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My constitutional knowledge on the German constitution is a bit rusty, but I guess you hit the nail on the head when you say: 'Naturally, the allies had to agre

My constitutional knowledge on the German constitution is a bit rusty, but I guess you hit the nail on the head when you say: 'Naturally, the allies had to agree'. The Allies were the ones that required these conferences and approved of the Germans that went there. I guess the English and the French had some say, but really the big dog of the allies was the US. So I stand by my statement.

mafribe 7y ago
I'd be interested to learn which part of the german constitution was "essentially written by the americans". Can you give an example? Just one? Please don't forget that (1) the allies had really diametrically opposed goals -- France had to be coerced by the UK and the US to agree to the draft constiution. Moreover, (2) the allies tried hard to avoid the impression that they were forcing anything on the german drafters. Only the date for the drafting conference was an allied constraint: 1. September 1948. The allies wanted to West-German population to accept the constitution, remember the cold was was hotting up at the time, and Soviet union was good at exploiting discontent. approved of the Germans that went there Is that even true? Was there an official approval process? Have you got a reference for this claim?
azernik 7y ago
No, they did not; the conferences were attended by the governments of the German states, who had passed through the de-Nazification filter but were otherwise selected by purely German political processes. When it came to the content of the constitution, the Allies' conditions were clear and pretty general - it had to be democratic, and it had to be federal. (The latter was distinguished from the Weimar constitution only in that the Allies insisted on general size parity between states.) Plus complying with occupation policy on control of heavy industry. See https://de.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frankfurter_Dokumente https://de.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frankfurter_Dokumente The main principles of the constitution itself were assembled by German elected governments of the states (https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Verfassungskonvent_auf_Herrenchiemsee#Ergebnisse https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Verfassungskonvent_auf_Herrenc...), and were very much direct responses to the process of the Nazi takeover in 1933.
yarrel 7y ago
In Soviet Russia, England, France and America ally with you!
- sctb 7y ago
  Could you please just post thoughtfully and informatively? https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

mafribe 7y ago

I'd be interested to learn which part of the german constitution was "essentially written by the americans". Can you give an example? Just one? Please don't forget that (1) the allies had really diametrically opposed goals -- France had to be coerced by the UK and the US to agree to the draft constiution. Moreover, (2) the allies tried hard to avoid the impression that they were forcing anything on the german drafters. Only the date for the drafting conference was an allied constraint: 1. September 1948. The allies wanted to West-German population to accept the constitution, remember the cold was was hotting up at the time, and Soviet union was good at exploiting discontent. approved of the Germans that went there Is that even true? Was there an official approval process? Have you got a reference for this claim?

azernik 7y ago

No, they did not; the conferences were attended by the governments of the German states, who had passed through the de-Nazification filter but were otherwise selected by purely German political processes. When it came to the content of the constitution, the Allies' conditions were clear and pretty general - it had to be democratic, and it had to be federal. (The latter was distinguished from the Weimar constitution only in that the Allies insisted on general size parity between states.) Plus complying with occupation policy on control of heavy industry. See https://de.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frankfurter_Dokumente https://de.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frankfurter_Dokumente The main principles of the constitution itself were assembled by German elected governments of the states (https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Verfassungskonvent_auf_Herrenchiemsee#Ergebnisse https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Verfassungskonvent_auf_Herrenc...), and were very much direct responses to the process of the Nazi takeover in 1933.

yarrel 7y ago

In Soviet Russia, England, France and America ally with you!

sctb 7y ago
Could you please just post thoughtfully and informatively? https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html