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[disclosure, MS employee] With the absence of telemetry, how do you know Linux is doing just fine? (specifically in the desktop world, not server world). Mic

[disclosure, MS employee] With the absence of telemetry, how do you know Linux is doing just fine? (specifically in the desktop world, not server world). Microsoft has an interest in knowing how well Windows is doing, and Windows has lived in a world both with and without telemetry. It was way, way harder to gauge success prior to telemetry, and it was also much more frustrating for the user to communicate their problems. I don't think Windows could have stayed in the pre-telemetry engineering world and maintained its position as a competitive desktop OS. I ask this mostly out of ignorance, I've got experience using Linux, but I really don't know what the dev-loop is like for active engineers.

user192837 7y ago
Windows became the world's top desktop OS without telemetry. Please stop this "we harvest your data to make our product better for you" excuse because it is offensive for us customers. Don't put it on us users. We did not ask for that. Just say that it's because everyone is doing, or to better profit or whatever unethical reasons you have.
chappi42 7y ago
> I don't think Windows could have stayed in the pre-telemetry engineering world You (Microsoft) shouldn't enforce people to send telemetry. Ask kindly and I suppose you'd get a better response. (VSC is a good example how it could/should be done)
kuzehanka 7y ago
What does telemetry have to do with the windows 10 start menu becoming a container for ads and not trivially removable partnered apps? There's nothing wrong with transparent, privacy-respecting, and configurable telemetry, but what windows 10 does is none of those. Trying to describe it as something that's good for the users comes off a bit disingenuous.
Nextgrid 7y ago
> With the absence of telemetry, how do you know Linux is doing just fine? I look at Linux-focused communities on Reddit, Hacker News, etc (there’s always a good rant about Linux’s shortcomings). But that would, you know, mean you actually need to pay competent people that can understand the discourse and engage with the community, something you guys clearly don’t give a shit about (have you ever seen the Microsoft Support forums? It’s a disaster).

user192837 7y ago

Windows became the world's top desktop OS without telemetry. Please stop this "we harvest your data to make our product better for you" excuse because it is offensive for us customers. Don't put it on us users. We did not ask for that. Just say that it's because everyone is doing, or to better profit or whatever unethical reasons you have.

chappi42 7y ago

> I don't think Windows could have stayed in the pre-telemetry engineering world You (Microsoft) shouldn't enforce people to send telemetry. Ask kindly and I suppose you'd get a better response. (VSC is a good example how it could/should be done)

kuzehanka 7y ago

What does telemetry have to do with the windows 10 start menu becoming a container for ads and not trivially removable partnered apps? There's nothing wrong with transparent, privacy-respecting, and configurable telemetry, but what windows 10 does is none of those. Trying to describe it as something that's good for the users comes off a bit disingenuous.

Nextgrid 7y ago

> With the absence of telemetry, how do you know Linux is doing just fine? I look at Linux-focused communities on Reddit, Hacker News, etc (there’s always a good rant about Linux’s shortcomings). But that would, you know, mean you actually need to pay competent people that can understand the discourse and engage with the community, something you guys clearly don’t give a shit about (have you ever seen the Microsoft Support forums? It’s a disaster).