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Aren't security locks common over there? The typical night latch (Yale lock) is super easy to pick, but it wouldn't be easy to get UK insurance without a 5 or

Aren't security locks common over there? The typical night latch (Yale lock) is super easy to pick, but it wouldn't be easy to get UK insurance without a 5 or 7 lever Chubb lock, or one of the newer security locks. So pretty much everywhere has one - and quite often both. Newer doors tend to have multiple bolts in three places, operated by the single security key. Just a night latch might be used for internal doors, or a garden shed.

crankylinuxuser 8y ago
Thats because in the USA, the next level after an easy to pick lock is a dog. And after the dog, is a homeowner with a rifle, shotgun, or pistol. Unlike many jurisdictions all through Europe, the US has guns equaling in quantity to that of Somalia or Uruguay. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estimated_number_of_civilian_guns_per_capita_by_country https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estimated_number_of_civilian_g... Given the amount of guns (100+ per 100 people), and that some have a stockpile while others have none, you're taking your life in your hands if you want to break in and burglarize. Edit: -1? Did I say something factually incorrect? Given many states have castle laws, you can legally blow someone away if you feel threatened. This absolutely does come up in home security... Whether people want to discuss it or not.
- cdolan 8y ago
  If you’re facts/theory are correct then there should be no burglary events, as it could be assumed all homeowners have guns?
  - dsfyu404ed 8y ago
    >If you’re facts/theory are correct then there should be no burglary events, as it could be assumed all homeowners have guns? The capacity for defending one's self and property is not distributed evenly across the US. Some states are bristling with armaments like Switzerland. Others are neutered like the UK. In certain states break-ins not targeting a specific individual for a specific reason are basically nonexistent. In other states criminals have little to fear from the property owner so property crime is more common.
- sgift 8y ago
  > Given the amount of guns (100+ per 100 people), and that some have a stockpile while others have none, you're taking your life in your hands if you want to break in and burglarize. Yeah, and you know who has probably one of these guns? The people breaking into your home. And they usually have the first mover advantage, aren't surprised, and so on and so on .. I'd rather have a good lock on my home than risk this as a home owner.
  - dsfyu404ed 8y ago
    >And they usually have the first mover advantage, aren't surprised, and so on and so on Here's what happened to four dudes who relied on 4:1 numerical superiority and first mover advantage.[0] Home field advantage is still a thing. When one party is in their own home they can't reasonably retreat any further so they tend to put up a pretty good fight. The invading party has better options for disengaging so they usually flee. [0]https://www.chron.com/news/houston-texas/article/Three-dead-after-East-Houston-home-invasion-13546708.php https://www.chron.com/news/houston-texas/article/Three-dead-...
  - greedo 8y ago
    Most burglaries are done by druggies looking for stuff to sell for more drugs. Career criminals know the risk/reward ratio is a bit low in burglarizing residential homes.
- dsfyu404ed 8y ago
  >Did I say something factually incorrect? Sort of. The capacity for self defense is not evenly distributed and many (I would guess most) HNers live in states and have social circles where gun ownership is not nearly as common, not considered acceptable or is at the very least not talked about. In these states a home invader is much less likely to eat hot lead. People don't realize that in other states there is a near 100% chance of encountering someone who is armed if you break into an occupied home. >you can legally blow someone away if you feel threatened "Feel threatened" is the low bar cops have to meet. Us proles actually have to be threatened.
  - crankylinuxuser 8y ago
    Unfortunately, I live in Indiana. Even though it is not a constitutional carry state, it almost is. I can go in and buy long guns without a permit or any check. Or if I want to carry a pistol, I need a permit. I can get a lifelong permit. Signs that say "cant carry guns in premises" can be taken as kind requests. They have no legal backing other than schools and govt buildings. I can legally carry in a state forest. I can also legally carry in most midwest and west states. (Pretty much the rule is, not on the coasts with lots of people, and not in Illinois.) It's common to see someone packing heat in a very non-concealed manner, gunslinger style on their hip. Also, getting hold of things like high velocity rounds or armor piercing is relatively easy, given we have high power rifles that can fire through armor.... and there's no license requirement. I don't like being around so damned many guns. But that's Indiana in a nutshell.
    - dsfyu404ed 8y ago
      A quick Google shows Indiana's laws are actually seem pretty good though obviously constitutional carry would be better. >I can go in and buy long guns without a permit or any check. Well, except the NICS check of course... >Or if I want to carry a pistol, I need a permit. Smells like infringement to me... but requiring an easy to get permit to carry concealed in public is a pretty reasonable compromise as far as firearm laws go. >They have no legal backing other than schools and govt buildings. They can still ask you to leave and if you don't your trespassing and the can ask the cops to ask you to leave. >Also, getting hold of things like high velocity rounds... The ballistic performance you need for effective hunting at the kinds of ranges people hunt at in states not covered in forest basically necessitates the high speeds rifle rounds travel at. >...or armor piercing is relatively easy, given we have high power rifles that can fire through armor.... and there's no license requirement. Granddad's lever action .30-30 will make a mockery out of the soft vests that anyone who isn't expecting to get in a full blown firefight will be wearing. Those vests aren't designed to stop rifle rounds anyway. Rifles are basically a rounding error when it comes to crime/homicide/death stats so that's why cops, body guards, etc. don't wear vests with rifle plates, the risk is so small it's not worth the inconvenience of wearing a vest with plates.
- NeedMoreTea 8y ago
  I take the point - but aren't burglaries everywhere mostly when the house occupants are away on holiday (and the dog too), or out at work? Maybe the odd opportunist snatch if someone leaves a window open on a hot night. We may be unarmed, but I assume at least some UK burglars are put off by an occupied home as it may contain a German Shepherd or large irate guy with a bat handy. The locks are for when I'm out - when I'm in and awake, just turning the handle will get you in the back door!
camtarn 8y ago
A surprising number of people I know (Edinburgh) live in shared rented flats with only a Yale lock. I'm surprised they're not burgled more often, but I guess there are only so many burglars to go round...!
0xffff2 8y ago
Maybe I'm just privileged enough that I've only lived in very safe areas, but I don't view home burglary as a serious threat. I've certainly never been asked by my insurance company what kind of locks I have on the doors.
aidenn0 8y ago
I'm in the US and I have never lived in a dwelling with any lock more secure than a Yale lock. My parents did just install a security lock, but I don't think they even get a discount on their insurance for it. Where I live currently (Southern California) ranch houses (i.e. ground-floor only) are so common that anyone with a rock can get into your house pretty easily, so a more secure lock might not be worth it.

crankylinuxuser 8y ago

Thats because in the USA, the next level after an easy to pick lock is a dog. And after the dog, is a homeowner with a rifle, shotgun, or pistol. Unlike many jurisdictions all through Europe, the US has guns equaling in quantity to that of Somalia or Uruguay. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estimated_number_of_civilian_guns_per_capita_by_country https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estimated_number_of_civilian_g... Given the amount of guns (100+ per 100 people), and that some have a stockpile while others have none, you're taking your life in your hands if you want to break in and burglarize. Edit: -1? Did I say something factually incorrect? Given many states have castle laws, you can legally blow someone away if you feel threatened. This absolutely does come up in home security... Whether people want to discuss it or not.

cdolan 8y ago
If you’re facts/theory are correct then there should be no burglary events, as it could be assumed all homeowners have guns?
- dsfyu404ed 8y ago
  >If you’re facts/theory are correct then there should be no burglary events, as it could be assumed all homeowners have guns? The capacity for defending one's self and property is not distributed evenly across the US. Some states are bristling with armaments like Switzerland. Others are neutered like the UK. In certain states break-ins not targeting a specific individual for a specific reason are basically nonexistent. In other states criminals have little to fear from the property owner so property crime is more common.
sgift 8y ago
> Given the amount of guns (100+ per 100 people), and that some have a stockpile while others have none, you're taking your life in your hands if you want to break in and burglarize. Yeah, and you know who has probably one of these guns? The people breaking into your home. And they usually have the first mover advantage, aren't surprised, and so on and so on .. I'd rather have a good lock on my home than risk this as a home owner.
- dsfyu404ed 8y ago
  >And they usually have the first mover advantage, aren't surprised, and so on and so on Here's what happened to four dudes who relied on 4:1 numerical superiority and first mover advantage.[0] Home field advantage is still a thing. When one party is in their own home they can't reasonably retreat any further so they tend to put up a pretty good fight. The invading party has better options for disengaging so they usually flee. [0]https://www.chron.com/news/houston-texas/article/Three-dead-after-East-Houston-home-invasion-13546708.php https://www.chron.com/news/houston-texas/article/Three-dead-...
- greedo 8y ago
  Most burglaries are done by druggies looking for stuff to sell for more drugs. Career criminals know the risk/reward ratio is a bit low in burglarizing residential homes.
dsfyu404ed 8y ago
>Did I say something factually incorrect? Sort of. The capacity for self defense is not evenly distributed and many (I would guess most) HNers live in states and have social circles where gun ownership is not nearly as common, not considered acceptable or is at the very least not talked about. In these states a home invader is much less likely to eat hot lead. People don't realize that in other states there is a near 100% chance of encountering someone who is armed if you break into an occupied home. >you can legally blow someone away if you feel threatened "Feel threatened" is the low bar cops have to meet. Us proles actually have to be threatened.
- crankylinuxuser 8y ago
  Unfortunately, I live in Indiana. Even though it is not a constitutional carry state, it almost is. I can go in and buy long guns without a permit or any check. Or if I want to carry a pistol, I need a permit. I can get a lifelong permit. Signs that say "cant carry guns in premises" can be taken as kind requests. They have no legal backing other than schools and govt buildings. I can legally carry in a state forest. I can also legally carry in most midwest and west states. (Pretty much the rule is, not on the coasts with lots of people, and not in Illinois.) It's common to see someone packing heat in a very non-concealed manner, gunslinger style on their hip. Also, getting hold of things like high velocity rounds or armor piercing is relatively easy, given we have high power rifles that can fire through armor.... and there's no license requirement. I don't like being around so damned many guns. But that's Indiana in a nutshell.
  - dsfyu404ed 8y ago
    A quick Google shows Indiana's laws are actually seem pretty good though obviously constitutional carry would be better. >I can go in and buy long guns without a permit or any check. Well, except the NICS check of course... >Or if I want to carry a pistol, I need a permit. Smells like infringement to me... but requiring an easy to get permit to carry concealed in public is a pretty reasonable compromise as far as firearm laws go. >They have no legal backing other than schools and govt buildings. They can still ask you to leave and if you don't your trespassing and the can ask the cops to ask you to leave. >Also, getting hold of things like high velocity rounds... The ballistic performance you need for effective hunting at the kinds of ranges people hunt at in states not covered in forest basically necessitates the high speeds rifle rounds travel at. >...or armor piercing is relatively easy, given we have high power rifles that can fire through armor.... and there's no license requirement. Granddad's lever action .30-30 will make a mockery out of the soft vests that anyone who isn't expecting to get in a full blown firefight will be wearing. Those vests aren't designed to stop rifle rounds anyway. Rifles are basically a rounding error when it comes to crime/homicide/death stats so that's why cops, body guards, etc. don't wear vests with rifle plates, the risk is so small it's not worth the inconvenience of wearing a vest with plates.
NeedMoreTea 8y ago
I take the point - but aren't burglaries everywhere mostly when the house occupants are away on holiday (and the dog too), or out at work? Maybe the odd opportunist snatch if someone leaves a window open on a hot night. We may be unarmed, but I assume at least some UK burglars are put off by an occupied home as it may contain a German Shepherd or large irate guy with a bat handy. The locks are for when I'm out - when I'm in and awake, just turning the handle will get you in the back door!

camtarn 8y ago

A surprising number of people I know (Edinburgh) live in shared rented flats with only a Yale lock. I'm surprised they're not burgled more often, but I guess there are only so many burglars to go round...!

0xffff2 8y ago

Maybe I'm just privileged enough that I've only lived in very safe areas, but I don't view home burglary as a serious threat. I've certainly never been asked by my insurance company what kind of locks I have on the doors.

aidenn0 8y ago

I'm in the US and I have never lived in a dwelling with any lock more secure than a Yale lock. My parents did just install a security lock, but I don't think they even get a discount on their insurance for it. Where I live currently (Southern California) ranch houses (i.e. ground-floor only) are so common that anyone with a rock can get into your house pretty easily, so a more secure lock might not be worth it.