 years I've been driving. Are you really trying to suggest that the failure rate of tires is comparable to that of computing devices? I lose one device or other about once every 4 months or so.
- wglb 7y ago
  In over 60 years of driving maybe twice. Software doesn’t even come close. Read the part about merchantability and fitness for purpose.

dustinmoris 7y ago

> In 5 years when all the crap is worked out and you eventually buy a system with extra security at your door or backyard, or a something to that effect I'd like you to come back and admit it. Honestly I change my mind much faster than 5 years. I have no issue to admit that I changed my mind over something. Personally I even like to be taught better by something or someone as I feel I've learned something then. All in all my comment is very tongue in cheek, but I really mean everything I said, because that is just how I personally feel today. I don't see much value in smart home devices today. Not a big fan of the products which are on the market, not a big fan from my own experience using them when I did and not a big fan of all the big issues that people constantly report when relying on them. I'm not Einstein who invented some physics law which will stand forever. I have a personal opinion which is relevant today. If things change tomorrow then there will be a new HN discussion and perhaps I'll have a new opinion which will be relevant tomorrow. I don't see anything wrong in voicing my thoughts on this topic today as it stands today.

HeWhoLurksLate 7y ago

Honestly, I think that smart home stuff is really cool, and also that I don't want anything (okay, much) from the current spread of commercial offerings. What I do want to do is put a ESP board with an IR receiver and a servo on a lightswitch in my basement so that I can turn on and off the lights without moving from the couch.

craigsmansion 7y ago
Smart home stuff is really cool, if you build it yourself. Other than that it just feels like keeping up with the Joneses, with the notable exception of the disabled, for whom mass-produced smart home stuff must be a Godsend. So I guess all the geek/tech-posturing does have an upside.

iscrewyou 7y ago

I don't have a smart home device and I won't buy it in a few years. And the simple reason is that there is no regulation for bad behavior. These companies keep getting away with massive privacy violations. We can dig into the big companies but at this time, that point has been beaten to death. When there is better regulation and the software engineers are being jailed for violations of privacy, I will trust the system and buy it. Until then, I simply don't trust it. And won't buy it. I don't hate the lights. It's great innovation. I am amused at the fact that you can turn off your ac from work in case you forgot. But privacy. Privacy is becoming a bigger and bigger issue. And I'd like it to be addressed before I let the companies run my data on aws.

mixmastamyk 7y ago
s/software engineers/management team/
- iscrewyou 7y ago
  Anybody. Who ever makes those negligent decisions that compromise systems.
- greenyoda 7y ago
  As a software engineer, I don't software engineers should be immune from prosecution if they knowingly violate laws. Your manager telling you to do something (even under threat of firing) is not an excuse if you know that it's illegal. For example, the guy who wrote the software for Bernie Madoff's company knew that he was helping Madoff perpetrate fraud, and ended up in prison.[1] [1] http://static7.businessinsider.com/r-ex-madoff-computer-programmer-gets-2-1/2-years-prison-for-fraud-2014-12 http://static7.businessinsider.com/r-ex-madoff-computer-prog...
  - mixmastamyk 7y ago
    Not saying they should be immune, but rather pointing the focus at decision makers. Some of them could be engineers too.
7y ago

mcguire 7y ago

If you want a security system, don't buy one that is glued to the side of an insecure IoT system. I like convenience as much as anyone, but you may want to consider that it's paid for by continuous monitoring by someone whose business model is to manipulate your future behavior.

TeMPOraL 7y ago

> In 5 years when all the crap is worked out and you eventually buy a system with extra security at your door or backyard, or a something to that effect I'd like you to come back and admit it. It won't be worked out in 5 years, because the issues with IoT aren't technological, but business. Go to a random Hackerspace and half of the people you find there could build better IoT devices (and many are). IoT's main issue is garbage products designed as vehicles to lock you into some vendor's "ecosystem". It won't get better until it all gets commoditized.

mixmastamyk 7y ago

> In 5 years They had x-10 in the 90s, maybe earlier. Never saw the need, but my place was small. Could see the use if I had a mansion. But that is selling to the 1%, not a huge market. That said, I sort of liked the nest demo where it shows you traffic and weather in the morning before work. Might be useful if I still was still in the rat-race, but it's on my phone already, so meh.

oarabbus_ 7y ago

Smart security system? Sure. Smart everything else? Why? What happens when your internet goes down? What happens when criminals buy a $100 wifi jammer and ruin you? Didn't anyone watch the movie Smart Home?

slantyyz 7y ago
Smart doesn't necessarily mean wi-fi. I find Z-wave to provide a much better experience than Wifi smart home products.
Karunamon 7y ago
If your threat profile includes the kind of targeting that criminals with radio jamming hardware imply, you need a lot more than the $100 WiFi system you can get off the shelf on amazon. And then what are the other options? It’s not that hard to build/buy cell jammers either.
- oarabbus_ 7y ago
  >And then what are the other options? It’s not that hard to build/buy cell jammers either. Analog locks opened with a physical key.

stephenr 7y ago

A light switch is not fundamentally broken, it doesn't need any improvement, besides maybe including a little LED in the switch itself so it's easier to find when the room is dark. But no internet connection is required. 10 years won't change that. And a lock, that depends in some way on internet access? You can FUCK RIGHT OFF.

dfrage 7y ago
That find in the dark feature was available in the 1970s, substituting a neon bulb for a LED.
- stephenr 7y ago
  Our dimmer switches (which are all slowly blowing out - maybe too much current? I don't know, I didn't install them) include this, but I've never seen it on other switches. Weirdly some wall outlets have a little clear plastic section that looks like it should have a light behind it... but nothing. Asked a local 'builder' (I won't say electrician, because that doesn't exist here) and he had no idea what it's for either.
  - dfrage 7y ago
    Interesting; neon bulbs have the advantage of working on (US) line voltage without anything else needed, sticking an LED in there requires more stuff. Both could have been squashed in the US market due to Federal energy regulations. Or that clear section could be for the GFI version of the outlet, the few years old one in my bathroom has a tiny clear window for a green light when it's not tripped.
    - asdff 7y ago
      Glow in the dark star stuck to the faceplate works about as well

MR4D 7y ago

I had it ( not the 100k version) and it worked pretty well. But he’s still right - the use case just isn’t there. At least it wasn’t for me.

thatoneuser 7y ago

So you're defending companies selling shitty products with the excuse of "in several years it won't be all garbage!"? Fuck that. For the price this iot garbage goes for I'd better damn well have a functional product for several years. Corporate shilling. I'll never understand it.

StanislavPetrov 7y ago

No, this is the kind of comment that appeals to people who understand that making simple things more complicated is not always desirable, needed or beneficial. If you want to buy a robot that can pick up your beer, twist off the cap, and pour it into your glass, more power to you! If you want to pretend that having such a robot is at any way optimal then you deserve to be ridiculed.