5 ms·

That's not what the above poster said, and you know it. You say "marginally", "anyone", "mocking". But the people in question aren't anyone, and they aren't jus

That's not what the above poster said, and you know it. You say "marginally", "anyone", "mocking". But the people in question aren't anyone, and they aren't just mocking. There are specific cases of them calling on their fans to harass private citizens. Anyone with some semblance of awareness of US law knows free speech is not without limits. No one is entitled to online speech, believe it or not.

naasking 7y ago
> No one is entitled to online speech, believe it or not. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_to_Internet_access https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_to_Internet_access
- viraptor 7y ago
  This is not relevant. Some people get the right to internet access. They don't get the right to say what they want where they want without moderation.
  - naasking 7y ago
    Not irrelevant. The OP said that "no one is entitled to online speech". That's an unqualified statement which my link disproves. If they had instead qualified it as, "no one has a right to speech on Facebook", that's a different claim (arguably also false depending on the circumstances).
    - belltaco 7y ago
      The post is about the US, your link shows the right exists only in about 6 countries, none of which are the US.So it's irrelevant.
      - naasking 7y ago
        Once again, the statement was unqualified, "no one has the right to..." And once again, my link literally proves this statement to be false, because as you just admitted, at least some people do have that right.
    - DanBC 7y ago
      You seem to be confusing two different rights. The right to Internet access is not the right to say whatever you like on the Internet.
      - naasking 7y ago
        I suggest reading the first sentence from the link I posted.
        DanBC 7y ago
        But you seem to think "freedom of expression" == "freedom to say what you like", and that's clearly wrong because Europe has rights to freedom of expression (article 10) but you can't say what you like in Europe. I'd suggest that you take the time to understand the links you post.
        naasking 7y ago
        > But you seem to think "freedom of expression" == "freedom to say what you like" Where did I say this?
- hajile 7y ago
  That is just an appeal to authority. Once upon a time, that same kind of authority said certain races were sub-human and had few or no rights. The question of whether or not it is a right is completely separate from the current trend of those in power.
Veen 7y ago
I suppose you’re aware that it’s not unknown for members of the trans community to “call on their fans to harass private citizens”. Would you like them banned too? In fact, Milo has been the victim of many such calls for harassment. To be clear, I had personal interactions with Milo many years ago when he ran a technology magazine in the UK. I’ve never met a more unpleasant individual and I would be happy to never hear from him again, but progressives working hand-in-hand with corporations to ban obnoxious individuals is a slope I don’t want us to start sliding down.
- viraptor 7y ago
  > for members of the trans community to “call on their fans to harass private citizens” And you're free to raise that issue on its own merit when it happens. You're also welcome to report it to the social network it's posted on for moderation/banning. This does not change anything about banning Milo.
  - Veen 7y ago
    You avoided the question. Do you think members of the trans community who call for the harassment of private citizens should be banned from Facebook?
    - viraptor 7y ago
      Yes, I did. I'm familiar with Milo situation, but not with situations you have in mind. I'm happy with Facebook banning anyone breaking their policies. I do not agree with many of their policies. In general, I'd expect the answer would be "yes" - but without knowing specific cases and what you mean by "harassment", I can't answer.
      - Veen 7y ago
        So for you this is an issue of property rights? Facebook owns the platform and so they can ban whomever they like for breaching their policies, which they should be free to choose without interference?
tathougies 7y ago
> There are specific cases of them calling on their fans to harass private citizens. Anyone with some semblance of awareness of US law knows free speech is not without limits. No one is entitled to online speech, believe it or not. So will CNN, MSNBC, and the Washington Post be banned from facebook for setting hundreds of doxxers and activists on a high school kid who smiled in a red hat? Man, the lack of introspection in this thread is astounding.
- sdenton4 7y ago
  So it's ok for Alex Jones to encourage doxxing constantly forever because some bad reporting happened in the main stream media once? Got it.
  - tathougies 7y ago
    No not at all. I think they should be banned along with CNN and MSNBC. I don't see why when I suggested banning those two news outlets you immediately assumed it was nuts and the argument was to urban Alex Jones.
  - tenpies 7y ago
    > once? How fast we forget: https://www.cnn.com/2017/07/04/politics/kfile-reddit-user-trump-tweet/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2017/07/04/politics/kfile-reddit-user-tr... Or take your pick of mainstream media openly inciting violence: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nw9kyYEwg2 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nw9kyYEwg2
- SantalBlush 7y ago
  They should be suspended with a warning, yes. If they continue to do it, they should be banned.

naasking 7y ago

> No one is entitled to online speech, believe it or not. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_to_Internet_access https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_to_Internet_access

viraptor 7y ago
This is not relevant. Some people get the right to internet access. They don't get the right to say what they want where they want without moderation.
- naasking 7y ago
  Not irrelevant. The OP said that "no one is entitled to online speech". That's an unqualified statement which my link disproves. If they had instead qualified it as, "no one has a right to speech on Facebook", that's a different claim (arguably also false depending on the circumstances).
  - belltaco 7y ago
    The post is about the US, your link shows the right exists only in about 6 countries, none of which are the US.So it's irrelevant.
    - naasking 7y ago
      Once again, the statement was unqualified, "no one has the right to..." And once again, my link literally proves this statement to be false, because as you just admitted, at least some people do have that right.
  - DanBC 7y ago
    You seem to be confusing two different rights. The right to Internet access is not the right to say whatever you like on the Internet.
    - naasking 7y ago
      I suggest reading the first sentence from the link I posted.
      - DanBC 7y ago
        But you seem to think "freedom of expression" == "freedom to say what you like", and that's clearly wrong because Europe has rights to freedom of expression (article 10) but you can't say what you like in Europe. I'd suggest that you take the time to understand the links you post.
        naasking 7y ago
        > But you seem to think "freedom of expression" == "freedom to say what you like" Where did I say this?
hajile 7y ago
That is just an appeal to authority. Once upon a time, that same kind of authority said certain races were sub-human and had few or no rights. The question of whether or not it is a right is completely separate from the current trend of those in power.

Veen 7y ago

I suppose you’re aware that it’s not unknown for members of the trans community to “call on their fans to harass private citizens”. Would you like them banned too? In fact, Milo has been the victim of many such calls for harassment. To be clear, I had personal interactions with Milo many years ago when he ran a technology magazine in the UK. I’ve never met a more unpleasant individual and I would be happy to never hear from him again, but progressives working hand-in-hand with corporations to ban obnoxious individuals is a slope I don’t want us to start sliding down.

viraptor 7y ago
> for members of the trans community to “call on their fans to harass private citizens” And you're free to raise that issue on its own merit when it happens. You're also welcome to report it to the social network it's posted on for moderation/banning. This does not change anything about banning Milo.
- Veen 7y ago
  You avoided the question. Do you think members of the trans community who call for the harassment of private citizens should be banned from Facebook?
  - viraptor 7y ago
    Yes, I did. I'm familiar with Milo situation, but not with situations you have in mind. I'm happy with Facebook banning anyone breaking their policies. I do not agree with many of their policies. In general, I'd expect the answer would be "yes" - but without knowing specific cases and what you mean by "harassment", I can't answer.
    - Veen 7y ago
      So for you this is an issue of property rights? Facebook owns the platform and so they can ban whomever they like for breaching their policies, which they should be free to choose without interference?

tathougies 7y ago

> There are specific cases of them calling on their fans to harass private citizens. Anyone with some semblance of awareness of US law knows free speech is not without limits. No one is entitled to online speech, believe it or not. So will CNN, MSNBC, and the Washington Post be banned from facebook for setting hundreds of doxxers and activists on a high school kid who smiled in a red hat? Man, the lack of introspection in this thread is astounding.

sdenton4 7y ago
So it's ok for Alex Jones to encourage doxxing constantly forever because some bad reporting happened in the main stream media once? Got it.
- tathougies 7y ago
  No not at all. I think they should be banned along with CNN and MSNBC. I don't see why when I suggested banning those two news outlets you immediately assumed it was nuts and the argument was to urban Alex Jones.
- tenpies 7y ago
  > once? How fast we forget: https://www.cnn.com/2017/07/04/politics/kfile-reddit-user-trump-tweet/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2017/07/04/politics/kfile-reddit-user-tr... Or take your pick of mainstream media openly inciting violence: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nw9kyYEwg2 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nw9kyYEwg2
SantalBlush 7y ago
They should be suspended with a warning, yes. If they continue to do it, they should be banned.