4 ms·

And IE6 was similarly tons better the Netscape Navigator. It had XmlHttp, inventing Ajax, which revolutionised the web. Easy to forget that now. Also, did you

And IE6 was similarly tons better the Netscape Navigator. It had XmlHttp, inventing Ajax, which revolutionised the web. Easy to forget that now. Also, did you know IE6 pioneered the browser web dev tools? IE6 was the first browser you could debug your JavaScript, css and html, which was copied by firebug about 12 months later. I can't even remember what it was called now, IE Dev toolbox? Something strange, you had to download it separately. And Firebug and Chrome Dev tools copied it almost verbatim. I've never seen any sort of acknowledgement of just how much the community owes to that early tool. The announcement blogs about it were still accessible a few years ago.

amiga-workbench 8y ago
It was the Developer Toolbar, I've got a pet project that I'm making compatible with IE5 and its challenging to work without it.
- yellowapple 8y ago
  What kind of project in this day and age would require IE5 compatibility?
  - amiga-workbench 8y ago
    Its not a commercial project, just an alternate (lightweight) front end for a forum and I wanted to prove to myself that old versions of IE weren't as bad to develop for as I remember. The truth ended up being somewhere in the middle, I was reminded of rendering errors that I had long forgotten, but all in all it wasn't as bad as I thought it would be. It helps that I'm just building a website in the classic sense, not a blob of JavaScript that happens to puke out HTML, and when I run into something that's awkward to implement I can just adjust the design to work with what I have. I realise that's not something a lot of people in a commercial job would have had the luxury of doing.
    - yellowapple 8y ago
      Neat! I don't know if I'd ever want to target IE at all (I'd prefer to pretend it doesn't exist), but I do like to test stuff on niche browsers (NetSurf, Dillo, lynx/links/w3m) and see how usable the site is.
forgotmypw3 8y ago
IE6 also had the first reasonably performant CSS/DOM implementation that was not just bolted on... Unless Opera 3.x came before?
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- mattmanser 8y ago
  I made a pivot table implementation in IE6 that used XSLT transforms. It was actually blazing quick, far, far faster than the JS implementation I tried (like instant vs 20 seconds). While XSLT was hard to develop in and perhaps deserves to die its death, it really was a quite amazing bit of tech.
TheKarateKid 8y ago
I'm pretty sure Netscape Navigator had a Javascript debugger built-in back in v3.0, which was way before IE6.
- mattmanser 8y ago
  You're right, looks like it did have an installable debugger way back when: http://www.rdwarf.com/users/wwonko/jscript/jsd.pdf http://www.rdwarf.com/users/wwonko/jscript/jsd.pdf Although the Developer Toolbar had dom explorer and all that jazz, way more than a console, it really was amazing when I first used it. Here's the release blogs: https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/ie/2005/09/16/developer-toolbar-for-ie-announced-at-pdc/ https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/ie/2005/09/16/developer-too... https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/ie/2007/05/10/internet-explorer-developer-toolbar-get-it-now/ https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/ie/2007/05/10/internet-expl...
umvi 8y ago
Easy to forget because I was in elementary school when Netscape Navigator was a thing

amiga-workbench 8y ago

It was the Developer Toolbar, I've got a pet project that I'm making compatible with IE5 and its challenging to work without it.

yellowapple 8y ago
What kind of project in this day and age would require IE5 compatibility?
- amiga-workbench 8y ago
  Its not a commercial project, just an alternate (lightweight) front end for a forum and I wanted to prove to myself that old versions of IE weren't as bad to develop for as I remember. The truth ended up being somewhere in the middle, I was reminded of rendering errors that I had long forgotten, but all in all it wasn't as bad as I thought it would be. It helps that I'm just building a website in the classic sense, not a blob of JavaScript that happens to puke out HTML, and when I run into something that's awkward to implement I can just adjust the design to work with what I have. I realise that's not something a lot of people in a commercial job would have had the luxury of doing.
  - yellowapple 8y ago
    Neat! I don't know if I'd ever want to target IE at all (I'd prefer to pretend it doesn't exist), but I do like to test stuff on niche browsers (NetSurf, Dillo, lynx/links/w3m) and see how usable the site is.

forgotmypw3 8y ago

IE6 also had the first reasonably performant CSS/DOM implementation that was not just bolted on... Unless Opera 3.x came before?

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
mattmanser 8y ago
I made a pivot table implementation in IE6 that used XSLT transforms. It was actually blazing quick, far, far faster than the JS implementation I tried (like instant vs 20 seconds). While XSLT was hard to develop in and perhaps deserves to die its death, it really was a quite amazing bit of tech.

TheKarateKid 8y ago

I'm pretty sure Netscape Navigator had a Javascript debugger built-in back in v3.0, which was way before IE6.

mattmanser 8y ago
You're right, looks like it did have an installable debugger way back when: http://www.rdwarf.com/users/wwonko/jscript/jsd.pdf http://www.rdwarf.com/users/wwonko/jscript/jsd.pdf Although the Developer Toolbar had dom explorer and all that jazz, way more than a console, it really was amazing when I first used it. Here's the release blogs: https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/ie/2005/09/16/developer-toolbar-for-ie-announced-at-pdc/ https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/ie/2005/09/16/developer-too... https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/ie/2007/05/10/internet-explorer-developer-toolbar-get-it-now/ https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/ie/2007/05/10/internet-expl...

umvi 8y ago

Easy to forget because I was in elementary school when Netscape Navigator was a thing