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> the consumer demand for the goods those companies provide is unlikely to go away. There wouldn't be consumer demand if the companies in question hadn't cover
by fao_ 8y ago
> the consumer demand for the goods those companies provide is unlikely to go away.
There wouldn't be consumer demand if the companies in question hadn't covered up the damage that they do. You can hide behind 'consumer demand' but that really is just a meaningless term, practically speaking, through what is almost a total control of the major press outlets (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rupert_Murdoch https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rupert_Murdoch), and rabid advertising, the consumer can be manipulated to like or dislike anything. Especially if you suppress certain details like "buying oil is killing the planet". It isn't like the companies in question didn't have 40 years to diversify into sustainable energy sources.
You argue against the state having control, but at least if that were the case the state could have enforced a gradual tapering off and eventual stoppage of these types of energy. Unfortunately we no longer have the time to do that.
In fact, you are using exactly the same arguments that the oil industry used, to cover up climate change.
See: https://www.theguardian.com/environment/climate-consensus-97-per-cent/2018/sep/19/shell-and-exxons-secret-1980s-climate-change-warnings https://www.theguardian.com/environment/climate-consensus-97...
Privately, these companies did not dispute the links
between their products, global warming, and ecological
calamity. On the contrary, their research confirmed the
connections.
and
Nor did the companies ever take responsibility for
their products. In Shell’s study, the firm argued that
the “main burden” of addressing climate change rests
not with the energy industry, but with governments and
consumers. That argument might have made sense if oil
executives, including those from Exxon and Shell, had
not later lied about climate change and actively
prevented governments from enacting clean-energy
policies.
> People consume energy and it's unlikely that we'll be able to reduce our usage meaningfully in the near future.
The only reason people consume unsustainable energy is because the alternative is expensive, and people are not paid properly enough to be able to afford such luxuries as a clean conscience.
See: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/80-percent-of-us-adults-face-near-poverty-unemployment-survey-finds/ https://www.cbsnews.com/news/80-percent-of-us-adults-face-ne...
The gauge defines "economic insecurity" as a year or
more of periodic joblessness, reliance on government
aid such as food stamps or income below 150 percent of
the poverty line. Measured across all races, the risk
of economic insecurity rises to 79 percent.
and
It's time that America comes to understand that many of
the nation's biggest disparities, from education and
life expectancy to poverty, are increasingly due to
economic class position," said William Julius Wilson, a
Harvard professor who specializes in race and poverty.
- artimaeis 8y ago> "You argue against the state having control" Do I? I've reread what I wrote and don't think I made any such statements -- but if I did, that was _not_ my intention. State and planetary intervention seems to be our only way forward. > The only reason people consume unsustainable energy is because the alternative is expensive Yes, absolutely. And this is further complicated by the emissions that developing nations tend to output as they advance and grow. As long as coal remains as cheap and as sought-after by developing nations we will have a hard time reigning in the harmful emissions.