13 ms·

China backtracked on almost all aspects of U.S. trade deal – sources

121 points by ycombonator 7y ago

nabla9 7y ago
Maybe China was just playing time and trying to time the trade conflict. US elections are next year. If the trade war escalates this summer, the effect on voters and the US economy will be hardest 6 to 12 months from now. After that the US economy will start to adjust for the new normal.
- duxup 7y ago
  Concerns about China though aren't likely to change.... I'm not sure voters will feel like "We need to strike a deal with China" ... and accordingly I'm not sure it is so much a Chinese advantage. If things are worse, voters could be just as angry and willing to vote for someone who wants to fight ... more with China over trade. This could be a case where China might want to stoke a problem, and get more blowback than they otherwise would have. The current POTUS (elected dude to a lot of things including economic concerns by some voters) has already proven you can put up a fight and the sky doesn't fall... and a politician might not see making a deal advantageous to China as a good political move, or even likely to produce a lot of economic benefit.
- toasterlovin 7y ago
  How, exactly, do you envision the US economy being damaged by a trade war with China? As far as I can tell, the effects thus far have been basically nil. Whereas things are looking pretty bad in China at the moment...
  - existencebox 7y ago
    >the effects thus far have been basically nil This is quite factually untrue. [0] [1] [2] [3] To be clear, this is entirely as a rebuttal to your claim, not as any broader statement about international policy or outcomes. [0] https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-02-14/u-s-soy-exports-won-t-reach-pre-trade-war-levels-for-years https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-02-14/u-s-soy-e... [1] https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/19/us/politics/farming-trump-trade-war.html https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/19/us/politics/farming-trump... [2] https://www.forbes.com/sites/jamesellsmoor/2019/02/24/under-trumps-tariffs-the-us-lost-20000-solar-energy-jobs/#1fcc880d76ba https://www.forbes.com/sites/jamesellsmoor/2019/02/24/under-... [3]https://www.minnpost.com/economy/2018/08/trade-war-pulls-pork-prices-down-minnesota-farmers/ https://www.minnpost.com/economy/2018/08/trade-war-pulls-por...
Shivetya 7y ago
So basically China's stance is, we cannot change our laws so our bad trading practices must remain in place? While we only get news of trade imbalances between US and China to include all their tariffs and restrictions can someone for the EU or elsewhere chime in with how their nations fare?
- baybal2 7y ago
  > So basically China's stance is, we cannot change our laws so our bad trading practices must remain in place? China's, or better said Liu He's, stance is "we will not do anything if it has chance to blew into Xi Jinping's face" Xi brandished how he tames "capitalist tigers" by wholly appropriating the credit for the trade deal. Now he is being made to look stupid with a single twiter post. It is likely he will not touch the talks personally out of fear for more embarrassment Liu He might be only a fourth vice premier in line, but only one Xi has personal ties to.
  - gdsdfe 7y ago
    I feel like none knows how to deal with the Chinese, there's a cultural gap that the US and Europe are not accounting for, the Chinese care a lot about saving face and status
    - baybal2 7y ago
      To me it feels like Trump did it more or less intentionally. He seem to know that behind a stone faced facade, Xi is an anxious and insecure person — the same 7th grader he was when his family was purged.
      - ethbro 7y ago
        How could you not be anxious as a Chinese politician? In Western democracies, if you lose political power at worst you get indicted (and usually pardoned). Half of the country still likes you. In China, you face serious prison time, your family's assets are seized, you're expelled from politics, and media runs a solid month of anti-you propaganda. Harsh consequences for what many times is a roll of the dice.
verroq 7y ago
I don't understand the hate Trump gets for doing what needs to be done. All these issues esp. theft of intellectual property, IP transfer, currency manipulation are much more important in the long term than some tarrifs. One shitpost tweet crashed SZSC by 7%, most of China couldn't even read it. Trump is in a position of power at least with this negotiation. China deserves the pain train for backpedalling.
- whytaka 7y ago
  This is the one thing where I find myself supporting the policies of the Trump administration.
  - yumraj 7y ago
    I have to agree. And, while I will hate myself for this, but after Biden's statement that China is not a competition, who I will end up voting for in the next election is no longer given.
  - ok_coo 7y ago
    Yep, one of the hardest and most important things in life is the ability to agree/compromise with people you have fundamental issues with. This is one of those cases and his tweet is correct, they can just wait this out until the next election after someone new gets in and we do a 180.
    - dsfyu404ed 7y ago
      They might be waiting until 2025. That's a long time to wait.
    - CharlesColeman 7y ago
      > This is one of those cases and his tweet is correct, they can just wait this out until the next election after someone new gets in and we do a 180. No. Chuck Schumer, one of Trump's major political rivals tweeted this in response his tweet on tariffs: > Hang tough on China, President @realDonaldTrump. Don’t back down. > Strength is the only way to win with China. https://twitter.com/SenSchumer/status/1125143336837206016 https://twitter.com/SenSchumer/status/1125143336837206016 The US isn't going to do a 180 until a pro-business Republican or a Libertarian sits in the Oval Office, and its unlikely that will happen next cycle unless Trump dies or is impeached.
_Codemonkeyism 7y ago
In the long perspective the Chinese market is the larger one with more people. Currently it makes sense for the US to be protectionist, in the long run the US market is smaller and Chinese companies will benefit from the larger Chinese market. This played out over 50y with the fragmented European market vs. the larger homogeneous US market. Starting in the US was (is) much more beneficial than starting in Europe (the language and culture issue here will never go away even when policy is more and more unified).
Leary 7y ago
The most recent tweets by Trump regarding this: "The reason for the China pullback & attempted renegotiation of the Trade Deal is the sincere HOPE that they will be able to “negotiate” with Joe Biden or one of the very weak Democrats, and thereby continue to ripoff the United States (($500 Billion a year)) for years to come... Guess what, that’s not going to happen! China has just informed us that they (Vice-Premier) are now coming to the U.S. to make a deal. We’ll see, but I am very happy with over $100 Billion a year in Tariffs filling U.S. coffers...great for U.S., not good for China!"
- ajmurmann 7y ago
  There are very real problems with how China treats foreign companies (intellectual theft, requirements to partner with Chinese companies and many more). I'm happy they get addressed. However, Trump completely misrepresents the problem and the impact of tariffs. The negotiations clearly are tackling the right issues, yet here he is talking about trade deficits as some kind of theft and tariffs as a straight up win like some moron who doesn't get econ 101. He is doing his (for once) good effort such a disservice. Is he trying to divide the country by even representing his good work in a way that will only appeal to his hardcore supporters or does he truly not get it? Is there a more charitable explanation? Edit: I also have very sour memories of Obama complaining about the trade deficit with Germany. In that case none of the real issues like we have doing business with China existed. In essence Obama was complaining about German companies being too successful and Germans saving too much money. Maybe I'm particular sensitive to trade deficit rhetoric because of that. If the passing field is level, then maybe the deficit is the fault of the country that has the deficit. In this case the playing field is very skewed and that's the problem.
  - dilyevsky 7y ago
    “Trade deficit” is what his voter base “understands” and it sounds scary so it would make sense to peddle this to them even though it has nothing to do with real issues. But then again it’s trump so who the fuck knows why he does it...
    - 7y ago
educationdata 7y ago
China is playing the old game, negotiation and negotiation and negotiation, never intend to make any change. They can even make promise to make changes after long long long negotiations and never do anything. And then when someone finally decide to do something about it, they will ask for a new round of negotiation and negotiation and negotiation. Xi will stay in power may be in next 20 years, and he knows US will have general election in every 4 years. Trump gets the idea: https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1126106540015071232 https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/11261065400150712...
- rrggrr 7y ago
  Incorrect. The tariffs are costing Chinese businesses and the government greatly. There is some other benefit to this that isn't explained by negotiation tactics. Although I cannot rule out a total misread of Trump by China, due to poor analysis, intelligence or misinformation.
  - pentae 7y ago
    Yeah, I guess the same tactic didn't work for North Korea, right? Oh, wait..
    - toasterlovin 7y ago
      North Korea doesn't have an economy dependent on exports to the US consumer market. Not a good comparison.
rrggrr 7y ago
I suspect Xi wants this dispute to continue for internal Chinese reasons. The tariffs impact different sectors and regions in China differently. It may be continued tariffs are reducing overcapacity in a manner that allows Xi to save face internally. It could be the tarrifs are breaking the back of powerful exporting provinces (eg. Jiagnsu) and helping Xi consolidate power. It may also be the case that things need to get much worse in China economically before Xi has a strong enough argument to persuade the Chinese military (a powerful economic force itself) to embrace a deal. Finally, the success of the Belt&Road strategy requires a shift from US/Western export to vast investment elsewhere; and it may be the case these tariffs provide the Chinese private sector a strong incentive to open new markets and long-haul decrease reliance on the US. Its complicated. I suspect a deal will be reached in 2-4 months.
- spectramax 7y ago
  I don’t know how by cutting down exports Xi plans to consolidate power? Could you please expand on the mechanism by which this could happen? Tariffs are breaking backs of exporting provinces, may be they could be ill informed and Chinese propaganda can spin this to blame US.
  - djvu9 7y ago
    Ruling by fear, anger and hunger. Check out North Korea.
  - rrggrr 7y ago
    Suffering constituencies (provinces, cities, banks, businesses) may have to make substantial concessions to Xi's leadership team/faction to obtain relief. Those concessions may be up front, or favors owed to be collected in the future. Politics 101.
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
- Spooky23 7y ago
  This is a feature of the US administration's approach to negotiation, driven by various motivations. China is not without leverage, and the US will blink first.
CWuestefeld 7y ago
Related to this and the censorship story already on the front page: China is censoring internal news about these trade controversies. From family over there I know that the general public isn't seeing this on TV or anything. And even messages on WeChat are being taken down (my wife has had several private postings removed)
- spectramax 7y ago
  I don’t know why and I am not a Chinese citizen but this kind of thing bothers me deeply. I hope Streisand effect takes over China in a self-propelling feedback loop until this whole show comes crashing down. People of China deserve better (once they’re a solid middle class and taken out of poverty).
  - jak92 7y ago
    > People of China deserve better (once they’re a solid middle class and taken out of poverty). You are implying that the current policies will bring them out of poverty which in a sense contradicts your first statement.
    - samspenc 7y ago
      Countries have emerged out of poverty even with strong democracies. I'm not sure why the world thinks that a strongman regime like the CCP is needed for economic growth. In that sense, China is (IMHO) actually an outlier, an exception where a Communist regime used fully capitalistic economic policies and foreign investment to bring people out of poverty. This could have happened even if there was a different form of government there.
- xhrwang 7y ago
  https://weibo.com/ttarticle/p/show?id=2309404369575977348865 https://weibo.com/ttarticle/p/show?id=2309404369575977348865 This is from People' s Daily (the most official state-owned paper) on Sina Weibo (Chinese Twitter) in the early morning of May 8th, the most popular social media in China, and the commentator of this article is believed to be the direct voice from the politburo, the highest leadership of CPC.
steve76 7y ago
Markets and population are not one to one. One very dedicated, idealistic and pious person can do more today than the rest of 7 billion people combined. What's desperately needed is to elevate the debate and put all issues on the table: China's leaders can misspeak. Why should they tell others how to speak? China's leaders cannot disarm their enemies. Why should they try to disarm yours? If people could go to China or Russia without having their businesses raided by the police just for being good at what they do and employing people, who cares who's rich or poor? Go high enough on the wealth ladder, and it's almost comical about how real wealth lives. Super frugal, much simpler than the trap of material wealth and celebrity everybody presumes. Until you find and build paradise, you have very little credibility in telling other people what to do from far far away.
argd678 7y ago
> Trump said on Wednesday that China is mistaken if it hopes to negotiate trade later with a Democratic presidential administration. What is that supposed to mean? That there won’t be another administration in the future is how it sounds.
- mfatica 7y ago
  Oh quit the fear mongering. He clearly states in the tweet they're referencing that the hope is the next administration will be a democrat, and they are trying to hold out for that.
duxup 7y ago
I think this is a very strange development. I'm a bit surprised they would backtrack at all. Rather in the past they've agreed to various regulations and laws and ... just not enacted or simply enacted and not followed them. That last part being the real question in all these details, does it matter if a deal gets made anyway? If anything the traditional route would have allowed the POTUS to declare victory and everyone just move on, but this is far more confrontational and unusual based on my understanding.
- mfatica 7y ago
  They're hoping for a democratic administration in 2020 to negotiate with.
  - toasterlovin 7y ago
    Another year and a half is a long time to make your people suffer. And a lot of the supply chains that moved out of China might not come back. Waiting is a hell of a gamble.
    - mfatica 7y ago
      I'm not sure a year and a half of unfavorable trade means much to a dictator who declares themself dictator for life, imprisons millions of citizens in re-education camps and engages in mass censorship.
      - toasterlovin 7y ago
        Good thing the Chinese people have no history of violently overthrowing their rulers.
    - Fjolsvith 7y ago
      Plus, there's a disaster brewing with the Chinese hog epidemic . Going to be lots of starvation in a year or two.

121 points by ycombonator 7y ago

Maybe China was just playing time and trying to time the trade conflict. US elections are next year. If the trade war escalates this summer, the effect on voters and the US economy will be hardest 6 to 12 months from now. After that the US economy will start to adjust for the new normal.

duxup 7y ago
Concerns about China though aren't likely to change.... I'm not sure voters will feel like "We need to strike a deal with China" ... and accordingly I'm not sure it is so much a Chinese advantage. If things are worse, voters could be just as angry and willing to vote for someone who wants to fight ... more with China over trade. This could be a case where China might want to stoke a problem, and get more blowback than they otherwise would have. The current POTUS (elected dude to a lot of things including economic concerns by some voters) has already proven you can put up a fight and the sky doesn't fall... and a politician might not see making a deal advantageous to China as a good political move, or even likely to produce a lot of economic benefit.
toasterlovin 7y ago
How, exactly, do you envision the US economy being damaged by a trade war with China? As far as I can tell, the effects thus far have been basically nil. Whereas things are looking pretty bad in China at the moment...
- existencebox 7y ago
  >the effects thus far have been basically nil This is quite factually untrue. [0] [1] [2] [3] To be clear, this is entirely as a rebuttal to your claim, not as any broader statement about international policy or outcomes. [0] https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-02-14/u-s-soy-exports-won-t-reach-pre-trade-war-levels-for-years https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-02-14/u-s-soy-e... [1] https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/19/us/politics/farming-trump-trade-war.html https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/19/us/politics/farming-trump... [2] https://www.forbes.com/sites/jamesellsmoor/2019/02/24/under-trumps-tariffs-the-us-lost-20000-solar-energy-jobs/#1fcc880d76ba https://www.forbes.com/sites/jamesellsmoor/2019/02/24/under-... [3]https://www.minnpost.com/economy/2018/08/trade-war-pulls-pork-prices-down-minnesota-farmers/ https://www.minnpost.com/economy/2018/08/trade-war-pulls-por...

Shivetya 7y ago

So basically China's stance is, we cannot change our laws so our bad trading practices must remain in place? While we only get news of trade imbalances between US and China to include all their tariffs and restrictions can someone for the EU or elsewhere chime in with how their nations fare?

baybal2 7y ago
> So basically China's stance is, we cannot change our laws so our bad trading practices must remain in place? China's, or better said Liu He's, stance is "we will not do anything if it has chance to blew into Xi Jinping's face" Xi brandished how he tames "capitalist tigers" by wholly appropriating the credit for the trade deal. Now he is being made to look stupid with a single twiter post. It is likely he will not touch the talks personally out of fear for more embarrassment Liu He might be only a fourth vice premier in line, but only one Xi has personal ties to.
- gdsdfe 7y ago
  I feel like none knows how to deal with the Chinese, there's a cultural gap that the US and Europe are not accounting for, the Chinese care a lot about saving face and status
  - baybal2 7y ago
    To me it feels like Trump did it more or less intentionally. He seem to know that behind a stone faced facade, Xi is an anxious and insecure person — the same 7th grader he was when his family was purged.
    - ethbro 7y ago
      How could you not be anxious as a Chinese politician? In Western democracies, if you lose political power at worst you get indicted (and usually pardoned). Half of the country still likes you. In China, you face serious prison time, your family's assets are seized, you're expelled from politics, and media runs a solid month of anti-you propaganda. Harsh consequences for what many times is a roll of the dice.

verroq 7y ago

I don't understand the hate Trump gets for doing what needs to be done. All these issues esp. theft of intellectual property, IP transfer, currency manipulation are much more important in the long term than some tarrifs. One shitpost tweet crashed SZSC by 7%, most of China couldn't even read it. Trump is in a position of power at least with this negotiation. China deserves the pain train for backpedalling.

whytaka 7y ago
This is the one thing where I find myself supporting the policies of the Trump administration.
- yumraj 7y ago
  I have to agree. And, while I will hate myself for this, but after Biden's statement that China is not a competition, who I will end up voting for in the next election is no longer given.
- ok_coo 7y ago
  Yep, one of the hardest and most important things in life is the ability to agree/compromise with people you have fundamental issues with. This is one of those cases and his tweet is correct, they can just wait this out until the next election after someone new gets in and we do a 180.
  - dsfyu404ed 7y ago
    They might be waiting until 2025. That's a long time to wait.
  - CharlesColeman 7y ago
    > This is one of those cases and his tweet is correct, they can just wait this out until the next election after someone new gets in and we do a 180. No. Chuck Schumer, one of Trump's major political rivals tweeted this in response his tweet on tariffs: > Hang tough on China, President @realDonaldTrump. Don’t back down. > Strength is the only way to win with China. https://twitter.com/SenSchumer/status/1125143336837206016 https://twitter.com/SenSchumer/status/1125143336837206016 The US isn't going to do a 180 until a pro-business Republican or a Libertarian sits in the Oval Office, and its unlikely that will happen next cycle unless Trump dies or is impeached.

_Codemonkeyism 7y ago

In the long perspective the Chinese market is the larger one with more people. Currently it makes sense for the US to be protectionist, in the long run the US market is smaller and Chinese companies will benefit from the larger Chinese market. This played out over 50y with the fragmented European market vs. the larger homogeneous US market. Starting in the US was (is) much more beneficial than starting in Europe (the language and culture issue here will never go away even when policy is more and more unified).

Leary 7y ago

The most recent tweets by Trump regarding this: "The reason for the China pullback & attempted renegotiation of the Trade Deal is the sincere HOPE that they will be able to “negotiate” with Joe Biden or one of the very weak Democrats, and thereby continue to ripoff the United States (($500 Billion a year)) for years to come... Guess what, that’s not going to happen! China has just informed us that they (Vice-Premier) are now coming to the U.S. to make a deal. We’ll see, but I am very happy with over $100 Billion a year in Tariffs filling U.S. coffers...great for U.S., not good for China!"

ajmurmann 7y ago
There are very real problems with how China treats foreign companies (intellectual theft, requirements to partner with Chinese companies and many more). I'm happy they get addressed. However, Trump completely misrepresents the problem and the impact of tariffs. The negotiations clearly are tackling the right issues, yet here he is talking about trade deficits as some kind of theft and tariffs as a straight up win like some moron who doesn't get econ 101. He is doing his (for once) good effort such a disservice. Is he trying to divide the country by even representing his good work in a way that will only appeal to his hardcore supporters or does he truly not get it? Is there a more charitable explanation? Edit: I also have very sour memories of Obama complaining about the trade deficit with Germany. In that case none of the real issues like we have doing business with China existed. In essence Obama was complaining about German companies being too successful and Germans saving too much money. Maybe I'm particular sensitive to trade deficit rhetoric because of that. If the passing field is level, then maybe the deficit is the fault of the country that has the deficit. In this case the playing field is very skewed and that's the problem.
- dilyevsky 7y ago
  “Trade deficit” is what his voter base “understands” and it sounds scary so it would make sense to peddle this to them even though it has nothing to do with real issues. But then again it’s trump so who the fuck knows why he does it...
  - 7y ago

educationdata 7y ago

China is playing the old game, negotiation and negotiation and negotiation, never intend to make any change. They can even make promise to make changes after long long long negotiations and never do anything. And then when someone finally decide to do something about it, they will ask for a new round of negotiation and negotiation and negotiation. Xi will stay in power may be in next 20 years, and he knows US will have general election in every 4 years. Trump gets the idea: https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1126106540015071232 https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/11261065400150712...

rrggrr 7y ago
Incorrect. The tariffs are costing Chinese businesses and the government greatly. There is some other benefit to this that isn't explained by negotiation tactics. Although I cannot rule out a total misread of Trump by China, due to poor analysis, intelligence or misinformation.
- pentae 7y ago
  Yeah, I guess the same tactic didn't work for North Korea, right? Oh, wait..
  - toasterlovin 7y ago
    North Korea doesn't have an economy dependent on exports to the US consumer market. Not a good comparison.

rrggrr 7y ago

I suspect Xi wants this dispute to continue for internal Chinese reasons. The tariffs impact different sectors and regions in China differently. It may be continued tariffs are reducing overcapacity in a manner that allows Xi to save face internally. It could be the tarrifs are breaking the back of powerful exporting provinces (eg. Jiagnsu) and helping Xi consolidate power. It may also be the case that things need to get much worse in China economically before Xi has a strong enough argument to persuade the Chinese military (a powerful economic force itself) to embrace a deal. Finally, the success of the Belt&Road strategy requires a shift from US/Western export to vast investment elsewhere; and it may be the case these tariffs provide the Chinese private sector a strong incentive to open new markets and long-haul decrease reliance on the US. Its complicated. I suspect a deal will be reached in 2-4 months.

spectramax 7y ago
I don’t know how by cutting down exports Xi plans to consolidate power? Could you please expand on the mechanism by which this could happen? Tariffs are breaking backs of exporting provinces, may be they could be ill informed and Chinese propaganda can spin this to blame US.
- djvu9 7y ago
  Ruling by fear, anger and hunger. Check out North Korea.
- rrggrr 7y ago
  Suffering constituencies (provinces, cities, banks, businesses) may have to make substantial concessions to Xi's leadership team/faction to obtain relief. Those concessions may be up front, or favors owed to be collected in the future. Politics 101.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
Spooky23 7y ago
This is a feature of the US administration's approach to negotiation, driven by various motivations. China is not without leverage, and the US will blink first.

CWuestefeld 7y ago

Related to this and the censorship story already on the front page: China is censoring internal news about these trade controversies. From family over there I know that the general public isn't seeing this on TV or anything. And even messages on WeChat are being taken down (my wife has had several private postings removed)

spectramax 7y ago
I don’t know why and I am not a Chinese citizen but this kind of thing bothers me deeply. I hope Streisand effect takes over China in a self-propelling feedback loop until this whole show comes crashing down. People of China deserve better (once they’re a solid middle class and taken out of poverty).
- jak92 7y ago
  > People of China deserve better (once they’re a solid middle class and taken out of poverty). You are implying that the current policies will bring them out of poverty which in a sense contradicts your first statement.
  - samspenc 7y ago
    Countries have emerged out of poverty even with strong democracies. I'm not sure why the world thinks that a strongman regime like the CCP is needed for economic growth. In that sense, China is (IMHO) actually an outlier, an exception where a Communist regime used fully capitalistic economic policies and foreign investment to bring people out of poverty. This could have happened even if there was a different form of government there.
xhrwang 7y ago
https://weibo.com/ttarticle/p/show?id=2309404369575977348865 https://weibo.com/ttarticle/p/show?id=2309404369575977348865 This is from People' s Daily (the most official state-owned paper) on Sina Weibo (Chinese Twitter) in the early morning of May 8th, the most popular social media in China, and the commentator of this article is believed to be the direct voice from the politburo, the highest leadership of CPC.

steve76 7y ago

Markets and population are not one to one. One very dedicated, idealistic and pious person can do more today than the rest of 7 billion people combined. What's desperately needed is to elevate the debate and put all issues on the table: China's leaders can misspeak. Why should they tell others how to speak? China's leaders cannot disarm their enemies. Why should they try to disarm yours? If people could go to China or Russia without having their businesses raided by the police just for being good at what they do and employing people, who cares who's rich or poor? Go high enough on the wealth ladder, and it's almost comical about how real wealth lives. Super frugal, much simpler than the trap of material wealth and celebrity everybody presumes. Until you find and build paradise, you have very little credibility in telling other people what to do from far far away.

argd678 7y ago

> Trump said on Wednesday that China is mistaken if it hopes to negotiate trade later with a Democratic presidential administration. What is that supposed to mean? That there won’t be another administration in the future is how it sounds.

mfatica 7y ago
Oh quit the fear mongering. He clearly states in the tweet they're referencing that the hope is the next administration will be a democrat, and they are trying to hold out for that.

duxup 7y ago

I think this is a very strange development. I'm a bit surprised they would backtrack at all. Rather in the past they've agreed to various regulations and laws and ... just not enacted or simply enacted and not followed them. That last part being the real question in all these details, does it matter if a deal gets made anyway? If anything the traditional route would have allowed the POTUS to declare victory and everyone just move on, but this is far more confrontational and unusual based on my understanding.

mfatica 7y ago
They're hoping for a democratic administration in 2020 to negotiate with.
- toasterlovin 7y ago
  Another year and a half is a long time to make your people suffer. And a lot of the supply chains that moved out of China might not come back. Waiting is a hell of a gamble.
  - mfatica 7y ago
    I'm not sure a year and a half of unfavorable trade means much to a dictator who declares themself dictator for life, imprisons millions of citizens in re-education camps and engages in mass censorship.
    - toasterlovin 7y ago
      Good thing the Chinese people have no history of violently overthrowing their rulers.
  - Fjolsvith 7y ago
    Plus, there's a disaster brewing with the Chinese hog epidemic . Going to be lots of starvation in a year or two.