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yeah its really awkward when surveys show one distribution of illegal drug use across all races and socioeconomic classes but then you see a completely differe

yeah its really awkward when surveys show one distribution of illegal drug use across all races and socioeconomic classes but then you see a completely different distribution about who gets arrested for it, and it is very disproportionate all for some edgelord to say "but they commit all the crimes its fact see" and its really like everyone commits crimes, which is a depressing standard from one lens but even more depressing that one group simply doesn't get the privilege of doing illegal things because they'll actually get arrested for it

said 7y ago
“Having used drugs” is consistent across (most) races, but “usage of drugs” is not. There is a difference. On a side note: National victim surveys routinely prove that blacks commit dramatically more violent crime per capita.
wallace_f 7y ago
This paper(1) is by a Black economist at Harvard. On page 5, Blacks are 25% less likely to be shot, though they are more likely to experience non-lethal force. The paper concludes there are a minority of officers who discriminate. I was quite surprised by that. I also was curious about that because it didn't match my preconceived notions, so did a rough check of some of the crime stats myself(2). It seems about 25% of fatal shootings are of Blacks, which is about proportionately double the rate. But if you look at something like arrest rate for violent crime as a metric for encounters with police, they're a little bit over 25%, which would be consistent with the former paper's conclusion. I have no doubt that in the past there was terrible discrimination, and that presently a minority of officers do it, which is still unacceptable. But whenever I see people talking about this topic presently, I never see facts or statistics brought into it and it comes off as hand-wavey virtue signalling. 1- http://www.nber.org/papers/w22399 http://www.nber.org/papers/w22399 2- https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2016/crime-in-the-u.s.-2016/topic-pages/tables/table-21 https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2016/crime-in-the-u.s.-...
- caprese 7y ago
  Today we are talking about drug use and arrest frequency And you are talking about perceived demographics of police brutality. Are you not signaling with your essay and predilection to post stats on something nobody was talking about? Sure if you had the stats folder with pdfs and links to contribute to the parent post that would be great! Its not currently practical for everyone to keep a list of every survey and study they have just to have an opinion or observation about something. But you can contribute with supporting or counter logic if thats the kind of signaling you like
  - wallace_f 7y ago
    Last time I encountered these sorts of claims on HN I did the above research and the results surprised me. I'd like to find time to further narrow this research as you suggest above, and I suspect I'd find evidence of discrimination, as I suspected the last time. Though I will keep an open mind. In the meantime I would remind you to remember the burden of proof is traditionally on what is being claimed--not on disproving a claim.
    - caprese 7y ago
      Traditionally, but you can contribute if you think fixing the absence will help people or further a discussion

said 7y ago

“Having used drugs” is consistent across (most) races, but “usage of drugs” is not. There is a difference. On a side note: National victim surveys routinely prove that blacks commit dramatically more violent crime per capita.

wallace_f 7y ago

This paper(1) is by a Black economist at Harvard. On page 5, Blacks are 25% less likely to be shot, though they are more likely to experience non-lethal force. The paper concludes there are a minority of officers who discriminate. I was quite surprised by that. I also was curious about that because it didn't match my preconceived notions, so did a rough check of some of the crime stats myself(2). It seems about 25% of fatal shootings are of Blacks, which is about proportionately double the rate. But if you look at something like arrest rate for violent crime as a metric for encounters with police, they're a little bit over 25%, which would be consistent with the former paper's conclusion. I have no doubt that in the past there was terrible discrimination, and that presently a minority of officers do it, which is still unacceptable. But whenever I see people talking about this topic presently, I never see facts or statistics brought into it and it comes off as hand-wavey virtue signalling. 1- http://www.nber.org/papers/w22399 http://www.nber.org/papers/w22399 2- https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2016/crime-in-the-u.s.-2016/topic-pages/tables/table-21 https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2016/crime-in-the-u.s.-...

caprese 7y ago
Today we are talking about drug use and arrest frequency And you are talking about perceived demographics of police brutality. Are you not signaling with your essay and predilection to post stats on something nobody was talking about? Sure if you had the stats folder with pdfs and links to contribute to the parent post that would be great! Its not currently practical for everyone to keep a list of every survey and study they have just to have an opinion or observation about something. But you can contribute with supporting or counter logic if thats the kind of signaling you like
- wallace_f 7y ago
  Last time I encountered these sorts of claims on HN I did the above research and the results surprised me. I'd like to find time to further narrow this research as you suggest above, and I suspect I'd find evidence of discrimination, as I suspected the last time. Though I will keep an open mind. In the meantime I would remind you to remember the burden of proof is traditionally on what is being claimed--not on disproving a claim.
  - caprese 7y ago
    Traditionally, but you can contribute if you think fixing the absence will help people or further a discussion