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Right, so what constitutes a major viewpoint? Let's say that a popular politician believes that vaccines cause autism. In order to be impartial, does the news

Right, so what constitutes a major viewpoint? Let's say that a popular politician believes that vaccines cause autism. In order to be impartial, does the news outlet now have to give equal weight to people who believe in a lie? Or what if what the majority believes is actually abhorrent? Like for example, let's say the majority believe (or choose to simply ignore) that it's a good thing to put a bunch of ethnic minorities in concentration camps. Whether it's due to propaganda or threats from the government. In this hypothetical example, let's call these people Uyghurs. Is the impartial outlet supposed to give equal consideration to both sides? Maybe bring up a few positives of concentration camps?

coldtea 8y ago
>Let's say that a popular politician believes that vaccines cause autism. In order to be impartial, does the news outlet now have to give equal weight to people who believe in a lie? The political matters news outlets cover are not confined to scientific issues (like vaccines) that can be settled by some expert consensus. They can dismiss such claims easily, and those are not the point anyway. Nor are most political issues as clear cut as putting minorities in "concentration camps" -- that's a contrived example, making sound like anything not approved by the Guardian amounts to Hitler (or, in this case, Chinese state oppression -- though even this story might have more nuance than what we're getting). The most important political issues cannot be classified as "a lie", they are just different ways of thinking of what's good, beneficial, important short or long term, etc. And of course, different interests, to different segments of the population, or to different countries, cultures, etc. Examples? The arguments pro or against social democracy or liberalism. The arguments pro or against immigration. Or pro or against EU governance. Or pro or against certain fiscal policies. Or pro or against surveillance. Or pro or against privacy. Or pro or against this or that war or intervention or enemy du jour. Or pro or against this or that technology. Or pro or against this or that education reform. Or pro or against Assange. And so on... Yet those nuanced things are still presented as one side is the "good side" and the other is either evil or deluded or a liar.
- fzeroracer 8y ago
  There is zero website, news team or otherwise that adheres to your nigh-impossible lofty ideals of 'neutrality'. Every single site is going to have some bias in one direction or another. For example, EFF is obviously going to be biased against anything that takes away privacy. The Guardian is going to be more left leaning than The Daily Mail and so forth. Can you name me a single example of a website behaving according to the rules that you've laid down?
  - coldtea 8y ago
    >There is zero website, news team or otherwise that adheres to your nigh-impossible lofty ideals of 'neutrality'. Every single site is going to have some bias in one direction or another. I don't care for "some bias in one direction or another", nor I have "nigh-impossible lofty ideals". I just don't like to be taken for a fool with blatant bias -- which many outlets have, including the Guardian. >For example, EFF is obviously going to be biased against anything that takes away privacy. The Guardian is going to be more left leaning than The Daily Mail and so forth. Again those things are not really relevant to what I say. You can be more left or right leaning, or be more pro-privacy than anti-privacy and still tell things like they are (including in your opinion pieces) without demonizing the other side, misrepresenting their arguments, using uncharitable interpretations, using imagery and statistics for cheap tricks, and so on. In other words, you can still report and opinion on things in good faith, despite having a bias.
    - fzeroracer 8y ago
      I have not seen the Guardian pull anything like that in my time of reading it. That said, again, what would be an example of a charitable news outlet that does not pull tricks you claim the Guardian is doing?

coldtea 8y ago

>Let's say that a popular politician believes that vaccines cause autism. In order to be impartial, does the news outlet now have to give equal weight to people who believe in a lie? The political matters news outlets cover are not confined to scientific issues (like vaccines) that can be settled by some expert consensus. They can dismiss such claims easily, and those are not the point anyway. Nor are most political issues as clear cut as putting minorities in "concentration camps" -- that's a contrived example, making sound like anything not approved by the Guardian amounts to Hitler (or, in this case, Chinese state oppression -- though even this story might have more nuance than what we're getting). The most important political issues cannot be classified as "a lie", they are just different ways of thinking of what's good, beneficial, important short or long term, etc. And of course, different interests, to different segments of the population, or to different countries, cultures, etc. Examples? The arguments pro or against social democracy or liberalism. The arguments pro or against immigration. Or pro or against EU governance. Or pro or against certain fiscal policies. Or pro or against surveillance. Or pro or against privacy. Or pro or against this or that war or intervention or enemy du jour. Or pro or against this or that technology. Or pro or against this or that education reform. Or pro or against Assange. And so on... Yet those nuanced things are still presented as one side is the "good side" and the other is either evil or deluded or a liar.

fzeroracer 8y ago
There is zero website, news team or otherwise that adheres to your nigh-impossible lofty ideals of 'neutrality'. Every single site is going to have some bias in one direction or another. For example, EFF is obviously going to be biased against anything that takes away privacy. The Guardian is going to be more left leaning than The Daily Mail and so forth. Can you name me a single example of a website behaving according to the rules that you've laid down?
- coldtea 8y ago
  >There is zero website, news team or otherwise that adheres to your nigh-impossible lofty ideals of 'neutrality'. Every single site is going to have some bias in one direction or another. I don't care for "some bias in one direction or another", nor I have "nigh-impossible lofty ideals". I just don't like to be taken for a fool with blatant bias -- which many outlets have, including the Guardian. >For example, EFF is obviously going to be biased against anything that takes away privacy. The Guardian is going to be more left leaning than The Daily Mail and so forth. Again those things are not really relevant to what I say. You can be more left or right leaning, or be more pro-privacy than anti-privacy and still tell things like they are (including in your opinion pieces) without demonizing the other side, misrepresenting their arguments, using uncharitable interpretations, using imagery and statistics for cheap tricks, and so on. In other words, you can still report and opinion on things in good faith, despite having a bias.
  - fzeroracer 8y ago
    I have not seen the Guardian pull anything like that in my time of reading it. That said, again, what would be an example of a charitable news outlet that does not pull tricks you claim the Guardian is doing?