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As a German, I can't follow you about our out of control spiraled energy costs. Yes, the EEG made electricity more expensive [0], it also didn't help that ener

As a German, I can't follow you about our out of control spiraled energy costs. Yes, the EEG made electricity more expensive [0], it also didn't help that energy companies abused regulatory loopholes to fill their own pockets. But nobody can expect large scale changes like this to be free, somebody gotta pay for this and I'm absolutely willing to pay for this because in the long-term it will be worth it. It's also my understanding that electricity exports ain't a one-way street between France and Germany, electricity exports and imports are on a pretty similar level [1]. Imho the real problem currently is a lack of proper storage technologies and infrastructure, so we can fully utilize our renewable capabilities, but I'm hopeful that we will also get there. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Renewable_Energy_Sources_Act https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Renewable_Energy_Source... [1] https://www.energy-charts.de/exchange.htm https://www.energy-charts.de/exchange.htm

archi42 8y ago
I have to strongly agree with the first part regarding the so called "out of control costs": Yeah, electricity is much cheaper in the US than here, but so what? Often people on HN (especially those in the states) make claims like "people ought to see the real costs on their bills", especially when it's about subsidies (e.g. via public health care). But, well, here is the thing: Energy in the US is greatly subsidized. Not necessarily monetarily, but regarding environmental costs. Gallon of gasoline for cheap bucks for thirsty cars? Even cheaper electricity for Bitcoin mining? Yeah, I suppose a lot of the extra costs here end up in some company pockets - but if this causes people to be more responsible with their power usage then that's an acceptable trade-off for me. As for the second part: I know a lot of grid-balancing happens cross-border in the EU, but I didn't look up numbers, so there is not a lot I can objectively say on that topic. Personally, I pay a little more for "clean" energy. I know I still get the same mix like anyone else, but my energy supplier has to buy my personal demand from more eco-friendly sources. Yes, it is still "a spit in an empty pool", but that's still better than taking a dump in the river on bathing day just because everyone else is doing it.

archi42 8y ago

I have to strongly agree with the first part regarding the so called "out of control costs": Yeah, electricity is much cheaper in the US than here, but so what? Often people on HN (especially those in the states) make claims like "people ought to see the real costs on their bills", especially when it's about subsidies (e.g. via public health care). But, well, here is the thing: Energy in the US is greatly subsidized. Not necessarily monetarily, but regarding environmental costs. Gallon of gasoline for cheap bucks for thirsty cars? Even cheaper electricity for Bitcoin mining? Yeah, I suppose a lot of the extra costs here end up in some company pockets - but if this causes people to be more responsible with their power usage then that's an acceptable trade-off for me. As for the second part: I know a lot of grid-balancing happens cross-border in the EU, but I didn't look up numbers, so there is not a lot I can objectively say on that topic. Personally, I pay a little more for "clean" energy. I know I still get the same mix like anyone else, but my energy supplier has to buy my personal demand from more eco-friendly sources. Yes, it is still "a spit in an empty pool", but that's still better than taking a dump in the river on bathing day just because everyone else is doing it.