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So you are competing with batteries? I suppose batteries have much higher roundtrip efficiency, but maybe there are other advantages to your technology, like be

So you are competing with batteries? I suppose batteries have much higher roundtrip efficiency, but maybe there are other advantages to your technology, like being able to rely on combustion engine cars?

__sy__ 8y ago
Their sweet spot is specific energy density of the fuel source. The higher the requirement, the better off you are from not having to carry around your oxidizer.
rmcginnis 8y ago
The main advantage of renewable gasoline over batteries is that we can decarbonize the existing vehicle fleet without replacing it. Also, the very high energy density of gasoline, diesel, and jet fuel will make sense for a long time in Jet aircraft, long haul trucks, and ocean container ships, for example.
- cjbenedikt 8y ago
  The very high density is in hydrogen - actually.
  - photon-torpedo 8y ago
    And the best way to store hydrogen is to attach it to carbon atoms.
- jdnier 8y ago
  > we can decarbonize the existing vehicle fleet without replacing it. Put that way, it's a huge improvement and avoids having to electrify entire fleets first.
- Grustaf 8y ago
  Now for aircraft I can see how it makes sense, but anything ground based could easily be electrified. Another thing, will this synthetic diesel burn cleanly like hydrogen or do they need to add lots of nasty stuff?
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
harpastum 8y ago
The energy density of gas makes it incredibly useful for storage and transportation as well. For example, Tesla's 50MWh battery installation in Australia has the same energy as only 1,500 gallons of gasoline. (It's not an apples to apples comparison, I just wanted to give an example of a "large" battery installation.) Obviously there are lots of benefits of batteries over gas, but being able to load up a standard 10,000 gallon tanker truck with 300MWh of energy and drive it anywhere there's a road is something batteries simply can't do.
- owenversteeg 8y ago
  Yup, exactly. You can fit the entire battery installation in 5.5 cubic meters! A fairly small closet, even (1.4x1.5x2.5 meters for example, 4.5 x 5 x 8 feet) could fit the entire battery plant, which is huge by comparison.
- Grustaf 8y ago
  Sure, but how useful is the energy density in practice? 1. Very soon all new cars will be electric anyway (because that is better for other reasons) 2. I’m assuming range will not be an issue, almost all private driving is very local, so most cars don’t benefit from long range, as long as it’s easy to get long range vehicles when you need them. And of course trucks etc will need to be long range. 3. Driving a truckload of energy is cool but how useful is it? We can already deliver more energy than that instantly through the grid, and most populated places on earth are on the grid now so it seems like a niche use case.

__sy__ 8y ago

Their sweet spot is specific energy density of the fuel source. The higher the requirement, the better off you are from not having to carry around your oxidizer.

rmcginnis 8y ago

The main advantage of renewable gasoline over batteries is that we can decarbonize the existing vehicle fleet without replacing it. Also, the very high energy density of gasoline, diesel, and jet fuel will make sense for a long time in Jet aircraft, long haul trucks, and ocean container ships, for example.

cjbenedikt 8y ago
The very high density is in hydrogen - actually.
- photon-torpedo 8y ago
  And the best way to store hydrogen is to attach it to carbon atoms.
jdnier 8y ago
> we can decarbonize the existing vehicle fleet without replacing it. Put that way, it's a huge improvement and avoids having to electrify entire fleets first.
Grustaf 8y ago
Now for aircraft I can see how it makes sense, but anything ground based could easily be electrified. Another thing, will this synthetic diesel burn cleanly like hydrogen or do they need to add lots of nasty stuff?

deleted 8y ago

[deleted]

harpastum 8y ago

The energy density of gas makes it incredibly useful for storage and transportation as well. For example, Tesla's 50MWh battery installation in Australia has the same energy as only 1,500 gallons of gasoline. (It's not an apples to apples comparison, I just wanted to give an example of a "large" battery installation.) Obviously there are lots of benefits of batteries over gas, but being able to load up a standard 10,000 gallon tanker truck with 300MWh of energy and drive it anywhere there's a road is something batteries simply can't do.

owenversteeg 8y ago
Yup, exactly. You can fit the entire battery installation in 5.5 cubic meters! A fairly small closet, even (1.4x1.5x2.5 meters for example, 4.5 x 5 x 8 feet) could fit the entire battery plant, which is huge by comparison.
Grustaf 8y ago
Sure, but how useful is the energy density in practice? 1. Very soon all new cars will be electric anyway (because that is better for other reasons) 2. I’m assuming range will not be an issue, almost all private driving is very local, so most cars don’t benefit from long range, as long as it’s easy to get long range vehicles when you need them. And of course trucks etc will need to be long range. 3. Driving a truckload of energy is cool but how useful is it? We can already deliver more energy than that instantly through the grid, and most populated places on earth are on the grid now so it seems like a niche use case.