5 ms·

If Oracle goes through with the Java licensing threats, Go will have its day for sure. Also, environments like Kubernetes and Openshift make Java kind of heavy

by turk73 7y ago

If Oracle goes through with the Java licensing threats, Go will have its day for sure. Also, environments like Kubernetes and Openshift make Java kind of heavy--the portability comes via the container and thus there is no need for a portable runtime. A Go program running in a Kubernetes pod is plenty portable already.

cameronbrown 7y ago
I'd argue that Java's killer feature is portability across platforms (embedded, mobile, server, etc..), not runtimes.
- Gibbon1 7y ago
  > embedded Java is essentially never used for serious embedded work. I've seen it done, you end up with a embedded arm or 0x86 processor that runs 'hot' doing stuff that embedded python can do on a small single core processor drawing 100th the power.
  - tonyarkles 7y ago
    Heh, yeah... I saw my first “embedded Java” project 2 years ago and it was pretty horrifying. To add insult to injury, it was on a legacy ARM processor and Oracle had stopped providing new JREs for it. Pretty rough spot to be in; the product was 10 years old, and probably had another 10 years of life in it, but development was stuck at a bit of a dead end. It was also based on GWT... Edit: if I’m remembering right, that was the worst part of it. They couldn’t upgrade GWT because they couldn’t upgrade the JRE.
    - Gibbon1 7y ago
      A constant consideration with Java and Embedded Linux is the ratio of external code vs yours that you are pulling in. With the caveat that the maintainers don't care at all about your particular product. One of my experiences was trying to get Uboot and an old version of Linux to compile. The old compiler wouldn't work on my machine(s). The old code wouldn't compile with a newer compiler because of 'UB'.
      - tonyarkles 7y ago
        Heh, funny you mention that. Building the binaries for the rest of the system wouldn't work on anything newer than Ubuntu 9.04 because of some Perl incompatibility that the build system depended on...
  - recoil 7y ago
    > Java is essentially never used for serious embedded work. I don't know whether it counts as "serious" to you, but literally billions of SIM cards and credit cards are running JavaCard: https://software.ac.uk/blog/2018-07-13-javacard-execution-environment-you-didnt-know-you-were-using https://software.ac.uk/blog/2018-07-13-javacard-execution-en... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31D94QOo2gY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31D94QOo2gY
Gibbon1 7y ago
> If Oracle goes through with the Java licensing threats If they do that they'll be a mighty big bar tab run up in Redmond.

by turk73 7y ago

cameronbrown 7y ago

I'd argue that Java's killer feature is portability across platforms (embedded, mobile, server, etc..), not runtimes.

Gibbon1 7y ago
> embedded Java is essentially never used for serious embedded work. I've seen it done, you end up with a embedded arm or 0x86 processor that runs 'hot' doing stuff that embedded python can do on a small single core processor drawing 100th the power.
- tonyarkles 7y ago
  Heh, yeah... I saw my first “embedded Java” project 2 years ago and it was pretty horrifying. To add insult to injury, it was on a legacy ARM processor and Oracle had stopped providing new JREs for it. Pretty rough spot to be in; the product was 10 years old, and probably had another 10 years of life in it, but development was stuck at a bit of a dead end. It was also based on GWT... Edit: if I’m remembering right, that was the worst part of it. They couldn’t upgrade GWT because they couldn’t upgrade the JRE.
  - Gibbon1 7y ago
    A constant consideration with Java and Embedded Linux is the ratio of external code vs yours that you are pulling in. With the caveat that the maintainers don't care at all about your particular product. One of my experiences was trying to get Uboot and an old version of Linux to compile. The old compiler wouldn't work on my machine(s). The old code wouldn't compile with a newer compiler because of 'UB'.
    - tonyarkles 7y ago
      Heh, funny you mention that. Building the binaries for the rest of the system wouldn't work on anything newer than Ubuntu 9.04 because of some Perl incompatibility that the build system depended on...
- recoil 7y ago
  > Java is essentially never used for serious embedded work. I don't know whether it counts as "serious" to you, but literally billions of SIM cards and credit cards are running JavaCard: https://software.ac.uk/blog/2018-07-13-javacard-execution-environment-you-didnt-know-you-were-using https://software.ac.uk/blog/2018-07-13-javacard-execution-en... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31D94QOo2gY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31D94QOo2gY

Gibbon1 7y ago

> If Oracle goes through with the Java licensing threats If they do that they'll be a mighty big bar tab run up in Redmond.